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Herniated disk part 2 - 8/4/2007 7:12:26 AM

Phoenix2raven

Posts: 347
Joined: 10/14/2006
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So I've been to see a surgeon for my herniated disks L 4 & 5 but he was so ambiguous about what I could expect from surgery apposed to physical therapy. The problem is according to a video I watched the results only go 5 years after that who knows. So my question is if you have had surgery did your relief from symptoms last longer than 5 years or if you did physical therapy did it last longer. According to the study I fall into the severe category that leaves me with an uncertainty that feels very uncomfortable. Please let me know how you did beyond the 5 year mark it will help me make a decision.

Thanks, Phoenix

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/4/2007 10:22:12 AM

whoknew6437

Posts: 2
Joined: 7/30/2007
Status: offline

I had surgery on L4, L5 back in 2003. I am left with chronic nerve pain and lower back pain so am now looking at fusion with the new flexible fusion as opposed to the old rigid fusion. I at first refused more surgery, but can no longer deal with this, so am actually almost looking forward to it. I haven't made it to the 5 year mark but have discussed my problem with many folks who have had the same - some are "fixed" immediately, some say it never worked and some, like me have to have more surgery. I have been on many meds and been through many physical therapists for the pain and to get back some mobility. I don't like taking meds unless the pain is severe, but found that acupuncture has worked better than anything they have tried on me in the past 4.5 years. Within 3 treatments I had stopped limping, the lower calf pain was gone and I actually slept all night. Personally, I would surely get a second opinion from a recommended Dr. before pursuing surgery. I would also say that if I could go back and start over, I would attempt PT and acupuncture before EVER going under the knife. I wish you luck and know that your pain is shared!

(in reply to Phoenix2raven)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/4/2007 3:35:03 PM

slaveboi51

Posts: 1
Joined: 7/6/2006
Status: offline

A couple of years ago, i had 2 bulging discs in my lower back, L4 and L5 if i remember correctly or perhaps it was L3 and L5. Both on my left side. Took medications for better part of 6 months before the doctor said there was nothing else he could do. At that point, I was able to get a referral from him to see a chiropractor. This chiropractor practiced "disc depression." According to research it has an 85% + success rate. After about 27 treatments, all of my pain was gone and i had no regrets at all. Disc decompression is sort of like being on a rack. You lay on a table. Straps are placed around the chest and around the waist. Then a machine slowly pulls the upper extremity away from the lower extremities, thus creating a negative pressure to help pull the disc back into place. I highly recommend talking to such a chiropractor to see if it works well for herniated discs. i believe that it does, but i could be wrong. A much better option than back surgery for sure.

(in reply to whoknew6437)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/4/2007 3:42:58 PM

dawntreader

Posts: 3045
Joined: 11/23/2006
Status: offline

Greetings Phoenix2raven,

In febuaury of this year i had a micro disectomy of L5-S1 due to a herniation. i had undergone 2 years of accupuncture and chiropractic before chosing this surgery. i had wonderful results but unfortunately 2 weeks ago, i re-herniated it and the symptoms are much worse, perhaps due to scar tissue. i have another surgery scheduled for this coming tuesday...and if it herniates a 3rd time, they will remove all disc material and insert an artificial disc.
i am still glad for the surgery, but it was a hard choice as i prefer holistic and eastern medicine~
i wish you well with your choice~

_____________________________

It is choice - not chance - that determines our destiny~
Jean Nidetch

There is a war going on for your mind...if you are thinking, you are winning~
Flobots

(in reply to Phoenix2raven)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/4/2007 4:23:01 PM

eroticloki

Posts: 13
Joined: 5/31/2007
Status: offline

wow Dawntreader..
sexy body for someone with back surgery.. and still doing belly dance?

Anyways, i noticed the original poster has L4 L5 disk bulging ... and is male
did you know this is most common in men and its not really the point that should be under most stress..
This is close to where the sciatic nerve joins the spine..
Think about the cause of you injury?    Is there a specific time you injured your back or
did you have flu like sysmptoms or weak back/mucsles/bone ache some time before?

Ever think bacteria or flu could cause back ache?    Well 1/3 of people with longterm bach ache sciatica actually have low lipid count in blood tests and one university found common bacteria in spinal fluid..
eg.
pneu acnes   (acne bacteria - sweaty balls)
staph aures (in nose/throat - DIY lubrication/BJs)

Remember when ulcers were stress related according to doctors?
Bollocks.. doctors are as uptodate as the koran or the bible..
Ulcers are caused by bacteria.. proven and cured by antibiotics.
I had sciatia and got the L4 L5 blow off age related disc degeration..
and the private surgeon started talking op.s laser microwave etc..

i did research after my McTimothys kiro mentioned something about bacteria giving people heart attacks..
I found backcare.org and and an article on the Lancet about bacteria /sciatica..
convinecd my GP and got 8 weeks on doxycycline..
1 tablet and a left leg that ballooned was all that was needed to take away the knife in my back.   3 months later I had a disc bulge on MRI scan..
funny i felt fine walking in and it was only after lying on a plank pushing on base of spine that i had problems getting up..

