How much do subs understand femdoms? (Full Version)

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AAkasha -> How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 10:04:29 AM)


Male sub profiles often read either like a laundry list of their kinks -- or, simply, what they think their "fantasy femdom" would want. In other words, the femdom of their dreams would read the details of the acts he will endure and go "wow, that's so hot! What a turn on, I must contact him immediately!" Sometimes they even sound like their own story/fantasy just turned around and put into a profile.

It makes me wonder how many subs understand what makes femdoms tick. Granted, femdoms will vary greatly in what pushes their buttons, but subs often seem to only consider what their "fantasy" femdom gets out of it. They imagine their own ideal Mistress and how she behaves and what motivates her. Not only do the subs project their own kinks regarding what she does, but he projects his own kinks regarding her behavior and motivation.

Subs so often only care about what a femdom will do -- what acts she engages in, and whether or not she will do them to him. Fewer subs are intrigued about *why* a femdom enjoys the acts she does. Fewer subs try to find out what makes their femdom tick, so to speak.

How can femdoms and subs close this communication gap?
Subs, what does your experience with real life play tell you about the motivations of a femdom?


Akasha




diaperedbaby -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 10:27:24 AM)

quote:

Subs so often only care about what a femdom will do -- what acts she engages in, and whether or not she will do them to him. Fewer subs are intrigued about *why* a femdom enjoys the acts she does. Fewer subs try to find out what makes their femdom tick, so to speak.


I think it is a matter of finding that right click. For many men, myself included, a requirement of a certain fetish is needed to get in that mindset of being submissive.
For a dominant female, my experience is they need the same. For example, some will get turned on by a crossdresser, and some won't.
On the other side of that coin is a dominant that is driven only by money. That is ok, but there interest in a sub is likely limited.
Since I am one of those that seek specific interests for me to be a submissive, that are compatible with mine, many would consider that topping from the bottom? Maybe it is, but it is what it is.
I think many more fall into this catagory than not.
Just an observation

diaperedbaby



EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 10:32:40 AM)

Very little. Sometimes I think half the reason the Owner encouraged me to start topping was to force me to realize exactly the headaches and responsibilities that he has to go through- and that's just the topping piece of it!



onceburned -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 10:49:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AAkasha
Subs so often only care about what a femdom will do -- what acts she engages in, and whether or not she will do them to him. Fewer subs are intrigued about *why* a femdom enjoys the acts she does. Fewer subs try to find out what makes their femdom tick, so to speak.

How can femdoms and subs close this communication gap?


I think the problem has two sources. The first is the way boys and girls are raised. Girls are taught to value relationships, to derive happiness from their connection to others. Boys are taught to do their own thing - to go out and indulge their desires - to derive happiness from the pleasure they experience. Altering the raise boys are raised might be necessary to close some of the "gender gap."

The second reason, I think, is that the submission of so many guys is hardwired to their sex drive. They have trouble thinking about submission apart from thinking about sex. I do not know if there is a way to overcome this. But maybe some kind of boot camp for malesubs - breakdown their egoistic sex drive and re-orient their submission to being pleasing. (I am only half serious about this solution - but its better than despair.) [;)]



EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 10:57:35 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: onceburned
The second reason, I think, is that the submission of so many guys is hardwired to their sex drive. They have trouble thinking about submission apart from thinking about sex.

Is this really different from females though? I think women just think of sex differently then men (generally), but I think overall that females and males think about submission and sex in the same way.



onceburned -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 11:31:15 AM)

Do many women lose their submissive feelings once they have orgasmed?



EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 11:49:07 AM)

I think as much as males do.



GoddessDustyGold -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 12:35:00 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

I think as much as males do.


I don't think so at all. It is a rare boy, who, after he has orgasmed, will still get up and immediately take care of the Lady. Too often it is the sexual gratification that drives them. Once that need is met, they are done, until the next time. That is why there is so much discussion about orgasm control.

quote:

ORIGINAL: onceburned

...Girls are taught to value relationships, to derive happiness from their connection to others.

<snipped> The second reason, I think, is that the submission of so many guys is hardwired to their sex drive. They have trouble thinking about submission apart from thinking about sex.


I think Chris has nailed it, and I look forward to hearing what other boys have to say. It may not be true of all boys, but I do think that sex (or kink) is the core for most. So as long as the reward is dangling in front of them, they are willing to be submissive. It is, in fact, part of the excitement. But to be able to maintain that reversal of roles even when there is not play, or when play is not within an immediate realm of possiblity, is very hard for most boys. I don't believe that women have that same driving force in the majority of cases. And this has nothing to do with libido. It has more to do with a rounded relationship, and what will content a woman as opposed to what will content a man.
I will be watching this thread with great interest.



lonewolf05 -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 12:53:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GoddessDustyGold


quote:

ORIGINAL: EmeraldSlave2

I think as much as males do.


