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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 2:32:11 PM   
kitkat105


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Status: offline 		Banging their head on something, as suggested by stef sounds good to me.

However, the amount of douchecanoes who post here, continually thwart the validity of evolution.

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 2:32:55 PM   
pyschosubmission


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Do not tell DinoJesu! The Velocirapture is at hand, wouldn't want to rush things!!




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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 2:35:57 PM   
LadyHibiscus


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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 2:42:45 PM   
JanahX


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Joined: 8/21/2010
Status: offline 		Oside - tell your friend to go trip out on the "Big Five" - in being the Five major extinctions the earth has experienced.

Also tell her about the time the entire earth was covered in Ice for over a million years (snowball earth) - not once, but three times. She'll of course call you a liar - because without a doubt that would of killed Adam and Eve.

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 2:48:58 PM   
LanaDeVille


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SpaceSpank

Therein lies the issue.

We are not directly referencing creationism. We're talking about creationists.

Which are a subset of Christians that do, by definition, believe the world to be very much younger that just about any scientific or empirical evidence would suggest.


Ah. I see. That makes more sense.
Edit: I thought that the label of "creationists" applied to all people who believed in creationism to some degree. In fact...now I'm a bit confused on what to call people who believe in creationism, but aren't "creationist" as you define it, because I know there's variation.



< Message edited by LanaDeVille -- 8/13/2012 2:59:57 PM >

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:05:39 PM   
RemoteUser


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

Seriously.....I just had a conversation with someone that thinks that dinosaurs are fake and were planted by atheists.


Dinosaurs are too cool to be fake. That and, you know...science.


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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:09:32 PM   
LanaDeVille


Posts: 209
Status: offline 		SpaceSpunk:

This link here discusses the different forms of creationism, but seems to refer to all people who believe in creationism as "creationists". The ones you speak of, who believe that the earth was created only thousands of year ago, appear to be called "Young Earth Creationists". This variety appears to be the type that most people seem to be talking about when they say "creationists". Edit: Even though I've always referred to anyone who believes in creation as a creationist.

Despite many people's tendency to think of all creationists in one group and all evolutionists in another, "creationism" refers to a wide range of beliefs. This article gives a brief introduction to creationist positions. It tries to cover the breadth of creationist beliefs (and a little of the variety of evolutionist belief), but it gives little depth. In addition to the positions, it lists some influential people, organizations, books, and periodicals which espouse the positions. Interested readers may look up these references.

Young Earth Creationists (YEC) claim a literal interpretation of the Bible as a basis for their beliefs. They believe that the earth is 6000 to 10,000 years old, that all life was created in six literal days, that death and decay came as a result of Adam & Eve's Fall, and that geology must be interpreted in terms of Noah's Flood. However, they accept a spherical earth and heliocentric solar system. Young-Earth Creationists popularized the modern movement of scientific creationism by taking the ideas of George McCready Price, a Seventh Day Adventist, and publishing them in The Genesis Flood (Whitcomb & Morris 1961). YEC is probably the most influential brand of creationism today.

< Message edited by LanaDeVille -- 8/13/2012 3:15:08 PM >

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:12:54 PM   
LadyConstanze


Posts: 9722
Joined: 2/18/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LanaDeVille

quote:

ORIGINAL: SpaceSpank

Therein lies the issue.

We are not directly referencing creationism. We're talking about creationists.

Which are a subset of Christians that do, by definition, believe the world to be very much younger that just about any scientific or empirical evidence would suggest.


Ah. I see. That makes more sense.
Edit: I thought that the label of "creationists" applied to all people who believed in creationism to some degree. In fact...now I'm a bit confused on what to call people who believe in creationism, but aren't "creationist" as you define it, because I know there's variation.





From my undrstanding there are the creationists who have those ideas about men walking with dinosaurs, then there are people who believe god created everything but since he's sneaky he did the detour through evolution

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:19:10 PM   
LanaDeVille


Posts: 209
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze


quote:

ORIGINAL: LanaDeVille

quote:

ORIGINAL: SpaceSpank

Therein lies the issue.

We are not directly referencing creationism. We're talking about creationists.

