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musikman1 -> RE: Sadistic Master, not a masochist sub? (9/27/2007 10:39:55 AM)
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Hi James,
i'm a male sub bottom that is not at all into pain.
Please allow me to further clarify:
I don't consider "discomfort" the same as pain.
Discomfort is what happens when someone pinches your nipple. It evolves into pain when they hand a clothespin on your nipple with a 12 ounce weight hanging from it.
The one thing that I note is missing from your messages is "negotiation." The relationship between Dominants and submissives is an evolving situation that should be involving quite a bit of communication and negotiation.
A good starting place for you might be to do a Google search for BDSM Checklist. Find one that you like, and copy it (Highlight with your mouse, press CTL then C), and then paste it into your word processor (click on the document window in the text area, then press CTL then V).
Take some time, for first timers if you have a nice LONG list (longer list, less surprises, imho), it could take a couple of hours to fill it out.
A BDSM checklist will have literally HUNDREDS of BDSM oriented activities. At the top of the list will be (these are only examples, there are a zillion different lists out there):
Abrasion
Age play
Anal sex
Anal plugs (small)
Anal plugs (large)
Anal plug (in public, under clothes)
.. and at the end:
Water torture
Waxing (hair removal)
Wearing symbolic jewelry
Weight gain (forced)
Weight loss (forced)
Whipping
Wooden paddles
Wrestling
Now, next to each of these entries (my list is eight pages long in Microsoft Word) are two additional columns.
Column 1: Item description (as listed above)
Column 2: Do you have experience in this activity? This is just YES, you've done it before, or NO you have no experience with this activity. We have not yet gotten to the part where we reveal whether we LIKE this activity yet, just if we have tried it or not.
SUGGESTION: Go through the entire list and ONLY fill in the first column with YES or NO to show your experience level. If you are new, you will have 20 NO's to every one YES.
Column 3: How much interest do I have in this activity?
OK, here's the MEAT of the checklist. Most lists will have similar instructions:
For each activity (fill out the ENTIRE form!), you can list a number btw 1 and 5, CURIOUS, NO or LIMIT.
1-5 = your interest in performing this activity
1 = I don't like doing it, but if the Dom/me wants to do it, I will accede to Their wishes.
2 = I have minimum interest in participating in this activity
3 = It may be fun, let's do it!
4 = I love this activity, let's do it ALOT!
5 = I LIVE for this activity, PLEASE do me!
NO = I have no interest in this activity AT ALL, you might talk me into it (SOFT LIMIT), but I really don't want to do it.
LIMIT = We are NOT to do this activity under any circumstances (HARD LIMIT)
CURIOUS = I have no experience in this activity, but I've always wanted to try it. After I do it once or twice, I'll give it a number rating.
SUGGESTION: Now, once again, go through the entire list and fill in your interest levels (1-5), your SOFT LIMITS (NO), your HARD LIMITS (LIMIT), and your curiosity (CURIOUS).
Once you're done with this full list, ask permission from your Dom/me to review it with you. Any Dom/me worth their title will welcome a list that they can refer to, so they won't have to ask you about every activity that they want to try.
Of course, it's every Dom/me's JOB to stretch limits, so over time, you could expect that these various ratings will change. But at least you will have a working document to show your interest and limits in the various BDSM activities.
Now, once your Dom/me looks at this list there are two possible outcomes:
1) They may LAUGH and LAUGH and LAUGH and wish you well as they show you out the door. While this may be humiliating, it's not the same thing as humilation play. :)
2) They will discuss the various ratings you have made, and come up with training for you that involves your interests, in as much as they are compatible with the Dom/me's interests.
Especially as a beginning sub, it's my opinion that you should never be put in situations that are beyond your training and experience. In other words, there should be no surprises. Your Dom/me should bring you along gradually, starting with the activities that you LOVE, moving to the ones you LIKE, and slowly introducing you to anything that isn't a HARD LIMIT.
While in your case, your Dom/me seems to be a certified Sadist, S/He may be just continuing what they consider "normal" activities with a long-standing sub, not being aware that you are very uncomfortable.
Perhaps this particular Dom/me couple is not for you. If ALL They want to do is inflict pain, and pain is not high on your list of turn ons, perhaps you may have to look elsewhere. On the other hand, They may embrace you for your honesty and providing accurate information to Them.
I'm a died-in-the-wool-sub-only, but I cannot believe that any Dom/me would want to inflict unwanted pain or other activities on another human being without careful communication, planning, training and permission. As you have already found out, there is a psychological element to this process as well as a physical one. You don't want (or rather SHOULDN'T want) to be forced into unwanted activities "just to please the Dom/me."
If you really have reservations about certain activities (the size of the vise that your Dom has your balls in, for example), open communication should be paramount.
The danger in just "keeping quiet," instead of 'fessing up, is that you will be driven out of the lifestyle without having had a chance to see all of the wonderful aspects and rewards. And these positives can only be achieved by competent communication between Dom/me and sub.
I'm off of my soapbox now, here's some samples of 1-5, NO, LIMIT and CURIOUS from MY checklist:
5 (I live for it): Age play, Auctioned for charity, bondage (light), Blindfolds, Competition (with other subs), Corsets (wearing casually), Cross-dressing
1 (If You must, but i won't get anything out of it): Anal plugs (large), Beating (soft), Breast whipping, Clothesbin, Food play
HARDLIMIT (not under ANY circumstances): Hot waxing, Housework (doing), Injections, Branding, Knife play, Blood play, Pain (medium), Pain (severe)
CURIOUS (Try me!): Persona training (in scene), Piercing (temp, play-pierce), Riding the horse (crotch torture), Saran wrapping, Slut clothing (public)
I hope this helps from one sub to another. Whatever you decide, don't just surprise a Dom/me with this information, ask permission to deliver it. If the Dom/me says, "No," in my opinion you need to find a more compatible Dom/me.
mm1
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