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9 volt play - 7/12/2007 12:06:59 AM

HardnRuff

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Has any heard of 9 volt battery play ? Is it safe to just use a battery ? I was told No its not . I Know there is a risk of the battery bursting and getting acid on a sub , Does anyone know anymore reasons why this is safe or not safe ?? Thanks for the input.......

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/12/2007 5:07:29 AM

tag8833

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I have played with 9-volt batteries alot. The main problem with a 9-volt is making contact. If the contact isn't good, then you risk minor electrical burns or no sensation at all. I can't imagine breaking a 9-volt batter accidentally. You could run over one with a car and not break it. I have broken them on purpose to experience battery acid. There is very little inside a 9-volt battery. It is mildly annoying, it might cause skin irritation, or minor burns, but its not going to melt someone's arms.

All of that being said, I would suggest that you find a medical supply store or sports store, and buy a mini-tens unit (maybe called a sports massager). This would come with contact pads, and it would be adjustable. It is completely safe, so I would suggest it as a good starting point for a electric newbie.

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/12/2007 8:23:14 AM

HardnRuff

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Thanks tag...

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/13/2007 7:28:34 PM

submittous

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The problem with using batteries as a direct source in bdsm play is they have no ability to limit current and inherently they have very high current capability. I tend to take electrical play to extremes but only apply direct current (dc) sources directly to a submissive with current limited power supplies. Ten milliamps is more than sufficient to get a good shock and muscle contraction, any more than that in my experience has no value and could do potential harm.

good luck

Bill

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/14/2007 12:54:00 AM

HardnRuff

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How about those electric fly swatters I see People using ?? Are they Safe to play with ?

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/14/2007 4:59:15 AM

tag8833

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HardnRuff

How about those electric fly swatters I see People using ?? Are they Safe to play with ?

yes they are safe, although if you have body hair, they have a tendancey to burn it. The main downside of those things is that they only have one power.

Also, if you are feeling handy, its not hard to turn one of those into something a little bit more handy, like a mini stun-gun. If you want to know exactly how, I can get you instructions.

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/14/2007 8:45:32 AM

HardnRuff

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Thanks tag , that would be awesome , always feeling handy *S*

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/18/2007 7:35:58 PM

Aswad

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quote:

ORIGINAL: submittous

The problem with using batteries as a direct source in bdsm play is they have no ability to limit current and inherently they have very high current capability.

Assuming the usual precautions are observed, "very high" is an exaggeration for a 9V battery. The impedance through flesh is fairly significant. Across skin is even higher. Remember, we're talking about a 9V battery here, which doesn't pack that much voltage, leading to fairly limited current.

The lowest-voltage fatality ever registered, to the best of my knowledge from reading on a DIY electronics forum that deals with AC and DC from 1.2V to 100kV, is that of a regular 12V car battery. In that case, the guy in question had managed to pierce his skin such that the poles were in direct contact with actual tissue, and a 12V battery can deliver up to 500A peak, or 50A continuous, typically.

In general, the rule of thumb for externally applied voltages is to stay below 60V DC, or 25V AC, IIRC.

And the current can be controlled with a 6.2mA constant-current diode, available from radioshack, although that doesn't come anywhere near a medical standard of safety, and one should know what one is doing (electro-fu-wise).

Effectively speaking, though, I'd not play with anything but a certified TENS unit.
Except, that is, local contact on the tongue or (possibly) the vagina.

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/19/2007 10:05:48 AM

Lewcifer

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So much conjecture and speculation... so few facts.

Article on 9 volt batteries.

Even the above article ends with conjecture stated as fact. As an FCC licensed amateur radio operator and first class radio telephone licensee, I can tell you the answer is more complex than just voltage, current and resistance (though some EE's will disagree, until they read My next statement). It also has to do with frequency (CW vs pulsed or modulated) and direction (direct current vs alternating current... not to be confused with pulsed or modulated DC).

In summary, Y/you'd likely have more fun with an e-stim unit (TENS, etc) than a nine volt battery. The battery provides low-current (100 ma) DC (direct current) at a relatively low voltage (9 volts). Skin resistance is usually too high for the effects of this to be felt, unless you apply it to the tongue (in which case the effects of electrolysis will be felt though the taste buds mostly - as taste, not muscle reflex).

By contrast, the e-stim unit (I have this one here) provides higher voltage AC (alternating current) at a safe and low amperage (current) rate. The trick is, it provides this AC in various pulsed or modulated modes, and typically allows Y/you to control the pulse width (or modulation), duration and frequency.

< Message edited by Lewcifer -- 7/19/2007 10:19:02 AM >

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/20/2007 12:52:39 PM

AdventurousLife

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quote:

In general, the rule of thumb for externally applied voltages is to stay below 60V DC, or 25V AC, IIRC.

I think as a general statemetn this is not a good one--- at 30V one can be killed with sufficient (a very small amount) of current. Amperage is what kills, not voltage, though of course voltage helps overcome resistance.

Your general position I agree with... I think its worth spending the money for a TENS or PES box... and if you're going to do anything self designed, read a lot more about it and keep it under 30 volts, probably well under, like 9 volts or so.

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RE: 9 volt play - 7/21/2007 12:20:46 AM

Aswad

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AdventurousLife

I think as a general statemetn this is not a good one--- at 30V one can be killed with sufficient (a very small amount) of current. Amperage is what kills, not voltage, though of course voltage helps overcome resistance.

I think general statements are bad, but I think this one is no worse.

Let's revisit Ohm's Law for a moment: P = I * U. Deceptively simple.

Voltage does not "help" overcome resistance. Current (amperage) is directly controlled by the voltage and the resistance, in the relation that I = U / R, no more, no less. When the battery voltage is 9V, it cannot exceed that. And, consequently, the current needed for electrocution (generally set at 30mA for safety circuits) requires a resistance lower than 300 ohms for a path that passes through the heart. Does not happen if applied externally. Can theoretically happen with electrodes stuck into blood vessels, or stuck into the chest near the heart. For 30V, this is 1Kohm or less, which can happen if you break the skin, but not otherwise AFAIK.

quote:

Your general position I agree with... I think its worth spending the money for a TENS or PES box... and if you're going to do anything self designed, read a lot more about it and keep it under 30 volts, probably well under, like 9 volts or so.

I, too, would spend the money for a TENS unit or similar.
Anything self-designed should be limited to low voltages, indeed.
That is, unless you have the qualifications to design such a thing properly.

(I so want a medical-grade electroshock collar with Lockheed-Martin to do control software. Think Bill Gates will buy me one if I suggest he can buy others for his employees?

)

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