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RE: Website critique please. - 6/11/2005 6:17:35 PM   
GoddessDustyGold


Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin

No, the majority of it I did in Frontpage. Now all the tedious stuff I have to do in notepad. It is going to take some work.


Well, hells bells! If you're doing it in Frontpage then you can put the links in a new window with that program. It will some time because you do have a lot of links, but at least you don't have to go into the html page and do it manually! If you're not sure how, just email Me on the other side, or I can take you through it on phone! No need for notepad on that change.

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
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Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
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(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Website critique please. - 6/11/2005 6:38:37 PM   
Raphael


Posts: 263
Joined: 5/10/2005
Status: offline
I wrote you a bit on the subject, and tried to send it, but wound up sending you several duplicate messages with only the initial greeting. Collarme private message function just doesn't seem to handle it. I was thinking I might have to get an email from you, but I just tested and it looks like I *can* post it here without garbling, so I'm just pasting it below.

Hey,

Regarding your website, the 'official' formal validator is at
http://validator.w3.org/

Entering the URL for the main page you'll see that it first complains that there is no character encoding specified, falls back to assuming UTF-8, and then stops completely when it runs into a character that makes no sense in UTF-8. This is simple to fix. I believe your character encoding is ISO-8859-1 (Latin1 or Western European, the most common way to encode English text although UTF-8 is now preferred.) At least, the page displays fine for me with that encoding, and specifying it to the validator manually gets us past that and on to the code without any spurious errors.

The tag

<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1" >

should clear that up. It goes inside the <head> tag.

The next error once that is fixed is a lack of document type declaration. The validator falls back to HTML 4.01 transitional, which looks like a good fit with what you wrote, but to be formally correct you should still go ahead and declare it. The tag to do this is

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">

This should be the very first line of the file.

Those are pretty much "formal" errors, not too likely to actually cause a visitor problems, but they can be quickly fixed and it helps you as the developer, to be explicit about what you are doing, and so that validation tools know what to look for.

Next error is "Line 20, column 85: required attribute "ALT" not specified". In this case, looking at it with a text mode browser and a speaker (basically like a blind person would 'see' it) I find it only mildly annoying, not a major issue but it's there. The fix is simple. This is the image tag for your main logo, just add alt=" " (that's a space.) So the entire tag would now read so:

<td valign="middle" width="160"><img
src="http://www.northernprotocol.com/images/mainlogo.jpg" width="125" height="80" alt=" " ></td>

This let's the browser know that if it cannot render the image, it can simply render a space and let it go.

The next three errors are no such attribute errors - background and height are not, strictly speaking, legal attributes to use in the context you used them. Nonetheless, browsers usually allow them there, and I wouldn't worry about it too much at this point. A browser that doesn't understand them should simply ignore them, so it shouldn't be a big deal. I'd put them on the 'fix this when I'm bored list' - I like to make my pages completely correct, of course, but I don't see how those three would cause any real-world problems.

The last error on that page is another missing alt attribute. This is on the tag for 'main.jpg' and again, looking at it as if I were blind, I find it mildly annoying. (You cannot guarantee what the user-agent is going to do when it sees that, in my setup it reads out the filename, which breaks up the flow of the website a bit, and doesn't sound very smooth or professional, but it doesn't really hinder me functionally.) The fix I would recommend is the same as for mainlogo above, simply add alt=" " and the error goes away, and the reader doesn't waste time rendering it anymore.

I haven't gone through your other pages, but I'd guess that most of the errors are the same stuff. Add the doctype declaration to each, specify the content encoding, and then the validator should quit barfing and give you a list of errors. On each missing alt, just think to yourself, how do I want a reader that can't do pictures to render this? If you just want it to skip over it, use alt=" " - if they need to be rendered, of course, you'll have to think of something else.

Looking at the camera page, for instance, I see you already do have alts on the company logos - creative, d-link, epson, etc. You might want to extend the <a href> tags to include the graphics however - when I cycle through the links on this page I just get 'more information, more information, more information' - forcing me to read through the page again, and stop at just the right point to find the link I want. This is very annoying. Extending the anchor tags to include the logos (with their alt texts) would make it a lot friendlier.

Well, as I said, I didn't spider and validate the whole site or anything, but looking around for a few minutes it looks like the errors are relatively minor stuff that should be pretty easy to fix. Use the validator on each page, and if you see anything you don't understand just mail me and I'll be happy to help.

