A world with no sub males

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AAkasha -> A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 12:42:22 PM)
(Actually, there are probably some societies where the idea of male submission is probably extremely in the closet). Imagine if there was not even a market for pro femdoms because men would never go to such a place. Imagine that the only way to get a man to consider the idea of submitting to a woman was behind closed doors and still with a ton of worry that someone may find out. Femdoms, how would we operate in such a society? How would we deal with the anxiety of wondering how to broach the subject with a new partner, and when would it be "safe" to so, and risk having him stop seeing you because he thought you were crazy? I think some of us have dealt with this in a small sense (and ironically, I think male subs deal with this issue in their world all the time). Imagine the balancing act of trying to get a man to allow some experimentation and not be at odds with himself for enjoying it? Do you think we deal with this, or a form of this, even now? Have you ever brought up the idea of BDSM and had a male partner dump you because of it? Akasha

Politesub53 -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 12:44:50 PM)
Nice question Maam [;)]

Lashra -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 1:16:33 PM)
Most likely I would become a lesbian, or I would rather stay alone. I love submales they are just as macho and as outgoing as the alpha males, except they focus on my pleasure rather than their own all the time. If I couldn't have one as I said, I'd look to another woman or just stay alone, alpha males have no appeal to me. I was married to an alpha male so I know what a war it is when two strong headed dominants go at it and there never was a winner. Just a divorce and a child who doesn't really know her father. ~Lashra

littlesarbonn -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 1:30:03 PM)
I think the response are probably going to be from the perspective of women who already have experience of sub males already existing in the world. If such a circumstance were to exist, I honestly believe that what would happen is that women would find themselves forced into either entering relationships of dual equality, or do what I do see a lot, and that's enter in a submissive way, even if it's not in a bdsm context. I know that when I went to Michigan, the women who were interested in dating me were ALL projecting submissiveness as a major part of their personality. Now, there may be dominant ones out there, but for the most part, all I came across were women who wanted to cater to my desires. I see this scenario as increasing this behavior as a survival of the fittest type of atmosphere where women would pretty much have to change dispositions or become so far out of the mainstream that they would become lesbians, as Lashra mentions in her post. But I have a strong feeling that a society that shuns male submissives and causes those male submissives to not enter any such relationship is probably going to make it just as easy for a female to find another female submissive as well, because the only thing I can see that would have substantiated this lack of sub males would be some type of overbearing morality situation that would transcend pretty much everything. So, relying on "other" avenues to pursue what one seeks, would probably be completely shunned and probably less likely to be an alternative. What I actually thought about when this thread was created was, "what about those male submissives who have never lived anything but a life of being submissive?" What would happen to them? I can see some just giving up on relationships completely, giving into the masses and no longer seeking such a submissive relationship, or possibly doing something outrageously stupid and removing oneself completely from any type of future.

OrangeJulius -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 1:31:52 PM)
Sounds like Saudi Arabia.

LadyClaudiaVan -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 2:14:42 PM)
With no males, we would operate with more peace around us and with more civility. The murder and rape statistics would decline.

lhogan -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 2:54:10 PM)
This will be considered by some to be off topic, but I think it would be an even worse scenario for the sub males. It is very difficult for a submissive man to broach bdsm play in a vanilla relationship simply because it is so taboo. Our society expects the male in a relationship to be the more dominant partner, even in a relationship where the two are basically equals. Many see submission as a weakness or a lack of masculinity. Now I am secure enough in myself to know that is not the case, but to the uneducated (on this particular matter), in their mind it is quite often the case.

LadyClaudiaVan -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 3:01:16 PM)
I would venture to say that I agree with you that many see submission as a weakess or lack of masculinity and they fail to see it is the strong, confident Men who admit their place in the world and submit to it.

OrangeJulius -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 3:35:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyClaudiaVan With no males, we would operate with more peace around us and with more civility. The murder and rape statistics would decline. So would birth rates... Also, I think that in a world with only women, it's not that there wouldd be no violence or problems, it's just that the type of violence would change. The stronger people would still lord over the weaker ones, it would just be a more "civilized" form of oppression. Instead of the shackles being around the wrists, they would be in the mind.

