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That's a very interesting way to look at it.

For me, I agree that submission is a personality trait but I also see it as submitting to someone else's will or rules or whatever. I also think it is not easy or necessarily health for someone to be submissive at all time that's why I call submissive time-limited.

I see a slave as more a relationship dynamic. My best slaves were not submissive all the time nor would I want them to be. They knew their duties and they knew when submission to me was required or expected. The rest of the time they were acting in accord to what I wanted or with me in their minds but certainly not submissive to me at that moment. (hope that made sense)

Le me give an example. I went to a private club for a reading and book signing. While I changed my clothes, Fox set things up and was able to tell the host's slave what I'd want to drink and where I'd want to do the reading proper. We didn't discuss it he simply knew it was his job to make this appearance as simple and easy to me as possible. He knew me well enough after seven years and many similar events to make these decisions. I think that when one being submissive that decision making is near impossible.

Again this is entirely how the terms are used in my house. Unless someone asked for my opinion I would not tell someone they are a slave or a sub or a bottom. Ask me, you get my opinion.

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ORIGINAL: Laura
A sub is looking for D/s. A slave is not looking for D/s, instead they want S & M. That's why we have BDSM. To my thinking a sub is into the B and D aspects and a slave is into the S and M aspects.

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ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

I use the terms as follows:

Bottom: physical sensations or activities as the receiver

Sub: submits to the authority of another for a specific amount of time or for a specific set of activities; requires an actual submissive state of mind

Slave: works to make the mundane life of an owner easier for an unspecified or 24/7 period of time; does not require an actual submissive state of mind but does require obedience and putting another person first in their priorities

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ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyo

I agree with you about the need to be assertive and take the initiative at times. It is impossible to function in life if you need direction in every little task. Submissiveness is a personality trait that allows me to derive pleasure in following someone's rules and subjugating myself to their wants, desires, etc. The key word in that statement is someone. I do not submit to anyone or everyone. For me, that distinction is what seperates a slave from a doormat. I have no desire to be an automaton, and I don't understand why anyone would want to be one.

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Do you ever find that difficult to do? Not be submissive more often?

I've found this with several people I've trained and with Fox as well. Sometimes he backslides into that pattern of wanting to please others and do as he is told without thinking as much as I think is healthy for him.

We joked last night when Fox got home from work because the women where he works are being sexist again -- getting him to do all the grunt work when they are frankly capable of doing it themselves. No, they aren't his superiors, he's actually a supervisor there. I commented that they seemed to be acting like wannabe doms but he said "Yeah, with no skills and little positive to feedback".

So why does he do that crap for them? I think it's because it plays into his natural tendancy to serve and please. We both think that becoming a slave actually helped him set up more boundaries with the rest of the world, made him stronger in a lot of ways, but he still falls back into older patterns from time to time.

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ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

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Do you ever find that difficult to do? Not be submissive more often?

I've found this with several people I've trained and with Fox as well. Sometimes he backslides into that pattern of wanting to please others and do as he is told without thinking as much as I think is healthy for him.

We joked last night when Fox got home from work because the women where he works are being sexist again -- getting him to do all the grunt work when they are frankly capable of doing it themselves. No, they aren't his superiors, he's actually a supervisor there. I commented that they seemed to be acting like wannabe doms but he said "Yeah, with no skills and little positive to feedback".

So why does he do that crap for them? I think it's because it plays into his natural tendancy to serve and please. We both think that becoming a slave actually helped him set up more boundaries with the rest of the world, made him stronger in a lot of ways, but he still falls back into older patterns from time to time.

I suppose that is all in how you look at it. One of the things I hated doing the most in school was group assignments. I like to work alone, and I am much more productive that way. For some reason, I always found myself being put in groups with mostly women. I usually ended up doing most of the work, and they were more than happy to let me. I never complained about doing that, because I knew that it would get done accurately and expeditiously. I don't think I was being submissive, because I wasn't doing that to please them or help them. If I really wanted to help them, I would have insisted they contribute and learn. But honestly, all I cared about was getting my grade. The fact that they received credit for my work never bothered me. I don't really need my ego fed with recognition. It was just the path of least resistance for me to do it myself. Anytime there is a task that needs to be done, I will tend to do it myself instead of asking someone else to do it. Again, that is just the path of least resistance for me. I don't like having to rely on others to get tasks completed.

