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Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in Ask... - 3/23/2014 6:36:57 PM   
subbibear


Posts: 46
Joined: 3/2/2014
Status: offline 		Recap:

I met an old, 30 years knowing each other, friend here on CM Late last week. I asserted myself and shared with him my desire to explore a D/s relationship with him. We were FWB in the 80's and 90's then went for 14 years without seeing each other. We saw each other at a one day non kink event in 2010 and then did not communicate again until just a few days ago. I was concerned about whether I was being a pushy bottom or an assertive submissive. That discussion, the difference between pushy and assertive related to submissives, continues in Ask A Submissive.

But the issues surrounding the rekindling of our friendship and adding a D/s element to our existing friendship interpersonal dynamic has come up a couple of times now. I don't want that discussion to derail the original thread so I am starting this one.

Issues involved- sometimes in these situations one person falls deeper in love than the other, or one person wants to keep it more of a friendship and that can complicate it. The possibility of destroying our friendship by trying to move into a D/s dynamic. Moving too fast or too slow. Communication?

Current status- We are getting together for the next two days and nights to talk and feel each other out. We just want to catch up with each other but we also want to discuss what each of us thinks and feels about how to move forward from where we stand now. No D/s dynamic exists at this point. He is 100% Dominant. I am 95% submissive. He is 95% top and I am 95% bottom.

We are exploring. All input and questions are welcome and invited.

Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/23/2014 6:56:45 PM   
kalikshama


Posts: 14805
Joined: 8/8/2010
Status: offline
quote:

The possibility of destroying our friendship by trying to move into a D/s dynamic.


You don't actually seem to have a close friendship that you might damage. Sounds like you do have potential for D/s - go for it!

(in reply to subbibear)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/23/2014 6:56:51 PM   
Blonderfluff


Posts: 2253
Joined: 10/9/2013
From: Down the Shore
Status: offline 		I don't really understand what your question is. Can you clarify a bit?
If you are thinking you are in love, and your question is "Am I moving too fast?" Then my answer is yes. You've begun something that could be great. Let it unfold naturally.
I don't think there is anything here that sounds like you are going too slow. It sounds just about right to me, for two people that are re-kindling a friendship.


_____________________________

Don't fear moving forward slowly...fear standing still.



I'm Blonde. Jane Blonde.

(in reply to subbibear)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/23/2014 7:28:18 PM   
MalcolmNathaniel


Posts: 1394
Joined: 9/20/2010
Status: offline 		I'm guessing (based solely on this one post) that you are looking at a situation like this.

I could be wrong. It's happened before.

(in reply to Blonderfluff)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/23/2014 7:40:57 PM   
subbibear


Posts: 46
Joined: 3/2/2014
Status: offline 		Well to fill in some detail. He is an inexperienced Dominant. I am an experienced submissive. I decided, after he discovered me late last week, to send him a detailed message asking him to consider entering discussions regarding us starting up a D/s relationship, perhaps leading to a 24/7 TPE. In that message I went into detail about not only my kinks, but the psychology behind them, giving him a very clear picture not only of my hard limits, but also my soft limits and how to help me push up against them and grow as a submissive. I went into detail about my understanding of submission how it plays out in a relationship with me and in particular about objectification and my views on that being a necessary element in any D/s dynamic for me. I wrote a long letter. After the fact, I posted in Ask A Submissive about the difference between being a pushy bottom vs being an assertive submissive. I got some great feedback there.

But then some posts started addressing the potential pitfalls of my particular situation with this person apart from the discussion of pushy v assertive. So I started this thread to address those posts and discuss those topics. He and I have an existing interpersonal dynamic as equals. In our phone conversations this weekend we have both asserted our desire not to put that at risk should we attempt a D/s dynamic and find it doesn't work. Maybe, and I am typing as I think here, maybe that means we will end up with a D/s relationship that is only in the bedroom? I don't know. I think we both want to keep our options wide open for now. Honestly, I am not sure what my question is exactly either. But I have come to see this online community as a group of people who give some great feedback. So I am moving forward with this hoping to keep getting that feedback as we go. I guess right now, the thing mostly is that I wanted to move this discussion out of that other thread and give it the space it needed of its own. We are getting together within the hour, and we have the next 48 hours free together to just talk and share. I think that is a good first step. I will know more after that.

Please forgive me if this is a bit garbled. I am a bit nervous, anticipating, but feel good about it. And to the powers that be- I hope this is an appropriate place for this discussion.

Thanks.

(in reply to Blonderfluff)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/23/2014 7:47:22 PM   
subbibear


Posts: 46
Joined: 3/2/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MalcolmNathaniel

I'm guessing (based solely on this one post) that you are looking at a situation like this.

I could be wrong. It's happened before.


I am quite willing to believe that is possible. And if it is, it won't be the first time. But I am willing to risk a bit of skin in the game to see if it might be another outcome.