Which are a subset of Christians that do, by definition, believe the world to be very much younger that just about any scientific or empirical evidence would suggest.


Ah. I see. That makes more sense.
Edit: I thought that the label of "creationists" applied to all people who believed in creationism to some degree. In fact...now I'm a bit confused on what to call people who believe in creationism, but aren't "creationist" as you define it, because I know there's variation.



From my undrstanding there are the creationists who have those ideas about men walking with dinosaurs, then there are people who believe god created everything but since he's sneaky he did the detour through evolution


That's what I thought too. =P
In fact, I thought that those two were the only types there were until I found that link.

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:21:48 PM   
LadyHibiscus


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Status: offline 		There's nowt as queer as folk.

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:25:59 PM   
ARIES83


Posts: 3648
Status: offline 		And... As the OP suggests there is an occurrence
(in my experience, a common one) of religious people
who can't rationally or logically discuss the discrepancies
between empirical findings religious teachings.
There is a commonly held scientific understanding that
evolution is the origin of species, this does not disprove
the existance of god.
It does question the validity of the bible and the truth
behind claims about adam/eve and the list goes on.

Can anyone who believes man was created rather than
evolved from primates please share how they reconcile
their understanding with the empirical evedance to the
contrary.

-ARIES

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:29:50 PM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		One of my chosen family says, "I travel by faith, not by sight." Logic does not enter their thought process, and their faith tells them they have nothing to reconcile.

Never underestimate the human capacity for cognitive dissonance.

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:57:02 PM   
sunshinemiss


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for

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The feeding costs are killing me.

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 3:59:35 PM   
ARIES83


Posts: 3648
Status: offline 		My favourite dinosaur was velosiraptor
definitely the coolest of them all, and
they can open doors! sceery
I'd like to see T-Rex try and open a door...
wot

-ARIES

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 4:14:41 PM   
LanaDeVille


Posts: 209
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83


quote:

ORIGINAL: LanaDeVille

quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83

quote:

ORIGINAL: LanaDeVille


quote:

ORIGINAL: SpaceSpank

Won't work. There is a fundamental human failure when it comes to certain abstract concepts.
Some people just ascribe to certain beliefs in such an absolute fashion that they are incapable of believing otherwise.

There are some phenomenally well educated and intelligent people that absolutely believe in Creationism. In their mind there is no conflict of information, and no amount of dialog or proof short of literally divine intervention would convince them otherwise.


I actually don't see the conflict between creationism and evolution, at least when it comes to Christianity. I don't see why the world couldn't have evolved after it was made. However, I am not a Christian, so I wouldn't say I was really qualified to say too much about that. I know a few notable stories, and that's it.


The bible contradicts evolution, humans didn't walk
with dinosaurs as far as we can tell by the fossil record
they are hundreds of millions of years seperated.
So the earth seems to be more than 10,000years old.

There are countless number of discrepancies.
You don't see the conflict?

-ARIES



I definitely see a conflict regarding the claims that the world is only 6000 or 7000 year old.

However, I do not see a conflict between believing in creationism and evolution, which is what I stated. You appear to be assuming that everyone who believes in creationism also believes that the world is only 6,000 or 7,000 years old. Not everyone who believes in creationism believes in these numbers.

The bible doesn't give a number. It's pretty silent on how long the Earth or cosmos have been around. Which is why I made my statement in response to SpaceSpunk in order to understand why some Christians would see a conflict.

Edit: From my experience, not all Christians take the bible literally.


And what do you think about the fossil record
telling us that creatures evolve over time from
simpler origins, and man and dinosaur didn't
exist at the same time?


I believe that creatures evolve over time and from simpler origins, and that man and dinos didn't exist at the same time. I'm also not an adherent to Christianity, so I'm kind of confused at what you're trying to say.

< Message edited by LanaDeVille -- 8/13/2012 4:15:29 PM >

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 4:14:52 PM   
littlewonder


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

Seriously.....I just had a conversation with someone that thinks that dinosaurs are fake and were planted by atheists.


Is my dead stepfather haunting you??? He believed that dinosaurs didn't exist and that we never went to the moon.I used to just roll my eyes and call him looney old man.