Fuzzyboy17 -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 5:20:21 PM)
With no males, you would not exist and the human race would disappear.....

kitriana -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 5:32:05 PM)
that's the vanilla world.. isn't it? many men think about being dominated, but have been brought up to think that that is wrong and not their role in society. i'd deal the same way i do everyday.. its a mind game.. all about manipulation. If you can manipulate a person's mind the right way you can get anyone to do anything.. even something they fear.

Danka1888 -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/19/2007 6:07:58 PM)
Fact. Without males the human race could not go on.

earthycouple -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/20/2007 5:45:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Danka1888 Fact. Without males the human race could not go on. No where does the OP suggest males don't exist. The question is about SUB males. I'd simply dominate women. I'm bi and love women as much as I do men.

MstrssPassion -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/20/2007 6:15:49 AM)
I'm going to address the question that is being overlooked: Have you ever brought up the idea of BDSM and had a male partner dump you because of it? Yes & No Yes I brought it up, No they weren't the one to dump/end the involvement.. I was. Many years ago it was much harder to find like-minded people so often I would not know beforehand if they had any inclination to my interests. (if they were submissive) At some point early on I would broach the subject if they had not shown any indications of interests on their own. But it was not "he" that ended up dumping me as a result. I had one instance that took place many years ago. We were in the early stages of dating. After my bringing up the topic this person snapped into the all to well known arrogant dom syndrome. Their impression was male=dominant, female=submissive & it was a preposterous notion for it to go down any other way. I made a few attempts to express that gender did not dictate this & after a couple of attempts I blew him off. I have spoken of another scenario often where I introduced a man to this but he was vanilla ( I mean look it up in a fetish dictionary & his picture would be next to the entry). Though he tried to wrap his mind around this it was clear it was simply not within him to be any part of any of this regardless of his desire to be pleasing to me as a male partner. Eventually he began to express feelings of inadequacy. That is not a healthy state to exist in & after a long talk I told him I had decided to end the relationship so that he could find a more compatible partner. He is an awesome guy & I know there is a vanilla gal out there that is quite fortunate to have him in her life.

LadyEllen -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/20/2007 6:21:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AAkasha (Actually, there are probably some societies where the idea of male submission is probably extremely in the closet). Imagine if there was not even a market for pro femdoms because men would never go to such a place. Imagine that the only way to get a man to consider the idea of submitting to a woman was behind closed doors and still with a ton of worry that someone may find out. Femdoms, how would we operate in such a society? How would we deal with the anxiety of wondering how to broach the subject with a new partner, and when would it be "safe" to so, and risk having him stop seeing you because he thought you were crazy? I think some of us have dealt with this in a small sense (and ironically, I think male subs deal with this issue in their world all the time). Imagine the balancing act of trying to get a man to allow some experimentation and not be at odds with himself for enjoying it? Do you think we deal with this, or a form of this, even now? Have you ever brought up the idea of BDSM and had a male partner dump you because of it? Akasha Wow. As Politesub remarked "Nice question"! Personally I believe that whatever the background culture, one is going to find that with the multiplicity of human psychologies that develop from the natural construction of the brain and from the environmental experiences of individuals, there are always going to be males who prefer a submissive role, even if due to the background culture perhaps, the expression of that is going to be extremely variable - even US, UK and German bdsm varies in terms of expression. Given that, I think that even with a less permissive societal background, its going to be possible for femdoms to identify their quarry just as much as its going to be possible for the submissive male to identify and seek out strong women likely to fulfil their needs. It would be more difficult of course, but love will find a way and all that. E