(in reply to MalcolmNathaniel)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/23/2014 9:53:40 PM   
frunandsins


Posts: 81
Joined: 10/7/2012
Status: offline 		Happy for you that you two are taking cautious steps to explore the possibilities. Likely, you two won't have the right answer in the next 48 hrs. Let things develop and be honest with each other, and the best outcome, which may not be the outcome you desire, will emerge.

On a more general note, if he is an inexperienced Dom, it might be better for him to cut his teeth in a few casual D/s relationships first, while maintaining friendship with you, so he can find his own voice and his footing. This might take some pressure off of you in having to lead from the following position. You can help, for instance, by identifying suitable subs for him and clueing him in on what traits to look for, etc. This approach is to help him grow into his own Dom-hood, and then submit to him, which is an alternative to being a sub to him as he grows. Both are viable, I think, but very different dynamics. Just some food for thoughts.

Best of luck. :)

_____________________________

To each, their own kinks, and may they suffer beautifully.

(in reply to subbibear)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/24/2014 8:52:14 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		The same risk applies in a new relationship, that one won't fall in love while the other will.

Personally, I have to start with friendship. If I don't like him as a person, can't respect him or admire him, I'm not going to want him as a friend.

I don't have jackasses as friends. Or lovers for that matter.

But there's a limited amount of time you can spend in bed. You have to be able to do other things together. And those other things require compatibility as much as does the sexual arena.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to frunandsins)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/24/2014 8:54:28 AM   
ExiledTyrant


Posts: 4547
Joined: 12/9/2013
From: Exiled
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MalcolmNathaniel


I could be wrong. It's happened before.


You should validate that with links, cuz I am skeptical at best.

Jus sayin
Exiled

_____________________________

Gnothi Seauton
To lead, first follow: Aurelius, Epictetus, Descartes, Sun Tzu, to name a few.

Semper fidelis (which sometimes feels like a burden)

(in reply to MalcolmNathaniel)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/25/2014 3:23:16 PM   
subbibear


Posts: 46
Joined: 3/2/2014
Status: offline 		Thanks for the input. We had a good two days of hanging out together. Our friendship is clearly intact and really picked up right where we left off with no problems. We share a great deal in terms of cultural touchstones etc. We both agreed we are taking this slowly, as in something on the order of the next year or so while we each continue to work on our own issues and continue re-introducing ourselves. This seems a reasonable window for us to begin exploring the idea of a relationship in the first place, let alone a D/s relationship. So we are clearly on the same page here-- both interested, both patient, both willing to put in some work and take some time.

I talked with him about resources for his process of education and learning about concepts and practices as a Dominant, because me 'training' him to be 'my' Dominant, would only get him so far. It would not leave him in a position to effectively deal with another D/s situation after me should that be the course that is laid out for him. He is already actively pursuing those resources and has starting talking with me about things he is discovering. I find that enthusiasm for outside information, more objective sources and self-starting attitude encouraging.

The long term nature of our knowing each other really helps out here in terms of trust. I know him very well, despite our not being in touch recently, and the past two days only served to confirm that feeling. He felt the same way. He made it clear that he is very aware of his newness to the role, that he specifically would like for me to help him develop as a Dominant whether we move forward together in a D/s dynamic or not, and that he is clearly at a place in his life where he is ready to devote energy and time to learning and growing in the role.

There are some speed bumps for each of use on a personal level. Ones that can only be dealt with over time in the next six months to a year. How we each cope with those issues and how we act as supportive friends and potential partners during these challenges, I think, will be revealing with regard to the suitability we have for the future together.

(in reply to ExiledTyrant)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/25/2014 3:37:35 PM   
MsLadySue


Posts: 2254
Joined: 12/18/2004
Status: offline 		It appears you both have your ducks in a row. Taking things slowly and you assisting your friend to learn is good.

I wish you both the best.

_____________________________

In order for you to insult me, I would first have to value your opinion.
I love it when someone insults me. That means I don't have to be nice anymore.

(in reply to subbibear)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/27/2014 8:02:33 AM   
subbibear


Posts: 46
Joined: 3/2/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MsLadySue

It appears you both have your ducks in a row. Taking things slowly and you assisting your friend to learn is good.

I wish you both the best.


Thank you. We both feel positive about our chances, but we are both being realistic about the challenges we face. I think at the very least we are going to be happily reunited as friends, that much seems certain. I think it will also be a nearly sure thing that we can layer on to that friendship something akin to our previous long term status as friends with benefits, only this time those benefits would be colored with our shared kinks, elements of D/s and BDSM. And I think there is a possibility that we could at some point down the line, well into the future, start to seriously consider establishing a live in situation with a mutually agreed and written out framework of D/s layered on top of a close personal relationship that has grown over the intervening time period.