I also will tend to offer my assistance to women with little chores. Whether it is because they ask for help or I just volunteer, I don't automatically think I am being submissive. I just see that as good manners; it's how I was raised. I think a lot of us tend to attach D/s ethics to activities we see in everyday life. I don't think that is a bad thing; it is just something we do.

I will give you an example. About a year ago I was going through a box of my old childhood belongings. I found my old Boy Scout handbook (yes, I was a Boy Scout). I started reading through it and came upon the Scout Law. I remember being required to memorize it and explain it. When I saw that I smiled to myself and looked away from the book to see if I still had it memorized. I did, and I can still recite it from memory. The law says this: A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean, and reverent. It amused me at the time, because I thought about how the word scout could be replaced with the word submissive and still fit perfectly. I had never thought about that before, and it actually made me laugh when I did.

1. Slave - (Definition) A person held in servitude as the chattel of another, one that is completely subservient to a dominating influence. (Opinion) A person without rights or individual authority.
   
2. Submissive - (Definition)  A person that submits, yields oneself to the authority or will of another. (Opinion) Including the definition and expanding; one that does so to make easier the life of their chosen dominant.
   
3. Bottom - Although not requested, I will include this anyway as there always seems to be some contention. Remember, this only my opinion. (Sad I have to preface that.) A person who desires to have physical sensations applied to them. It is not necessary nor is it the norm that they have any submissive tendencies.

My $.02. This and $5 will get you a vente hot chocolate at Starbuck's.

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I think your examples are good examples of being polite or in the student context basically doing what you have to. I too hated group work and when I have to use it in my classes I make sure and spread the work around the members of the group.

I know that Fox feels resentment though towards those women at his work place. I'll point out that he is in higher position and could say "no, too busy right now" simply "that's part of your job, isn't it?".

He still has difficulty saying "no" and it isn't just to women. I do strongly think that is a side effect of his more natural submissive state.

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ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

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I think your examples are good examples of being polite or in the student context basically doing what you have to. I too hated group work and when I have to use it in my classes I make sure and spread the work around the members of the group.

I know that Fox feels resentment though towards those women at his work place. I'll point out that he is in higher position and could say "no, too busy right now" simply "that's part of your job, isn't it?".

He still has difficulty saying "no" and it isn't just to women. I do strongly think that is a side effect of his more natural submissive state.

I don't know your Fox or what kinds of "grunt work" the women at his office are asking him to do. So it's hard for me to offer an alternative. I don't like saying no to people either, and I would have a hard time saying what you told him to say. I don't think you intend it that way, but it sounds cold to me. Of course, those of y'all from the midwest tend to sound cold to me anyway (kidding). I tend to make a joke or a funny comment when I need to say no to someone. It's easier to say no when you can see the person walk away smiling.

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ORIGINAL: curiouscity

i am new to the scene and to collarme and i've been reading through profiles and i have seen a lot of Dommes who say that there is a difference between a sub and a slave.
i am curious to know what that difference is.
Thank You to all the wonderful Dommes who may read/answer this question.

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ORIGINAL: GuidingLite

subs submit to FEMALE RULE every place.

a sub bottom submits only in sexual natured places and most of these posters here are just that even thou they fake it coz they dont like being called a bottom for some lame ass dumb reason, who the hell knows.

get it straight. sub bottoms are different from submissives. theyre easy spotting. they cry about inequality between women and mens in relationships and still call themseleves submissives. watch out for thems kinky wannabe subs faking and fronting the funk. just look out when you hear: "It's about being equal in my relationship waaa waaa waaa" and run the shyt away. aint no sub girl gonna say shyt like that unless she a do me bottom sub.

most of these fake ass subs try in redefine submissive but puleeze , it aint about equality unless its vanillahill lane, maryjane. shyt.

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ORIGINAL: GuidingLite