My leg swelled as the low level infection was discovered by my immune system..
it travels/lives along and irrates the nerves and disc fluid ... as there is little o2 there and hardly any white blood cells..
the frst disc it gets to is L4 L5 and this weakens..

In OZ they treat disc bulges hernia with hyperbaric treatment : breathing pur #O2 in 2 bar of pressure or diving with O2 mix
I've tried to get hyperbaric treatment in UK, footballers get it.. but i Can't as the goverment has made the NHS take out insurance and hyperbaric centres can't get any.
Try to see if there is a hyperbaric centre near you?
I'd suggest you try every thing you can before surgery .. back doctors are just modern day 'quacks'.

You may be lucky but try to find people saying they got better and stayed better?
There aren't many..

Out of chiropractors, I prefer the Mc Timothy type.. they only ever use their fingers and gentley realign your whole body... none of that this might hurt crap..
they are usually back sufferes them selves too and retrained ..
Even I thought about it.. had a child tho

(in reply to dawntreader)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/5/2007 9:16:12 PM

SayaNereida

Posts: 152
Joined: 7/10/2007
Status: offline

Phoenix2raven,

I had a lamenectomy of L5/S1 in 1998, the surgery provided great relief and much pain reduction; and I still continue to do well today. I cannot say ALL pain is gone, but since the surgery gave me the abiility to walk again; I have no room to complain of the little pain I do have now. I did not have PT following surgery.

In 2005, I was declared 'disabled', however the low back is not my own problem. In 2002, I have fusion surgery on my neck; C3-7.

While both surgeries, for me, were a complete success, in my opinion , the surgeries seem to have sped up the arthritis and degeneration, doctors refuse to do anything for me at this point; there are other back issues still. I have DDD, fibromyalgia and moderate/severe arthritis.

Each of us are different and doctors cannot predict what will happen, only what they HOPE will happen for you.

Out of curiosity, what did you mean by 'so ambiguous about what I could expect from surgery apposed to physical therapy'?

I will say, IF you have any doubts about your doctor or the advice he is giving, please seek another opinion before agreeing to let him do the surgery.

_____________________________

Anais Nin: Love never dies a natural death. It dies because we don't know how to replenish its source. ...

(in reply to eroticloki)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/5/2007 9:43:10 PM

dawntreader

Posts: 3045
Joined: 11/23/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: eroticloki

wow Dawntreader..
sexy body for someone with back surgery.. and still doing belly dance?

Thankyou and yes, up until 2 and a half weeks ago i was hiking 6 miles a day and learning belly dancing, kyaking, and doing tribal yoga. Not sure what caused the re-herniation ( sex maybe?) but it was an acute re-rupture with my symptoms worse than the first time. i have been sleeping sitting up for 5 nights with 2 more nights to go~

_____________________________

It is choice - not chance - that determines our destiny~
Jean Nidetch

There is a war going on for your mind...if you are thinking, you are winning~
Flobots

(in reply to eroticloki)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/6/2007 4:27:44 PM

Phoenix2raven

Posts: 347
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SayaNereida

Phoenix2raven,

I had a lamenectomy of L5/S1 in 1998, the surgery provided great relief and much pain reduction; and I still continue to do well today. I cannot say ALL pain is gone, but since the surgery gave me the abiility to walk again; I have no room to complain of the little pain I do have now. I did not have PT following surgery.

In 2005, I was declared 'disabled', however the low back is not my own problem. In 2002, I have fusion surgery on my neck; C3-7.

While both surgeries, for me, were a complete success, in my opinion , the surgeries seem to have sped up the arthritis and degeneration, doctors refuse to do anything for me at this point; there are other back issues still. I have DDD, fibromyalgia and moderate/severe arthritis.

Each of us are different and doctors cannot predict what will happen, only what they HOPE will happen for you.

Out of curiosity, what did you mean by 'so ambiguous about what I could expect from surgery apposed to physical therapy'?

I will say, IF you have any doubts about your doctor or the advice he is giving, please seek another opinion before agreeing to let him do the surgery.

He wouldn't give me a more definitive answer about PT versus surgery.

(in reply to SayaNereida)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/6/2007 4:32:47 PM

Phoenix2raven

Posts: 347
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: eroticloki

wow Dawntreader..
sexy body for someone with back surgery.. and still doing belly dance?

