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Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 1:06:33 AM

EvaLass

Posts: 83
Joined: 5/4/2007
Status: offline

From both the Dominant and submissive perspective, I am interested in hearing about experiences with sub drop. I am especially curious to know how many people either have major sub drop or a partner that goes into sub drop within 72 hours after play. For those who have knowledge or suffer from severe sub drop, have you discovered any solutions to minimize the effects? From the Dominant's perspective, do you recognize sub drop even if your submissive does not realize what is happening? If so, do you help her/him cope by providing any specific kinds of support? From the submissive's perspective, how do you get effective support for a depressed mood during sub drop? For those of you in the BDSM closet, do your family members notice a difference in your behavior during sub drop? Finally, has anyone discovered specific physical activities - meditation or exercise for instance - or nutritional support that can help lessen the effects?

I am also wondering a) if anyone has experienced sub drop to the point where you did or said things that did not reflect your usual personality and b) if you have ever felt that sub drop affected your behavior to such a degress that it might endanger your relationship with your Dominant. And, does anyone know of online resources or support groups that help submissives cope with sub drop?

Post #: 1

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 1:14:55 AM

OhToFly

Posts: 21
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline

Wow, you know I had never heard of this before you posted about it. I'm really curious to read peoples responces and more about it in general. Thanks for posting.

(in reply to EvaLass)

Post #: 2

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 1:30:38 AM

MissKyDawn

Posts: 6
Joined: 6/8/2006
Status: offline

I have found several interesting articles on this subject in www.steel-door.com in their chamber archives, this site has given me alot of helpful insight on several different bdsm topics, I hope you all find it as interesting as I have.

(in reply to OhToFly)

Post #: 3

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 2:11:11 AM

LadyHeart

Posts: 561
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline

When we first started to play hard, I experienced a severe physical version of subdrop. I would suffer from uncontrollable shaking, feel really cold, and find great difficulty in warming up, even in a warm room with blankets over me. It was probably akin to some sort of shock reaction. As I got more used to playing, the effects diminished, but one night I thought I was OK, walked past an open door, and the cold draught tipped me over so I nearly fainted on the spot. A friend had a similar reaction, and one night she was driving home from a play session, opened her car window and nearly collapsed. Scary. I'm not so bad now, but since my Master is simultaneously experiencing a Dom high we've had to learn to adjust to each other's patterns.

I am an emotionally resilient person, so I don't get into the emotional lows some subs experience. From observation, people's reaction depends a bit on their natural personality type. If you're usually pretty cheery, sub space isn't usually depressive. But in general I'm a bit more "fragile" than normal for a short time I've after we've played.

From a Dominant's perspective I find that the more attention that is paid to aftercare, the less likely it is that a sub will experience bad drop. Both Master and I give subs a full body massage afterwards, give them sweet warm drinks, wrap them and cosset them, and it's rare to have one go really down.

Hope this helps..

:))
LH

_____________________________

"BDSM is not an excuse for bad manners."

(in reply to MissKyDawn)

Post #: 4

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 4:18:51 AM

Dini

Posts: 44
Joined: 8/26/2006
Status: offline

HI, I have to agree fully with LadyH, While I was still subbing a lot my reactions were basically identical to hers, a kind of a shock reaction, cold, shivering even though I way be curled up under a blanket in a warm room… I found that after a very hard play the best way to get me “down” was to literally allow me to curl up in a fetal position and drift off …dozing for a short while , a hot drink and a chocolate also help to just buffer the shock. What tended to work well was if my Dom/me just sat quietly with me, not doing anything other than laying a hand on me in a reassuring way… within about 30 min I was usually fine and rearing to go. As for the secondary drop, that could come anything from 48 hours to 4 days after the play depending on the intensity of the play and the buildup to the play. With me it was never truly a “depression” but I did sometimes become a bit fragile / irritable.

As a Domme I now feel the drop on a totally different level. I fly for up to a day after a big play and my focus is incredible, I try and spend as much time with my sub as I can till I know that they are ok, with phone calls to follow up if it is not my regular play partner and I am not in a position to physically be with them. I tend to only come down once I know my sub is down and ok…

(in reply to LadyHeart)

Post #: 5

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 6:06:06 AM

Celeste43

Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline

Prevention.

Instead of working to rehydrate afterwards, make sure you are fully hydrated before. Instead of being exhausted afterwards, make sure you get a good night's rest the night before. Pay attention to food, sleep, water, temperature etc beforehand so you don't have to work so hard to reverse effects afterward.