I don't think so at all. It is a rare boy, who, after he has orgasmed, will still get up and immediately take care of the Lady. Too often it is the sexual gratification that drives them. Once that need is met, they are done, until the next time. That is why there is so much discussion about orgasm control.

quote:

ORIGINAL: onceburned

...Girls are taught to value relationships, to derive happiness from their connection to others.

<snipped> The second reason, I think, is that the submission of so many guys is hardwired to their sex drive. They have trouble thinking about submission apart from thinking about sex.


I think Chris has nailed it, and I look forward to hearing what other boys have to say. It may not be true of all boys, but I do think that sex (or kink) is the core for most. So as long as the reward is dangling in front of them, they are willing to be submissive. It is, in fact, part of the excitement. But to be able to maintain that reversal of roles even when there is not play, or when play is not within an immediate realm of possiblity, is very hard for most boys. I don't believe that women have that same driving force in the majority of cases. And this has nothing to do with libido. It has more to do with a rounded relationship, and what will content a woman as opposed to what will content a man.
I will be watching this thread with great interest.


---------------
quote:


I don't think so at all. It is a rare boy, who, after he has orgasmed, will still get up and immediately take care of the Lady. Too often it is the sexual gratification that drives them. Once that need is met, they are done, until the next time. That is why there is so much discussion about orgasm control.

----------------
hehe gawd am i glad i am not one of those boys. one of my few long term girlfriends years ago remarked to me, after the event, said"oh you cuddle after?" i said yeah, doesn't everyone?
and then got up and cooked dinner for her.


the wolf

added after----NO male can EVER understand ANY female. man has tried for centuries. most of the time, the female herself doesn't know what she wants. "female logic" is not recognized by science yet, as any form of real logic!



diaperedbaby -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/7/2005 6:14:01 PM)

quote:

I think Chris has nailed it, and I look forward to hearing what other boys have to say. It may not be true of all boys, but I do think that sex (or kink) is the core for most. So as long as the reward is dangling in front of them, they are willing to be submissive. It is, in fact, part of the excitement. But to be able to maintain that reversal of roles even when there is not play, or when play is not within an immediate realm of possiblity, is very hard for most boys


This is very true. I disagree that men won't do anything after a "session"
I have done many things from cuddling to doing the dishes to whatever.
The key is whether either persons fantasy (or kink) is obtainable.
If not, the degrees of motivation will change.
This would apply to a dom or a sub.
To maintain it, that sexual charge (mind fuck) has to be present. I as well think it is just how the sexes are wired.
Not wanting to step on any toes, just an observation of sorts
















imtempting -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/8/2005 5:29:52 AM)

Well isn't it up to the Dominant party to make the Submissive weather male or female do what they want after sex? And if not told anything to do then why should the sub get out of bed? Isnt that disobeying?



onceburned -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/8/2005 6:41:16 AM)

Submission, as a personality trait, comes from within - it is not imposed on a person.



GentleLady -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/9/2005 8:14:59 AM)

quote:

I think the problem has two sources. The first is the way boys and girls are raised. Girls are taught to value relationships, to derive happiness from their connection to others. Boys are taught to do their own thing - to go out and indulge their desires - to derive happiness from the pleasure they experience. Altering the raise boys are raised might be necessary to close some of the "gender gap."

The second reason, I think, is that the submission of so many guys is hardwired to their sex drive. They have trouble thinking about submission apart from thinking about sex. I do not know if there is a way to overcome this.

I would tend to agree with this chris as a generalization but not on a case by case basis. Some submissives are aware that if they want sex tomorrow they had better crawl out of bed and continue to be submissive today. Now that still leaves their submission tied to their sex drive but does allow them to function as a submissive after the gratification.

However, as GoddessDustyGold said....they are rare

Gentle Lady



LadyAngelika -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/9/2005 9:00:02 AM)

quote:

I don't think so at all. It is a rare boy, who, after he has orgasmed, will still get up and immediately take care of the Lady.


I count my blessings for mine then. And believe it or not, before I met him, he was vanilla. But his mother raised him to treat a woman right :)

- LA



LadyAngelika -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/9/2005 9:11:47 AM)

Ok... after my last post I thought of something. I have been with Dominant men who have been huge on the cuddling after bit. Rapier, my friend, my lover, my mentor and who is not one iota submissive has always taken the time to cuddle with me after. Often it is after care especially after an intense S&M session but even if it's something lighter, he always holds me after. And yes, he will even bring me coffee in bed and make me breakfast after ;)

So I don't think that showing tenderness and care to the person you are with is a submissive trait. It is simply something that someone does for someone that they genuinely care about.

- LA



AAkasha -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/9/2005 9:40:23 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

I don't think so at all. It is a rare boy, who, after he has orgasmed, will still get up and immediately take care of the Lady.


I count my blessings for mine then. And believe it or not, before I met him, he was vanilla. But his mother raised him to treat a woman right :)

- LA


I think the concept of "can he still be submissive after he orgasmed" went off track and now we're talking about a guy who can be an attentive partner after he cums -- and not just fall asleep or go off and do his own thing. I don't think that's the same thing as whether or not he loses his submissive drive.