-RaphaEl

(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Website critique please. - 6/11/2005 7:09:10 PM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
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We've started using NVU for a lot of our work, it's very easy to use, is free and publishes quickly. There are a few bugs but the message forums have answered all our questions so far. Here's their homepage:
NVU

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proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Website critique please. - 6/13/2005 5:12:21 PM   
SirKenin


Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
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Ok, I made some more changes and fixed a zillion broken links in the products because they all changed their damn pages around. I did not bother with the ALT tags because I hate them Myself when My cursor goes over anything that makes one of those stupid things popup. They drive Me crazy. lol

Other than that, though, I will have to go through all the messages in My box and on here to make sure I did not miss anything, then I can pretty much call it a day.

Oh, that NVU is awesome. I love that program. Thank you very much for bringing it to My attention. It looks way better than Frontpage is and it is a freebie to boot. Nice.

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Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to proudsub)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Website critique please. - 6/13/2005 8:34:01 PM   
proudsub


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From: Washington
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quote:

Oh, that NVU is awesome. I love that program. Thank you very much for bringing it to My attention. It looks way better than Frontpage is and it is a freebie to boot. Nice.


Let me know if you have trouble with anything on NVU. There are some simple solutions that aren't very obvious for some things.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Website critique please. - 6/13/2005 8:53:55 PM   
suberic


Posts: 175
Joined: 1/9/2005
From: Nashville TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SirKenin


quote:

ORIGINAL: perverseangelic

How does it work with non-sighted reading programs? IE ones that read webpages verbally for the non-sighted.

How does it work in browsers that do not display graphic?


I do not know. I have no way of finding out. My client base all has either IE, Netscape or Mozilla according to My logs, so I should be ok in that regard.



Yes, you do. Download Lynx text browser, and that will show you how it renders with JUST text and/or the opticon readers.

I have a few minor criticisms.

The picture of the owner, ditch the car. It makes you look like a self help guru showing off how successful you too can be by using your system.... I would suggest going to Glamor Shots and getting a head shot, and replacing it with that if you really want a pic of the president.

On the Contact Page, put the format you want the phone number in in parenthasees (sp). Then ditch the "1" on YOUR phone number. Everyone knows you punch a "1" to make a long distance call. If someone is calling from Canada, however, they punch a different number to get an American number. It's slightly (and I stress slightly) condescending, saying that your clients are too stupid to know how to put through a long distance call. And if they are, do you want them as clients?

On your Services Page, if you are going to do drop caps, instead of doing JUST the "W", do the who "We". It looks visually better. If it were a longer word like "Worldwide" then doing only the W would be appropriate.

In the "service" subsection, you have three pages under that section, but they are only linked from the first page. You ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO HAVE a navigation section for that subsection on EACH page. Sorry, but ease of navigation is one of my personal piss off buttons.

Mistress is calling, so I don't have time to keep looking. Good luck.

(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Website critique please. - 6/13/2005 11:55:02 PM   
SirKenin


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Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
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Guys, I really need Y/your help once again. Something screwed up My site and inserted centering tags and stuff in there that I did not put in there. I have no idea where they came from. Now My cell padding will not work. I can do cell padding if I define it for the whole table, but not for individual cells. It simply will not show up. I have gone over the code several times and for the life of Me I can not see what is wrong. Can someone please help Me figure out why My style:padding="xx" does not work anymore?

Thanks.

Btw, suberic, I am working on it, but as you can see I got majorly sidetracked with these problems.

_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

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Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Website critique please. - 6/14/2005 7:51:03 PM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
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quote:

My site and inserted centering tags and stuff in there that I did not put in there.


Looks like you got it fixed. I think the site is looking very good.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Website critique please. - 6/14/2005 9:35:18 PM   
SirKenin


Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: proudsub

quote:

My site and inserted centering tags and stuff in there that I did not put in there.


Looks like you got it fixed. I think the site is looking very good.


Thank you very much. I got the centering all fixed (finally), but I cannot resolve the issue of the global attribute. I can not set padding for individual cells anymore which is incredibly irritating. I like how the site as a whole looks now, thanks to all the input. Now I have to look into changing that pic of Me in there.