(in reply to MsLadySue)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/27/2014 8:11:28 PM   
subbibear


Posts: 46
Joined: 3/2/2014
Status: offline 		So we played together. And it went very well. Lots of communication. Plenty of breaks for processing. Good levels of trust on both sides of the slash. Good respect for consent/assent no reason for revocation at all. I was able to give him the chance to stretch his wings a bit and he did so while erring on the side of caution. He had previously considered it inconceivable to flog someone but he found it thrilling and powerful when he got to try it out. So it was a good session for us both. Having a long history as friends gave us an advantage in trust that I would not normally have with someone I had just met.

Now he has become a voracious consumer of all things Domly. I've pointed him to good starting points and he has bought books and been reading resources online. We've been discussing them as he goes through them. It is rather nice to see someone throw themselves into learning so devotedly. Very nice indeed. We are not in a hurry even though we did have a session. We still see a window for comittment being something in the range of close to a year out- much can change in that time.

I am interested in feedback about a sub training a Dominant though. I am thinking that I need to be careful not to train him only to be 'my' Dominant but to help him learn to be a Dominant in general first and 'my' dominant on top of that. Does that make sense to anyone but me?


(in reply to subbibear)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/27/2014 8:55:23 PM   
shiftyw


Posts: 2837
Joined: 6/6/2013
From: The Shire
Status: offline 		My man wasn't really into BDSM when we met.
He is now. Its pretty specific to me though I think, but our situation is monogamous and living together so...I guess I don't really think he'll have a "next" at this point. I did worry a bit about it, to remedy that though- I have really followed HIS interests. If he finds something he wants to try, I'm all about it so long as it isn't a hard limit of mine. While now we've kinda hit our stride...at the beginning I was very conscience of how open I was and communicated with him a lot. I still am those things, but now its more just habit rather than the encouraging he needed at the start.

(in reply to subbibear)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/27/2014 10:05:44 PM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subbibear

I am interested in feedback about a sub training a Dominant though. I am thinking that I need to be careful not to train him only to be 'my' Dominant but to help him learn to be a Dominant in general first and 'my' dominant on top of that. Does that make sense to anyone but me?




You're in a relationship of some sort... People let each other know their preferences. You're letting him know yours in this particular arena as well as others, I'm sure (I like to have a cup of tea at night rather than coffee, for example). If he's being the dom, he's deciding what to do with that info. That's not teaching him to be only "YOUR" dominant. That's sharing who you are. If he is doing all this research, I'm sure he'll find some stuff he wants to try. You'll try it and see where it goes.

Relax already.



_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to subbibear)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/27/2014 10:16:49 PM   
sunshinemiss


Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MalcolmNathaniel

I could be wrong. It's happened before.


Shut the front door.

_____________________________

Yes, I am a wonton hussy... and still sweet as 3.14

(in reply to MalcolmNathaniel)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/28/2014 7:05:10 AM   
subbibear


Posts: 46
Joined: 3/2/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sunshinemiss


quote:

ORIGINAL: subbibear

I am interested in feedback about a sub training a Dominant though. I am thinking that I need to be careful not to train him only to be 'my' Dominant but to help him learn to be a Dominant in general first and 'my' dominant on top of that. Does that make sense to anyone but me?




You're in a relationship of some sort... People let each other know their preferences. You're letting him know yours in this particular arena as well as others, I'm sure (I like to have a cup of tea at night rather than coffee, for example). If he's being the dom, he's deciding what to do with that info. That's not teaching him to be only "YOUR" dominant. That's sharing who you are. If he is doing all this research, I'm sure he'll find some stuff he wants to try. You'll try it and see where it goes.

Relax already.




Breathing. Yes, still breathing. Ok, thanks. Relaxing is a challenge for me as a person with a stress disorder. Normal stresses get out of proportion while things that freak most people out- car wrecks and other emergancies are calm moments for me. I guess I just needed to hear it from someone else. Thanks. Keeping calm, and carrying on.....

(in reply to sunshinemiss)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Me and My Friend (From Pushy vs Assertive Thread in... - 3/28/2014 7:07:27 AM   
subbibear


Posts: 46
Joined: 3/2/2014
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: shiftyw

My man wasn't really into BDSM when we met.
He is now. Its pretty specific to me though I think, but our situation is monogamous and living together so...I guess I don't really think he'll have a "next" at this point. I did worry a bit about it, to remedy that though- I have really followed HIS interests. If he finds something he wants to try, I'm all about it so long as it isn't a hard limit of mine. While now we've kinda hit our stride...at the beginning I was very conscience of how open I was and communicated with him a lot. I still am those things, but now its more just habit rather than the encouraging he needed at the start.


Thank you. I can see some of that coming in the near future. Me stepping back a bit on the control, but not on the communication. And him starting to explore the things he has discovered while still checking in very often, more often than might be necessary later on.


(in reply to shiftyw)
Profile   Post #: 18
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