I think most men don't have a problem being attentive after they orgasm, especially if they know it is important. But there clearly is a syndrome with a great many sub men that they lose their ability/desire to be pliable and endure acts they find unthinkable if they have just orgasmsed. When feeling very, very horny and desperate they will endure humiliation, pain and more -- sometimes to great lengths.

But once they cum, they shut down, and their resistance comes back immediately. The most common and blantant example of this is a guy who is so horny he will eat his precum, he will agree to eat his entire load of cum, etc. --- but if he orgasms, and you save his cum in a cup and wait 10 minutes, suddenly the idea of drinking it isn't appealing any more. In fact, many won't be able to do it at all.

Akasha



LadyAngelika -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/9/2005 10:28:22 AM)

I see what you are saying Aakasha, and I guess there are few things I’d like to answer to this.

First and foremost, I have rarely experienced a man becoming “un-sub-like” after orgasm. It has happened before and I just simply was not interested in pursuing. But in general, with the submissives I’ve encountered/engaged with, I’d tell you that their desire to submit to me did not go out the window after they came. Because in most cases, my D/s dynamics are quite psychological and not only sexual. I am also very, very picky about the submissives that I select.

Now in a pure play context which is what I consider S&M with some D/s added for effect, I couldn’t care less if the person doesn’t care to submit to me after. It was a moment shared, simply. Note that these types of moments I don’t have very often, but on occasion will indulge in.

The other point I want to make is about relationship dynamics. I have a boy. I have a few subs that I see on occasion. I don’t expect the same things from each. With my submissives, I expect them to be completely subservient to me at all times. I meet with them and correspond with them on a regular basis but that is the extent of our relationship. These relationships are mutually fulfilling as they are. I could not see them 24/7, and that because I am not 24/7 lifestyle. The submissives that I have selected to have these relationships with don’t have a problem staying focussed on me even after orgasm.

With my boy, the dynamic is different. He is not a submissive. He has never submitted to anyone but me. He is mostly into exploring the play aspects of WIITWD and he also worships me quite a bit. I am his Maîtresse, though his perception of that word probably doesn’t jive with most here. When I met him, he didn't know much about WIITWD. I opened up to him about my kinky desires and they aroused him. He loved the idea of being my boy. So slowly it has become some dynamic that we both like where he is just submissive enough for me. That said, I don’t expect him to act in a particular way. There is no protocol between us. I get so much more pleasure when he offers himself and his devotion up and the submission is his own initiative. And he is always so very, very in tune and attentive to my needs.

I hope this all made sense ;)

- LA



soootie -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/9/2005 3:40:23 PM)

Hi AAkasha
im a new joined male submissive, also limited r/l as a submissive, having been a dom previously.I used to see male subs being blatently sexual or downright demanding and rude, with personal sexual pleasure their obvious goal. It cannot be denied that the sex factor is present,it is for me as well but never in that way,not since i was a 20 something boy anyway. Thoughts about my new role are those of pleasing first, then i really am unsure about a long term view.
Wanting to give and please must be inherent in the submissives as surely as wanting to nurture and grow these qualities are inherent in the Dominant, somewhere the two meet and compliment each other, i hope anyway!
It is not an altogether exciting feeling that i am now another male submissive,especially one with a past as a Dominant!! But yes i must agree that many male submissives out there,not all,have themselves to blame for the status WE now enjoy.
best wishes to All/all
soootie



SweetDommes -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/9/2005 11:29:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

I see what you are saying Aakasha, and I guess there are few things I’d like to answer to this.

First and foremost, I have rarely experienced a man becoming “un-sub-like” after orgasm. It has happened before and I just simply was not interested in pursuing. But in general, with the submissives I’ve encountered/engaged with, I’d tell you that their desire to submit to me did not go out the window after they came. Because in most cases, my D/s dynamics are quite psychological and not only sexual. I am also very, very picky about the submissives that I select.

- LA


I've also never had this problem with someone that we were in a D/s relationship with ... I know that it is something that many run into, but ... I guess we've just been either very smart about who we end up playing with, or we've been very lucky.



Niran -> RE: How much do subs understand femdoms? (7/10/2005 6:48:30 AM)

quote:

quote:

Subs so often only care about what a femdom will do -- what acts she engages in, and whether or not she will do them to him. Fewer subs are intrigued about *why* a femdom enjoys the acts she does. Fewer subs try to find out what makes their femdom tick, so to speak.



I am wondering if there isnt an element of the idea-"If I list my particular kink, then a Mistress will be interested in contacting me." Most of us have a "standard" set of things, like CBT, orgasm control, etc. The kinkier ones that dont have the mass appeal perhaps are listed for that reason.

Granted, they can read like a hopeful laundry list. However, I think it may be that they are hoping that the list will attract attention.

N



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