_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to proudsub)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Website critique please. - 6/14/2005 11:27:27 PM   
gretchen


Posts: 121
Joined: 3/8/2005
From: Santiago, Chile
Status: offline
I'm studing Graphic design. Maybe you would like a few thoughts on your web site design.

It all depends in the kind of people you want to catch with it. And if your web site has advertising purposes, or functional purposes. It seems yours is both things, and you are trying to reach different kinds of people (business and home).

It's a very clean and clear site. Has a simple hierarchy, wich is great for both people (specially business people: don't have time for flash macromedia effects intros). So keep that.

Now, for the regular costumer, it might seem a little plain:

- The upper side should get some work done. This is what costumers see first and is always a first impression. It's quite unlikely in this days, to put your company's info in the upper part (it's more subtle to put it down with the copy right; it seems like it is struggling with your logotype and your slogan; your logotype and slogan should be protagonists in every graphic work you do..that's very important, because this way people remembers your company's name and image). Also, try to improve the logotype and the slogan...the typographys are completly unrelated, and makes it a little threatening for the eye. I know is really hard to change the corporative image...If this is the official logotype and is already spread everywhere, it's not worth it to make a change. Also, word shadows and other effects are a little out of season now.

- The left side (buttons) has a good typographic work. To use a bold capital letter for quick identification is a good utility. Now, the background faded shape is really out of season too and there's no real use for it. Maybe some other type of background to help the costumers identify every link would be better (people love buttons and click stuffs for some reason).

- Check your pictures again. I noticed that some of them are quite bad quality.
Maybe showing only parts of your products is a good resource for your HOME page, because, the first thing that hits the human eye are the images, not the text (there's tons of subs/slaves on this website complaining about Dom/Masters not reading the profiles,where is written that they're collared, taken and branded. The mayor cause of it is: the profile picture is three times more appealing then a twenty pages description...is a human impulse) and in your HOME page there's no images to show people that your site is all about product. Show a little product. seduce the costumer with images. Don't use a full body picture...wake up the costumer's curiousity. And for your actual catalogue, show the whole product...that's also very important...at this point they want the details.

- And the last thing...the navigation. Navigators prefer to click to different pages. Don't make them roll up and down. Split the information (in pages) instead of putting it in one single and long page.


Well...It's my humble critique for now. I hope It helps.

< Message edited by gretchen -- 6/14/2005 11:34:58 PM >

(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Website critique please. - 6/15/2005 5:47:59 PM   
knees2you


Posts: 2336
Joined: 3/15/2004
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Not bad is it Your first time??

Sincerely, Ant

(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Website critique please. - 6/21/2005 10:26:08 AM   
SirKenin


Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: knees2you

Not bad is it Your first time??

Sincerely, Ant


Thanks No, I have made a few other ones, one of them quite successful about five years ago.

Anyways, I am here to report that all the hard work seems to have paid off. I am on the first page under My chosen keywords in Google. Even typing in My company name takes Me past all the rest of them to position number two and three. I am VERY pleased with the results.

Thank you everyone for all Y/your help. Now W/we need to find out what kind of leads it generates, although business in general seems to be picking up.

_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to knees2you)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Website critique please. - 6/21/2005 8:17:29 PM   
proudsub


Posts: 6142
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Washington
Status: offline
quote:

Now W/we need to find out what kind of leads it generates, although business in general seems to be picking up.


If you really want to know if anyone is going there you can put a counter on it. We did that on the golf site we designed and were amazed at the number of hit it gets.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan


(in reply to SirKenin)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Website critique please. - 6/22/2005 7:38:43 AM   
SirKenin


Posts: 2994
Joined: 10/31/2004
From: Barrie, ON Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: proudsub

quote:

Now W/we need to find out what kind of leads it generates, although business in general seems to be picking up.


If you really want to know if anyone is going there you can put a counter on it. We did that on the golf site we designed and were amazed at the number of hit it gets.


Fortunately the website has a hidden statistics generator. It is not the best, but it does a reasonably good job. I use a site counter on My community webpage and it works rather well for Me (http://www.sitemeter.com)



_____________________________

Hi. I don't care. Thanks.

Wicca: Pretending to be an ancient religion since 1956

Catholic Church: Serving up guilt since 107 AD.

(in reply to proudsub)
Profile   Post #: 34
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