changing habits

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HarleyKitty69 -> changing habits (9/12/2007 5:53:42 PM)
OK ... I was wondering .. why would you change the behavior of a sub/slave ?? as example .. making him/her stop saying.. I'm sorry and teaching him/her to say I apologize instead.. OK OK actually thats a bad example ...... that was a good thing for me to change... but what about any other behavior ?? The sub/slave had the behavior when you meet him/her.. it is a part of what makes them them ..... it's part of who they are , part of who you choose to be with you ( and vice versa) So why change them into something they are not ??? Then why not just choose someone who does not have these behavior and is more suitable to your likings ??? gee I hope I make sense here ......... ~greed~

HarleyKitty69 -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 5:57:14 PM)
change saying ..I hate .. into .. I dislike making her loose weight/ gain weight looking at the glass as half full and not as half empty... are some other excamples I must add to this

jaxnsax -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 5:57:51 PM)
Greetings I am a bit confused as to what you are asking exactly. If you are referring to surface behaviors; those that are like ‘bad habits’, then I can understand the need to change these. However, if you are referring to deeper behaviors; those that shape a personality; then I would have to say that no, I can not see wanting to change them. jaxon

szobras -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 6:08:25 PM)
Out side of the idea of changing behavior to more suite ones preferences. Assisting in the guidence of behavioral changes in my idea is set to enhance the opportunity of that which one aspires to become. If current behavior patterns appear to be an obstacle or detrimental to ones goals , changes of behavior aid in overcoming those obstacles, and create positive behaviors and patterns towards the goals.

HarleyKitty69 -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 6:09:29 PM)
actually all or any of them the little anoying habits the looks .. by either gaining weight, loosing weight... changing their hair color the way they behave, they way they speak .... why would any Master/ Dom want to change them ?? edited to add in reply to jaxnasx reply

SolarAndViolet -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 6:20:41 PM)
I'd say that sometimes, requiring a change of a submissive that wants to serve you accomplishes a few things. Yes, behavior modification is sometimes to the sub's benefit, such as trying to improve his/her outlook or to get better habits, such as improving general health. Other times, though, it is more to do with the mental state. Speaking as someone who was never in the military, I found it very interesting when a friend I was around all through growing up came back from Marine Boot Camp. He'd call his bed a 'rack', his hat a 'cover', etc. It's not that 'hat' was wrong, nor is 'bed'. The point, though, was that you must take what you know and refine it, learning, in the process, that what you're told from your superiors is what you're to take as face value and to work at accomplishing the task in front of you, even if it seems daunting. This is my understanding, again, and someone with an actual background is welcome to chime in and refute or affirm that understanding. Much the same, it's not necessarily that "I'm sorry" is incorrect. More it's reminding one's self that to meet the goals set forth by the Dominant, one can be mindful of small phrases, small positions, etc.. and I think a number of people appreciate the details of the situations and relationship. If the Dominant pays close attention to hear that you said, using your example "apologize" instead of "sorry", can you be somewhat assure that s/he is paying attention to much more than just that small phrase? I would think so.. because that's precisely how I am and how I work. In the business world, it's called 'detail-oriented'. To everyone else, it is 'anal-retentive'. I do look for those little things, and while I enjoy reaping the benefits, I also hope to ensure that my girl knows that I'm always mindful of her.. just as I want her to be so of me. -Solar

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 6:51:22 PM)
Well there are a few questions here- when does changing what a person does turn into changing who a person is? And when does changing who a person is go from a good thing to a bad thing? If I dismissed my partner to choose someone else who was automatically to my liking I'd not only condemn myself to a life of emptiness, but I'd be throwing away the greatest blessing better than my little pathetic self ever dreamed I could have. I think that's worth a bit of tweaking and growing. Since he WANTS to grow and change into his new self, I think it's a good deal all around.

SirCache -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 7:15:23 PM)
I don't think of it as changing habits as much as refining them. I appreciate a person for who they are, and what skills they bring to the relationship. That said, I also like certain things done, presented, or prepared a particular way. If I simply let the submissive grope around blindly without establishing some kind of guidance it would be terribly unfair to them. A sub is attracted because they have an innate desire to please the Dom, and short of dressing them up as your dead exwife (a'la Maude Flanders), they will bend over backwards to find a way to please them. At no point do I ever ask someone not to be true to themselves, but I do have certain requirements that are important to me and a good sub will accept those needs I have and incorporate them into their lives. Maybe it's a look, maybe it's a manner of speach. I don't seek to change who a person is, merely how they carry themselves in my presence.

badboy1909 -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 7:27:51 PM)
When a habit displayed by a sub / slave indicates a larger issue such as self esteem or something else of this nature it is good to try and modify the behavior. If the sub / slave is constantly saying "I'm sorry" everytime something is brought up, or to their attention, it is an automatic reflex statement. To say "I'm sorry" should have meaning and that should be reinforced once they stop the reflex action. To try and mold a person the way you want them is not a good way to develop a relationship. To search the world over for the perfect match will in most cases cause you to grow old and lonely.

nyrisa -> RE: changing habits (9/12/2007 9:15:35 PM)
If someone is leaning toward being a depressed, or self critical or pessimistic person, I can certainly see the value in trying to change their automatic way of looking at things. If they habitually see the negative side of a matter first, it is probably to their advantage to help them see the positive aspects as well. That is something that I am working on with someone now, and I am hoping that it will help improve his emotional well-being. It is not unreasonable to ask someone to make small changes in behavior, if that behavior is detrimental to them or to the relationship.