Anyways, i noticed the original poster has L4 L5 disk bulging ... and is male
did you know this is most common in men and its not really the point that should be under most stress..
This is close to where the sciatic nerve joins the spine..
Think about the cause of you injury?    Is there a specific time you injured your back or
did you have flu like sysmptoms or weak back/mucsles/bone ache some time before?

Ever think bacteria or flu could cause back ache?    Well 1/3 of people with longterm bach ache sciatica actually have low lipid count in blood tests and one university found common bacteria in spinal fluid..
eg.
pneu acnes   (acne bacteria - sweaty balls)
staph aures (in nose/throat - DIY lubrication/BJs)

Remember when ulcers were stress related according to doctors?
Bollocks.. doctors are as uptodate as the koran or the bible..
Ulcers are caused by bacteria.. proven and cured by antibiotics.
I had sciatia and got the L4 L5 blow off age related disc degeration..
and the private surgeon started talking op.s laser microwave etc..

i did research after my McTimothys kiro mentioned something about bacteria giving people heart attacks..
I found backcare.org and and an article on the Lancet about bacteria /sciatica..
convinecd my GP and got 8 weeks on doxycycline..
1 tablet and a left leg that ballooned was all that was needed to take away the knife in my back.   3 months later I had a disc bulge on MRI scan..
funny i felt fine walking in and it was only after lying on a plank pushing on base of spine that i had problems getting up..

My leg swelled as the low level infection was discovered by my immune system..
it travels/lives along and irrates the nerves and disc fluid ... as there is little o2 there and hardly any white blood cells..
the frst disc it gets to is L4 L5 and this weakens..

In OZ they treat disc bulges hernia with hyperbaric treatment : breathing pur #O2 in 2 bar of pressure or diving with O2 mix
I've tried to get hyperbaric treatment in UK, footballers get it.. but i Can't as the goverment has made the NHS take out insurance and hyperbaric centres can't get any.
Try to see if there is a hyperbaric centre near you?
I'd suggest you try every thing you can before surgery .. back doctors are just modern day 'quacks'.

You may be lucky but try to find people saying they got better and stayed better?
There aren't many..

Out of chiropractors, I prefer the Mc Timothy type.. they only ever use their fingers and gentley realign your whole body... none of that this might hurt crap..
they are usually back sufferes them selves too and retrained ..
Even I thought about it.. had a child tho

Some ulcers are caused by bacteria. I've lived with two ulcers for 22 years and hoped that the new evidence about bacteria was my solution. Nope nada F%$#&*( thanks for the input about back problems.

(in reply to eroticloki)

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Post #: 9

RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/6/2007 4:39:16 PM

Phoenix2raven

Posts: 347
Joined: 10/14/2006
Status: offline

Well I'm off to see the surgeon because I cant live like this anymore. It would be nice to sit with out pain. I'll post about my surgery in hopes of helping some one else out. Thanks for all the wonderful advice I just wish that I never worked for that F'in moving company!
Gratefully,Phoenix

(in reply to Phoenix2raven)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/6/2007 7:16:30 PM

SayaNereida

Posts: 152
Joined: 7/10/2007
Status: offline

Phoenix, Good luck, hope all goes well for ya. Saya

_____________________________

Anais Nin: Love never dies a natural death. It dies because we don't know how to replenish its source. ...

(in reply to Phoenix2raven)

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Post #: 11

RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/9/2007 3:15:02 AM

mons

Posts: 2400
Joined: 11/16/2005
Status: offline

raven greetings

I have my L 4 and 5 fuse at birth . my mother would not let them operate on me, i wish she had but i was a child and had not say so now i am suffering. i know of a friend sister and she had an operation it was not so good for her. but each person so different and each person has different ways they react to the operations. i now must have shot in my spine to stop the horrible pain i am scare more of the needle then the operation which i am not able to have my spine is moving tot one side and i can not tell you how the pain has mad me stop moving . i think you must ask all the questions you can to this doctor and a second voice would help too , i was send to the best back surgeon in northern ca and he said no it would make it worst now so if you have not gotten a second opinion do it before so you can feel more comfortable i wish you so much luck and let us and me know how it goes

good luck

mons

(in reply to Phoenix2raven)

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RE: Herniated disk part 2 - 8/10/2007 3:37:35 PM

subguyca2000

Posts: 32
Joined: 7/5/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phoenix2raven

Well I'm off to see the surgeon because I cant live like this anymore. It would be nice to sit with out pain. I'll post about my surgery in hopes of helping some one else out. Thanks for all the wonderful advice I just wish that I never worked for that F'in moving company!
Gratefully,Phoenix

Good luck. I have had 6 back surgeries, all related to sports. I ended up getting several fusions and am satisfied with the results although I waited too long and the sciatic nerve problem left some damage. It sounds like you cannot stand it anymore and that is the only time I recommend to people to have surgery. Once you lose one disc, that puts more pressure on the rest.

(in reply to Phoenix2raven)

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