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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 4:28:39 PM   
OsideGirl


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quote:

ORIGINAL: littlewonder


quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

Seriously.....I just had a conversation with someone that thinks that dinosaurs are fake and were planted by atheists.


Is my dead stepfather haunting you??? He believed that dinosaurs didn't exist and that we never went to the moon.I used to just roll my eyes and call him looney old man.



One of my friends was saying that there's a group that believes the world is flat.


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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 4:30:14 PM   
ARIES83


Posts: 3648
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LanaDeVille

quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83


quote:

ORIGINAL: LanaDeVille

quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83

quote:

ORIGINAL: LanaDeVille


quote:

ORIGINAL: SpaceSpank

Won't work. There is a fundamental human failure when it comes to certain abstract concepts.
Some people just ascribe to certain beliefs in such an absolute fashion that they are incapable of believing otherwise.

There are some phenomenally well educated and intelligent people that absolutely believe in Creationism. In their mind there is no conflict of information, and no amount of dialog or proof short of literally divine intervention would convince them otherwise.


I actually don't see the conflict between creationism and evolution, at least when it comes to Christianity. I don't see why the world couldn't have evolved after it was made. However, I am not a Christian, so I wouldn't say I was really qualified to say too much about that. I know a few notable stories, and that's it.


The bible contradicts evolution, humans didn't walk
with dinosaurs as far as we can tell by the fossil record
they are hundreds of millions of years seperated.
So the earth seems to be more than 10,000years old.

There are countless number of discrepancies.
You don't see the conflict?

-ARIES



I definitely see a conflict regarding the claims that the world is only 6000 or 7000 year old.

However, I do not see a conflict between believing in creationism and evolution, which is what I stated. You appear to be assuming that everyone who believes in creationism also believes that the world is only 6,000 or 7,000 years old. Not everyone who believes in creationism believes in these numbers.

The bible doesn't give a number. It's pretty silent on how long the Earth or cosmos have been around. Which is why I made my statement in response to SpaceSpunk in order to understand why some Christians would see a conflict.

Edit: From my experience, not all Christians take the bible literally.


And what do you think about the fossil record
telling us that creatures evolve over time from
simpler origins, and man and dinosaur didn't
exist at the same time?


I believe that creatures evolve over time and from simpler origins, and that man and dinos didn't exist at the same time. I'm also not an adherent to Christianity, so I'm kind of confused at what you're trying to say.


You said:
"I do not see a conflict between believing in creationism and evolution"
I'm trying to find out how you reconcile the two.
I'm not (and have never been) trying to catch you religious people
in some web of logic, I'm only trying to coax out some straight
forward answers. How do you reconcile scientific conclusions which
you seem to believe with the story of creation?


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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 4:31:13 PM   
TNDommeK


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

What I like about this thread is it showed up in my feed as "I need something to bang".


Ha ha ha. Me too and I thought it was from Lookie,lol.

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RE: I need something to bang my head on.... - 8/13/2012 4:49:35 PM   
LanaDeVille


Posts: 209
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83
You said:
"I do not see a conflict between believing in creationism and evolution"
I'm trying to find out how you reconcile the two.
I'm not (and have never been) trying to catch you religious people
in some web of logic, I'm only trying to coax out some straight
forward answers. How do you reconcile scientific conclusions which
you seem to believe with the story of creation?


There's nothing for me to reconcile. I admitted that I'm not a Christian and that I might not know enough to see a conflict and perhaps that why I see none. I do know, however, that there are Christians who don't see a conflict. If you want "straight forward" answers, ask someone who actually holds the beliefs that you're trying to understand.

There are a few other people who I am pretty sure are Christian who don't dispute current scientific facts in the other thread. If you approach them with an attitude that demonstrates that you just want to learn, I know they'd be willing to discuss that with you. Though I wouldn't imply that they aren't straightforward in an attempt to get your answers from them.

Edit: I follow a religion (though it might be better to say "spiritual practice") that has no timeline and no book. It varies from person to person. So I have no conflict as it applies to my religion. Even though that's not what we're discussing. But that's something that I'm only willing to discuss with people in private.

< Message edited by LanaDeVille -- 8/13/2012 4:56:59 PM >

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