SirDraco7 -> RE: changing habits (9/13/2007 4:28:35 AM)
Maybe I would. But not to the point of changing who she is. The question is what defines that point? I do not see changing physical appearance as changing who they are. If they are overweight and I make them or help them lose weight, so much the better. It would more likely than not make her feel better about herself and be healthier. Changing how she speaks? maybe. Saying Yes instead of yea is one example. And even there I wouldn't see such simple actions as changing who she is. Sometimes change could be good. having her stop smoking/drinking/drugs? In some ways it might change who she is I guess. But I wouldn't see it as bad change. I guess it all depends on whom you ask. Having her stop doing an activity that she enjoys, or stop writing or playing an instrument. Stop laughing or smiling. That is stuff that changes who she is, and stuff that I wouldn't do. I might focus such more, like limit when and where(except emotions like laughing of course lol) but I want her to be her. If I wanted a robot I'd go to the store. ::shrugs:: Just my, perhaps confusing thoughts

feastie -> RE: changing habits (9/13/2007 5:18:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HarleyKitty69 OK ... I was wondering .. why would you change the behavior of a sub/slave ?? as example .. making him/her stop saying.. I'm sorry and teaching him/her to say I apologize instead.. OK OK actually thats a bad example ...... that was a good thing for me to change... but what about any other behavior ?? The sub/slave had the behavior when you meet him/her.. it is a part of what makes them them ..... it's part of who they are , part of who you choose to be with you ( and vice versa) So why change them into something they are not ??? Then why not just choose someone who does not have these behavior and is more suitable to your likings ??? gee I hope I make sense here ......... ~greed~ Are changing these small things changing who she is? I have been taught to say, "I apologize" instead of "I'm sorry" because, as it was explained to me at the time, "I'm sorry" means I've done something that would require punishment. That's the way his mind applies the language. He was very much into clear and absolute language. His belief is that words are extremely important, therefore, word choice is extremely important. Other changes were "Certainly" to anyone other than he instead of "You're welcome." "You're welcome" meant that whomever I said it to was welcome to any part of me and obviously, he didn't want anyone else welcome to his property. "Belly" rather than "tummy or stomach", as I am a full grown woman and have no need for such infantile terms. Most importantly, "Master" as opposed to "Dante" because his role in my life and his in mine required me to be honest and respectful of him and his place. I gave him the power to change my language, or anything else he wished ... he deserved the title. LOL, even after all these years and we've moved onto to friendship and to others, I still can't call him by his name. He didn't change who I am, he helped me become more of who I am.

rmanrr -> RE: changing habits (9/13/2007 5:33:02 AM)
Greetings My question is simply this. If I found the person attractive then why would I change anything about them? Small fine tuning might be warranted but the rest is simply accepting them for who they are as they accept Me for who I am. Woo hoo! plane leaves in 3.5 hours and then I am in for a 5 day visit with My woman! Have a great weekend folks...I know we will!

Celeste43 -> RE: changing habits (9/13/2007 8:06:23 AM)
Weight change brings up complex emotions and shouldn't be done if you aren't prepared to handle those emotional triggers you've just set off. I'm sorry is not usually changed into I apologize. What normally happens here is you have a sub with deep set fears who apologizes reflexively to avoid being attacked verbally, even when she did nothing wrong. In this case stopping the constant stream of sorry teaches that she can spill the water while pouring and it will just be seen as a minor mishap and ignored. It teaches her that she's safe being human and doesn't need to put herself down before someone else does it to her.

RRafe -> RE: changing habits (9/13/2007 10:08:17 AM)
Perhaps I like 80% of someone who's given themselves as property. I want to refine them-so I program a change. Why? It makes me HAPPY.

MrDiscipline44 -> RE: changing habits (9/13/2007 10:41:38 AM)
Two reasons: because it'll be what makes them mine and because it pleases me to do so.

AquaticSub -> RE: changing habits (9/13/2007 11:01:04 AM)
This is something that Valyraen and I feel strongly about. When we were discussing changing our relationship to a 24/7 d/s dynamic, one thing that came up from his end was that I should not change. He fell in love with Aqua, not "short busty redhead number 7". It was only after he was sure that I would not change who I was that we started to go that road. He may modify how I do things, how I bring him his hot chocolate, how I address him, what I wear, what I do but I am not different. I am still the fiesty, pesty, cuddle-seeking, hot-tempered woman I was two years ago. Granted with more self-confidence and perhaps a little more patience but with all the same qualities that made him love me in the first place.

came4U -> RE: changing habits (9/14/2007 11:12:29 AM)
Why do people always try to change their partner.. and later bitch, moan and complain 'they aren't the person I married!' lol

kinkypuppy2 -> RE: changing habits (11/27/2007 3:40:27 PM)
positive reinforcement. and the use of ritual

TwiztdErotic -> RE: changing habits (11/27/2007 4:05:11 PM)
When has anyone, ever, liked every last detail about a person? I'd be hard pressed to believe that it has ever happened in the history of human interaction. Just because you choose to take a slave as your own does not mean that you like every little thing about them. People look for different things in another person, if we all held out for what we considered to be absolute perfection then we'd all be lonely for eternity. So long as the things you consider to be important are there, the rest can be worked with. Once you've taken them as a slave, why not set about changing the minor details to better suit your preferences?

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