Sexist?

Sexist? (Full Version)

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MzBerlin -> Sexist? (5/27/2005 11:07:32 PM)
Hey Y'all- I've noticed something on the boards and have sat on it for a while, deciding whether to comment or not. It seems to me that male and female submissives are treated VERY differently when they make a comment about finding a 'true', 'real', or even appropriate partner. Recently a woman put up a post about finding a "real" master in the ask a master section and was given tea and sympathy, while I have seen male submissives (looking for men and women dominant partners) and they are blasted for being whiny or not taking the right approach, or being too demanding. Do YOU think that male and female submissives are treated differently or viewed differently within the community? Do you think this may have something to do with how society views gender role? discuss, discuss As Always- B

BlkTallFullfig -> RE: Sexist? (5/27/2005 11:27:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MzBerlin Do YOU think that male and female submissives are treated differently or viewed differently within the community? Do you think this may have something to do with how society views gender role? As Always- B Yes Berlin, I think they are definitely treated differently on these boards (not sure in life), and I too have noticed we are much nicer giving advice to women (especially submissive women), than we are men... It may be because a lot of so called male subs online apply a more predatory approach when seeking Dom/mes, or it may simply be the idea of protective dominants/daddies' idea of taking care of allegedly soft/subbie girls (most of whom I'm sure kick ass)... Not sure; I'm sleepy, I'll be back.. [8D] M

Lordandmaster -> RE: Sexist? (5/27/2005 11:31:38 PM)
Yes, I think male and female submissive are treated differently on the boards--and I think male and female DOMS are treated differently, too. If a male dom did some of they whining we've seen the dommes do, they'd get ridiculed for about five pages. Generally, I find people flaming males much more often than they flame females--ESPECIALLY males who complain. The whole thing is not really that hard to understand, either. When a female complains, most males think of that as an opportunity to move in and show how sensitive they are. Lam

sub4hire -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 12:25:00 AM)
I have no idea. I notice people but in a different way. I look for consistancy and liars. When I come to that judgement I dismiss the person and everything they have to say from there on out in my mind. Within the real community I don't see much of a difference in how people treat them. I dunno, I treat everyone the same until the same person asks 4 to 5 different times the same advice over and over because they haven't heard what they wanted to yet. Then I sort of lose it.

brightspot -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 1:14:55 AM)
Yes, MzBerlin, I think female subs do get more coddling then male subs, but not that huge a difference, because, I do think on these boards anyone is fair game for "Idiot Whipping". I must say though that as a Lesbian I do feel somewhat isolated and invisable. *Brightspot

ElektraUkM -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 2:17:03 AM)
Yes, I have noticed this too. There are definite differences in how the male subs and female subs are treated, and in how the female doms and male doms act. Lordandmaster already summed up (for me) why male doms treat female subs 'gently' (going in for the perceived opportunity). Perhaps female doms don't feel the need to do that with male subs because, after all, they're two-a-penny (according to what i've read here). ~ Elektra

Manawyddan -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 6:18:24 AM)
Another possibility is simply that, whatever our orientation, a lot of us still have in the back of our minds fairly traditional views of masculinity, in which one is supposed to be strong and 'keep a stiff upper lip' rather than complaining if one has a problem. Women, on the other hand, are expected to discuss their feelings.

Faramir -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 6:23:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Manawyddan Another possibility is simply that, whatever our orientation, a lot of us still have in the back of our minds fairly traditional views of masculinity, in which one is supposed to be strong and 'keep a stiff upper lip' rather than complaining if one has a problem. Women, on the other hand, are expected to discuss their feelings. I think that's close to home - we have cultural ideas about gender, and they pervade all our interactions, including the BDSM sphere.

LadyAngelika -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 6:27:56 AM)
B - I sort of see it from another perspective. I have noticed that Male Doms coddle more and female Dommes coddle less. I discuss that somewhat in my thread on Pygmalionesque approach to dominance. And since the majority of the people are these boards are primarily engaged in heterosexual dynamics, then it comes across as male subs getting less sympathy then female subs. I do not coddle male or female subs (and have had both). I can be very empathetic to people going through a tough time but I have very little tolerance for "poor little me" type whining. I feel that no one can help someone if they aren’t going to help themselves first. - LA