nonu -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/20/2007 6:28:27 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AAkasha (Actually, there are probably some societies where the idea of male submission is probably extremely in the closet). Indeed there are, Ma'am. There are many such societies in the world where men are still considered weak, if submissive. But i guess it's only a matter of time before W/we become so engrossed in our own lives that W/we don't really have the time to shun others! quote: ORIGINAL: AAkasha Femdoms, how would we operate in such a society? How would we deal with the anxiety of wondering how to broach the subject with a new partner, and when would it be "safe" to so, and risk having him stop seeing you because he thought you were crazy? I think some of us have dealt with this in a small sense (and ironically, I think male subs deal with this issue in their world all the time). Imagine the balancing act of trying to get a man to allow some experimentation and not be at odds with himself for enjoying it? Do you think we deal with this, or a form of this, even now? Akasha It is interesting to note that these questions come from a Femdom, for as you have rightly pointed out, submissive men often go through similar anxiety, if not more. Dominant and submissive desires are independent of boundaries - geographical, political, religious, economical etc. But it is the culture in a particular society that determines how convenient or inconvenient it would be, for people to express such desires to their partners. A Femdom in your society, for example, may be more at ease with expressing her power and authority over the men in her life, as compared to one from India. In fact, i have myself come across Femdoms in India who think it is "weird" that they feel this way about men. Femdoms in "traditional" and "conservative" societies would no doubt find it more of a challenge than a privilege, to approach a male partner with the idea of incorporating BDSM into their life. So, i guess such anxiety is experienced by Femdoms everywhere, depending on how aware the male is, of the existence of such desires in a woman. quote: ORIGINAL: AAkasha Have you ever brought up the idea of BDSM and had a male partner dump you because of it? There are in fact clubs within India, that cater exclusively to men who have been abused by their wives. These clubs enroll men who have been "victims" of physical, emotional or mental "abuse" by their wives. In another society, the same acts might have been viewed from a different, and more respectful perspective. So yes, there are a number of such cases that keep coming up from time to time, where men wish to cut off all ties with women who have a tendency to get "violent". In response to the topic: A world with no sub males would be incomplete, i guess. Like they say, it takes all kinds. A Femdom is a "dom" because she is able to express this aspect of her nature to her submissives, without whom it would probably remain a "weird" fantasy throughout her life! It would be exactly the same way that a submissive male would feel in a world without Femdoms. Hope this never happens though! My apologies to Ms. Akasha for having responded to this thread, inspite of it having clearly been addressed to Femdoms. I only felt that i had something to contribute, without really ruining the purpose of the thread! (Although i do wonder why some people are misreading the topic as "a world with no males")

addicted2it -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/20/2007 11:44:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AAkasha (Actually, there are probably some societies where the idea of male submission is probably extremely in the closet). Imagine if there was not even a market for pro femdoms because men would never go to such a place. Imagine that the only way to get a man to consider the idea of submitting to a woman was behind closed doors and still with a ton of worry that someone may find out. Femdoms, how would we operate in such a society? How would we deal with the anxiety of wondering how to broach the subject with a new partner, and when would it be "safe" to so, and risk having him stop seeing you because he thought you were crazy? How about going back to the 1950s or 1960s? It was probably no different then here in the USA, when the only outlet for this need was pornograpy, and that type of material was pretty hard to find. Some married couples may have practiced D/S in one form or another, but behind closed doors. And, by the way, who said that you won't encounter people today who think this behavior is crazy? ;-) ____________ Edited because I can!

thetammyjo -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/20/2007 1:09:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: OrangeJulius quote: ORIGINAL: LadyClaudiaVan With no males, we would operate with more peace around us and with more civility. The murder and rape statistics would decline. So would birth rates... Also, I think that in a world with only women, it's not that there wouldd be no violence or problems, it's just that the type of violence would change. The stronger people would still lord over the weaker ones, it would just be a more "civilized" form of oppression. Instead of the shackles being around the wrists, they would be in the mind. I agree. I think it is a stereotype that women are somehow nicer or kinder than men. It ignores the reality of males and females as full human beings with a full range of motives and behaviors.

thetammyjo -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/20/2007 1:10:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyClaudiaVan With no males, we would operate with more peace around us and with more civility. The murder and rape statistics would decline. Of course this isn't what the OP is asking about at all. She said no submissive men who were wiling to act on their desires. I would say we live in such a world now to a great degree.

littlesarbonn -> RE: A world with no sub males (6/20/2007 1:37:07 PM)
You know, I was just thinking about this, and if I become the ONLY one to buck the trend, that might mean that it's just ME and a world full of dominant women. I'm liking this scenario more and more already.

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