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Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/14/2005 12:21:51 PM

MarieJu

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I'm sure this has been asked time & time again, but I'm fairly new and would like to know: What exactly is the difference between a bottom and a sub? Thank you.

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/14/2005 12:24:42 PM

EmeraldSlave2

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*cringing away* It's me, not you.

The answer is- everyone will give you a different answer, there is no Ultimate Definition.

However, MY definition is that a bottom is someone who agrees for the period of a scene or specific activity that they will not be the ones to direct what's going on, allowing another person to direct and is usually the one having stuff "done" to them.

A submissive is someone who is oriented towards relationships in which the dynamic is based on someone else having day-to-day authority with no specific time or situation break beyond hard limits.

A submissive can also bottom.

< Message edited by EmeraldSlave2 -- 7/14/2005 12:25:23 PM >

(in reply to MarieJu)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/14/2005 2:29:04 PM

Archer

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OK maybe this will help you a little bit.

It's my own little view and by no means universal, but it may help you understand enough so that you can form your own way of seeing it.

Imagine that Tops are fruits, a catagory of food
Masters Apples
Dom's Citrus fruit
Daddies Grapefruit

Imagine Bottoms are meat, a catagory of food
Slaves might be beef
Submissives sheep
Girls lamb

Goes back to the old English lesson
All roses are flowers but not all flowers are roses.

In Leather

Archer

(in reply to MarieJu)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/14/2005 2:31:24 PM

dominmd

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To add to Emeralds post,

I am a Dom. That means that I am not a Master...........yet.

For me a Dom is into the relationship aspect of BDSM as Em said a sub would be. And a Top can be just doing one scene with a bottom.

So a sub really is the same as a bottom. But it really depends on when and where and in what context the play is in.

Say I and a sub are in a relationship. We are at a play party. She is still my sub (ie: MINE) If I choose to let someone play, she will still be my sub, yet she will be a bottom to the person topping her.

If I confuse anyone, just let me know, it's been a long day.

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/14/2005 2:35:30 PM

smilezz

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It is what resonates within you....sub/bottom/slave/etc....nothing more, nothing less.

~smilezz~

< Message edited by smilezz -- 7/14/2005 2:36:32 PM >

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(in reply to MarieJu)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/14/2005 7:37:14 PM

MistressFire70

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I liked a description I once heard:

A slave is someone who surrenders completely, with only the intent to obey the Master. In this relationship, the slave has one choice: to obey or to end the relationship. A Master is someone who takes responsibility for that surrender. Of course, a slave should not give this surrender lightly, nor should a Master take it lightly.

To that, I would personally add:

A submissive is someone who gives control, conditionally. What I'm trying to say is that a submissive only gives limited amounts of control for long periods of time. For example, I have a submissive. I don't control his finances or raise his child, but he asks my opinions and input. A Dominant, then, is someone who receives that control.

A bottom is someone who gives limited control for a short amount of time (scene, party, weekend). A Top is someone who receives that kind and duration of control.

But, these are opinions only. There are no set definitions.

Fire

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(in reply to MarieJu)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/14/2005 8:07:55 PM

fastlane

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Plain and simple....To bottom is being the jelly before the Peanut butter is applied. You are helpless jelly and you will be topped, during the making of the sandwich.
To be submissive or a slave, is not just the making of the sandwich, but aquainting you with the whole menu, which holds a lot more recipe's than a PBJ sandwich.

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/15/2005 5:21:52 AM

kisshou

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quote:

ORIGINAL: fastlane

Plain and simple....To bottom is being the jelly before the Peanut butter is applied. You are helpless jelly and you will be topped, during the making of the sandwich.
To be submissive or a slave, is not just the making of the sandwich, but aquainting you with the whole menu, which holds a lot more recipe's than a PBJ sandwich.

so a Top can make a sandwich while a Dominant can prepare gourmet meals ?

(in reply to fastlane)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/15/2005 9:03:10 PM

LadyAngelika

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This is the way I see it. But it doesn't mean it's the answer ;)

Dominance and submission are mind sets.

Top and bottom are roles in a scene.

- LA

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(in reply to MarieJu)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/15/2005 10:17:43 PM

obedientkayla

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I have always thought of tops and bottoms in two ways.

As a general description: Masters and Dominants are 'Tops' and submissive and slaves are 'bottoms'
(I also will use Dominant and submissve as general terms as well. It depends on the conversation and who I'm talking with)
BUT
I also think of them as:
Top/bottom - only employ the physical aspects of BDSM with no other type of power exchange. This can be a relationship that is vanilla other than behind the bedroom door, or when playing with people other than your own partner)
Dom and sub - the power exchange extends into the relationship between the two. (not just physical)
Master and slave - the power exchange is 100% Master commands, slave obeys - end of story.

I think where one fits within those definitions is all about mindset. I don't consider myself a 'slave' however there are men I've know who I would enter into a slavery contract with. I don't consider myself a bottom but I have bottomed for people in BDSM play situations.

Kayla
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(note the new url - tell your friends)

(in reply to smilezz)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/15/2005 10:39:30 PM

EmeraldSlave2

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I am adoring this thread.

I COULD go through each and every response (INCLUDING MINE) nd pick it apart, discussing the nuances of each meaning and extrapolating the possible contradictions within each part.

But instead what I see is a gorgeous mosaic- we're all saying ABOUT the same thing, we're all thinking ABOUT the same idea. No one's idea of bottom or sub COMPLETELY fits into my idea...but each of them is CLOSE, each of them touches on a different ASPECT and it feels "true enough."

And I think as long as we keep on that vein and don't try and make our own perception a universal one, we might just have a good start at something.

(in reply to obedientkayla)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/15/2005 11:45:07 PM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

And I think as long as we keep on that vein and don't try and make our own perception a universal one, we might just have a good start at something.

Yes! Lets hope it stays this way! That would be wonderful progress here on collarchat :)

- LA

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Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to EmeraldSlave2)

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RE: Top Vs Dom--Bottom Vs Sub - 7/17/2005 2:06:32 PM

Raphael

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Top and bottom are roles in a scene. They refer to action roles, things one does. Tops tie people up, administer whippings, etc. Tops are either sadists, or bondage tops, or both. Bottoms are either masochists, or bondage bottoms, or both.

Dominant and submissive are roles in a relationship. They're orientation roles, referring to what you are and how you interact with your mate, not to specific activities. Although many dominants are also tops, not all are. Although many submissives are also bottoms, again, not all are. Neither are all tops dominant, or all bottoms submissive, not by any means.

One might make an analogy here, though I'm having difficulty thinking of one I think is good quickly, but for instance 'fellator/fellatrix' are terms that, like top or bottom, refer to a role in the context of a specific act, while 'heterosexual/homosexual' refer to roles in terms of orientation, so there's something of an analogy there.

A top or a bottom is defined by the acts they perform. It's perfectly possible for someone to top in one act, and turn around and bottom in another act 20 minutes later. A dominant or submissive is defined by the role they naturally assume, and need, in a relationship. A dominant cannot turn on a dime and become a submissive, nor can a submissive become a dominant - at least, not easily or quickly. It would require a major psychological reorientation.

(in reply to MarieJu)

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