LadyAngelika -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 6:29:56 AM)
quote: Another possibility is simply that, whatever our orientation, a lot of us still have in the back of our minds fairly traditional views of masculinity, in which one is supposed to be strong and 'keep a stiff upper lip' rather than complaining if one has a problem. Women, on the other hand, are expected to discuss their feelings. I actually expect both - being strong and discussing feeling, each when appropriate - from all genders. - LA

EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 8:59:11 AM)
I agree with LA and I have to say I think its in part due to the make-up of the scene as a whole. I'm a female, both female slaves and female dominants don't have to solicit for anything. They WILL have it handed to them on a platter if they just wait. Our problems are more in sorting through the garbage. Males unfortunately are usually in an opposite position- competing for attention. While none of my partners ever "competed" for me, nor would I really want to be with someone who felt they had to, it certainly is a different ball game in terms of getting my attention and taking it to the next step. This unfortunately leads to an entire way of interaction based on gender.

sub4hire -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 10:30:10 AM)
quote: I'm a female, both female slaves and female dominants don't have to solicit for anything. They WILL have it handed to them on a platter if they just wait. Our problems are more in sorting through the garbage. Males unfortunately are usually in an opposite position- competing for attention. The only reason for that is because there are far more male doms than there are good fem doms. If it was a level playing field...enough fem doms to go around the same would ring true for the male subs seeking. The lifestyle as we know it is very young. However, the world as a whole looks to the man to be the dominant factor. It wasn't until the sexual revolution women could stand up and be in power. Another 50 year's it may be a level playing field of the same amount of females to males...subs to doms.

LadyAngelika -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 12:16:00 PM)
quote: The only reason for that is because there are far more male doms than there are good fem doms. Why are you comparing all doms to only the good femme dommes? I would suspect that you don't consider all male doms the same caliber... - LA

Lordandmaster -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 12:32:52 PM)
I was gonna make a comment along the same lines, and then thought better of it...

LadyAngelika -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 12:43:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster I was gonna make a comment along the same lines, and then thought better of it... I'm not trying to be cheeky. I'm simply boggled by the comment and would like a clarification. It might have been a miss-post. In any case, I'm sure Gloria will clarify what she meant. - LA

kc692 -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 3:16:48 PM)
I have read some of the ask a master board, but do not remember seeing female subs post this, so I may be off the mark, but here goes..some of the posts on ask a mistress by male subs have been asked in a courteous way, and I have seen some courteous responses, and suggestions to the sub. The ones that seem to get me to flame though are not the questions, as much as the temperament in which they are asked, and that they are not asked in a courteous non flaming manner and tend to get back what they give....JMO, and since relatively new to the boards, have not seen a long history to compare. It seems that the female subs (in some of the posts that I have read) seem to ask questions in such a way that solicits a helpful answer, even on the ask a mistress boards. I do agree that there are times the answers are given differently, but I think the questions may be posed differently. I'm going to make my signature line, I don't type well, and hate typos!!!!

MzBerlin -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 7:08:11 PM)
Hey! I wanted to thank everyone for weighing in on this. I figured it would create a much bigger flurry, but oh-well. [8\|] I just think that it is interesting, given how 'open minded' we have to be in order to participate in wiitwd, that sexism would still be alive and hopping. It's interesting to think about and observe, nonetheless... B

EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 8:17:45 PM)
Happens all the time, how often do you hear from fem subs how they feel its the natural pace of things for the man to take control, be the breadwinner, pay for dinner, that it's a traditional and appropriate state for fem sub male dom relationships.

Lepidoptera -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 8:46:55 PM)
What I HAVE noticed is that male subs are encouraged to give "tributes" to their Mistresses, or at least financially support them in some way, whereas I have seen people say that male Masters expecting tributes from female submissives is "abusive" and the male Master is supposed to financially support the submissive. There are probably a number reasons for this. Some people have mentioned that male subs are more "predatory"- and it may be that women CAN get "tributes" from them, whereas there seem to be more male Masters than female submissives, and they need to "win" the submissive by giving them gifts or promising support. Then there are the cultural norms- traditionally, men were the bread winners and women took care of housework. Perhaps cultural traditions supercede roles in the D/s lifestyle. And let's not forget that there is STILL a gender wage gap. Women do not earn as much money as men. Perhaps it's acceptable to get gifts from a sub who earns more money than you, but not if they are less well off than you, and male subs just make more money than female subs!

junecleaver -> RE: Sexist? (5/28/2005 8:47:07 PM)
People are just taught to protect women and toughen men up. It has drastically decreased with time, but still it is present.

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