Don't play hard if you then need to drive three hours. Stop early enough to get an hour nap before you leave. Have water right there and take a break after an hour to drink some, go to the bathroom, eat some cut up fruit, power bar etc.

Otherwise, have on hand water, blanket, fruit, chocolate and plan for an easy day following where you can rest as needed.

(in reply to Dini)

Post #: 6

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 6:11:46 AM

shyinini

Posts: 550
Joined: 5/4/2007
Status: offline

http://www.steel-door.com/sub_rebound.htm

http://www.seekers.org.uk/Sub%20Drop.htm

Here are 2 most excellent articles on sub drop

Sir's cumslut

_____________________________

With grace and gratitude, I am owned.
A Man who always seeks to be the best He can be for you
is the only Man truly worthy of being called Sir.

(in reply to Celeste43)

Post #: 7

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 6:41:09 AM

mistoferin

Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline

I think that we are talking about two different things on this thread so far. I don't believe that sub drop is what occurs immediately(or within a couple hours) following a scene. I think that is part of subspace. Sub drop comes later...24 to 72 hours after the scene. I think that many people confuse the two. I tend to have some real issues with sub drop. This is an old thread but it has some really great suggestions that I found to be helpful. I'd also like to note that I have noticed the degree of drop seems to coincide with the intensity level of the scene.

I'm sure LA will come along with more links...there have been some great discussions on sub drop.
http://www.collarchat.com/m_56427/mpage_1/key_remedies/tm.htm

_____________________________

Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to shyinini)

Post #: 8

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 7:04:13 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

Here they are! :)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_743958/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#744221
sub drop please help

http://www.collarchat.com/m_649399/mpage_1/key_subdrop/tm.htm#649697
Coming down from the glorious heights

http://www.collarchat.com/m_522013/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#522021
sub drop, definitions, causes, cures, and prevention

http://www.collarchat.com/m_512884/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#513003
Your insight is needed please

http://www.collarchat.com/m_487853/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#488083
sub drop (2)

http://www.collarchat.com/m_460639/mpage_1/key_subdrop/tm.htm#460834
regaining balance after deep subspace

http://www.collarchat.com/m_202168/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#202459
sub-drop what is it?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_345419/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#345462
highs and lows

http://www.collarchat.com/m_398653/mpage_1/key_sub%252Cdrop/tm.htm#399164
subdrop or what?

Is it drop or am I kidding myself?

Depression after a scene

Sub Drop

Nervous sub seeks reassurance

sleeping...

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to EvaLass)

Post #: 9

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 7:10:55 AM

rascallymisty

Posts: 123
Joined: 8/1/2006
Status: offline

Like Dini my reactions where the same. My ex Master would sit with me till I was my normal self again. My new Master does not allow sub space so I am not sure if my reactions would still be the same.

~misty~

(in reply to Dini)

Post #: 10

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 7:47:16 AM

shyinini

Posts: 550
Joined: 5/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I think that we are talking about two different things on this thread so far. I don't believe that sub drop is what occurs immediately(or within a couple hours) following a scene. I think that is part of subspace. Sub drop comes later...24 to 72 hours after the scene.

When I first experienced sub drop Feb 2004, I thought my insides would collapse on me, I was in a state of severe and acute seperation anxiety. I had milder forms the following 6 months.... but I was learning to cope.

When I met my Sir, there was a period when I began to have sub drop, about a month after we first met (in person). I realized what I was feeling and began to play positive tapes in my head instead of the negative. I spoke to Him of it. I've not had a problem since. I also KNOW for me, having extended phone conversations several times a day, listening to Him (He loves talking history and baseball), laughing at His jokes ..... there is no sub drop symptoms at all.

I think that many people confuse the two.

I tend to agree Mist. I am with my Sir about once a week at His place and when he physically pushes my mind and body, He tells me I disappear into subspace. As I drive home I have the most painful adrenaline rush headache. I need to stop and eat something and drink fluids. That is not subdrop or sub rebound as written of.

When I told my Sir that I tend to get these headaches, He keeps for for looooooooong aftercare. It's my recovery time, well taken care of.

I tend to have some real issues with sub drop. This is an old thread but it has some really great suggestions that I found to be helpful. I'd also like to note that I have noticed the degree of drop seems to coincide with the intensity level of the scene.

Sir's sweetheart cumslut

_____________________________

With grace and gratitude, I am owned.
A Man who always seeks to be the best He can be for you
is the only Man truly worthy of being called Sir.

