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Honsoku -> RE: Oh God, she said she was 40? (9/25/2007 8:13:19 PM)
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ORIGINAL: blacknbluemale
Honsoku,
What an intersting and provocative reply. Yes, I would agree that truth is a handicap today, yet, you assume the pool in which you are swimming is ordinary. I, myself, am far from ordinary, and at a glance, I can usually tell is someone is intelectually at my level.
Actually, I don't assume the pool is ordinary. If everyone was ordinary, any liar would be identified immediately, as there would be no exceptional cases. Although in that situation lying wouldn't matter, as everyone would be functionally the same. Lying in this case is an attempt to improve how others see you.
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You see in science, there are no lies, and to tell a lie is not a competitive advantage but a game ending fault. Science is exact, so to is it's description, and I am afraid, I am hopelessly a scientist.
Science isn't conducted with competition in mind. Science is a process which attempts to discern relationships, so lying would be counter to the purpose of the process. However, the rest of the world doesn't operate on the scientific process.
Lying may be a game ending fault for you, but for most people it isn't. Even when a lot people say that they don't tolerate liars, their track record says differently (not say that is the case for you, just in general).
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I see no reason to lie, and those who must, are weak, inferior and not worth the time it takes to court I am happy to give them to the competitor, because they are not at my level.
If the lying person didn't appear to be near your level, then one has to ask what you are doing competing for that person in the first place? The competition goes both ways. Unless you are at one of the extremes, there are people competing for you (as she was) as well as people you compete for. They lie so you will think that they are worth your time.
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So while I agree, I dissagree.
I agree that it is about daily lies and deceipt, but I dissagree with you in your premise that it give the competitive advantage. People usually are truth meters. Honesty is something we all seem to see well, while dishonesty, even with clever liars, always seems to be discovered. But for a few Florida scam artists (I can say that because I have a home in Florida too), most of us live honest lives. Yet woman lie about age and weight and do not, themselves feel it is a "real" lie. Yet they steal time and life from others when they do, never caring, Oh they care when a man turns out to be married, yes, then somehow a lie is a "real" lie. But when they say 21, when 30, or 40 when 55, well, then it is a "woman thing."
So again I ask, why do some women lie?
People normally are lousy judges of when others are lying. Everyone likes to think they are good at it, but they tend to be really bad when tested. It takes training to be good at detecting half-way decent liars. While lies generally can not be sustained indefinitely, they don't need to be. The lie just has to be maintained long enough for the other person's psychological investment to outweigh the harm of the lie. Gaining the short term acceptance is crucial, because without it, there will be no long term acceptance. You can't get your foot in the door until the door is opened a crack. So the emphasis is placed on winning in the short run.
As far as lies about age and weight; as physical standards go, the appearance is given that the vast majority of people prefer their female partners young and thin. I'm not sure where these lies became socially acceptable, though it almost certainly is related to these social standards. It probably stems from the historical tendency to value women primarily along these lines (not that this tendency is gone by a long shot). So when a woman lies about her age and/or weight convincingly, she improves her value (or at least what she thinks is her value) in society at effectively no cost.
Bottom line is that people do things which they feel benefit themselves, lies are no exception. A woman generally lies about her age/weight in order to make them seem more attractive or more valuable. During courting, it is a way to get their foot in the door. In social gatherings it is a way to improve their social standing and feelings of self-worth ("they believed me, so I must look it!").
Honsoku
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