(in reply to mistoferin)

Post #: 11

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 8:40:15 AM

MasterFireMaam

Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: EvaLass

From both the Dominant and submissive perspective, I am interested in hearing about experiences with sub drop. I am especially curious to know how many people either have major sub drop or a partner that goes into sub drop within 72 hours after play. For those who have knowledge or suffer from severe sub drop, have you discovered any solutions to minimize the effects? From the Dominant's perspective, do you recognize sub drop even if your submissive does not realize what is happening? If so, do you help her/him cope by providing any specific kinds of support? From the submissive's perspective, how do you get effective support for a depressed mood during sub drop? For those of you in the BDSM closet, do your family members notice a difference in your behavior during sub drop? Finally, has anyone discovered specific physical activities - meditation or exercise for instance - or nutritional support that can help lessen the effects?

I am also wondering a) if anyone has experienced sub drop to the point where you did or said things that did not reflect your usual personality and b) if you have ever felt that sub drop affected your behavior to such a degress that it might endanger your relationship with your Dominant. And, does anyone know of online resources or support groups that help submissives cope with sub drop?

Ya know...us Dominant have drop, too. Not many seem to talk about it. I'll comment on BOTH, since they're the same thing, in essence.

When you drop, it's like a mini depression. Thus, you use the same healthy coping techniques you would with a depression....take a hot bath...go for a walk...masturbate...call a friend...etc. etc. Your behavior will be altered if it's usually altered by depression. In my case, I withdraw and sleep. How much I do this depends on how low I've swung.

I doubt you'll find resources about sub drop. Look for resources about depression instead.

Master Fire

_____________________________

The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
-----
Ms Relationship Books
-----
BDSM How-To Books

(in reply to EvaLass)

Post #: 12

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 11:04:34 AM

Celeste43

Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline

I think that what you do beforehand does influence what happens afterward. And what you do immediately afterward can help prevent a really bad drop the day afterward.

We're playing with a host of body and brain chemicals here, folks. If you haven't eaten from that morning and you go most of the night, expect your blood sugar to be a lot lower than if you had a healthy breakfast and lunch and light dinner.

Get tied up with no blood flow and expect to see your body temperature drop along with shivering and other shock type responses.

The worst drops either of us ever had were the times we played most of the night, had only a couple hours sleep, and then started right up again. When we finally stopped to eat some 18 hours after the last meal it was already too late to get either of our blood sugar levels back to normal immediately.

(in reply to MasterFireMaam)

Post #: 13

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 11:17:40 AM

GhitaAmati

Posts: 3263
Joined: 5/30/2007
Status: offline

I wanted to thank you all for opening this thread...and thanks to LA for her never ending links! This is a subject I have been having an issue with in my current relationship, I have been in the lifestyle for almost 10 years, but my husband is only just now getting into it because of me. Sub drop is a topic I was having trouble explaining to him, and he was getting frustrated with my behavior after a scene (both immdietly afterwards and the day after effects). Hopefully letting him read through these links will help.

ghita amati

(in reply to Celeste43)

Post #: 14

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 12:36:14 PM

EvaLass

Posts: 83
Joined: 5/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

http://www.steel-door.com/sub_rebound.htm

http://www.seekers.org.uk/Sub%20Drop.htm

Here are 2 most excellent articles on sub drop

ORIGINAL: shyinini

Thank you very much. I just read the article on the first site, and it is terrific. It helps to explain some very difficult emotions and states of mind that are hard to communicate about. I'm looking forward to reading the other article as well.

(in reply to shyinini)

Post #: 15

RE: Sub Drop: Problems and Solutions - 6/27/2007 2:01:06 PM

gemy

Posts: 107
Joined: 4/6/2006
Status: offline

greetings EvaLass :)

for what it's worth, as so many have already responded, i suffer from sub drop sometimes, and it seems the harder/better the scene, the more intense. i have noticed, the more aftercare, the less i seem to drop. for me, it's crying and shaking, a good hard cry that just wears me out. i then usually try to sleep and i feel better when i wake up. but that usually doesn't happen for a day or two after the scene. almost never (except once) relatively soon thereafter.

what do i do? sometimes i simply to cry and sleep and get past it. other times, i get on IM or on the phone and chat with F/friends about how i'm feeling, getting some compassion or reassurance from those who have felt like me with either sub drop or Top drop. i have not had a time as yet that after the good hard cry and sleep i didn't feel almost normal, then a day later, back to normal.

gemmie

< Message edited by gemy -- 6/27/2007 2:06:01 PM >

(in reply to EvaLass)

Post #: 16

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