Medical Play (Full Version)

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AdoreMe5 -> Medical Play (10/1/2007 1:22:25 PM)

I'm relatively new to this site and never actually thought about Medical Play, however after reading posts from masterhxb/his profile as well as daughterslave, I must admit to thinking about nothing else. I was conversing w/the great "master" for a couple of weeks...well, conversing may be an exageration since he usally gave very brief answers to my inquiries but it did peak my interest. He unfortunately wouldn't share where to purchase to infamous over the counter ether/chloroform (sp). Well, that's a lie, he said his subs buy it at an auto store like trak auto but he wouldn't share the name of the product that contained the chemical. When he said he wanted me to visit NY so he could put me under that was it for me! lol  Does anyone know what I could use that would put my slave under that I could buy over the counter?  He's requested a "session" of beatings while he's under so he won't feel the pain, but he loves the marks and I thought this would be a good reward plus it sounds like something I'd enjoy doing myself!
I've tried a few Chemical companies online but noone will sell to an individual buying w/cash. You must have a PO#/have an acct w/the company as a teaching facility/lab.  Any ideas/or suggestions?



pseudopsychotic -> RE: Medical Play (10/1/2007 1:34:11 PM)

Now this is just my opinion...It in no way reflects anyone else. Well, maybe other medical personal and the law enfocement.

But are you out of your mind?
Do you know CPR? Do you know how much chemical abuse your boys body can take?
Do you know that it's kinda illegal? 

quote:

online but noone will sell to an individual buying w/cash. You must have a PO#/have an acct w/the company as a teaching facility/lab.


If not then that should be your first clue.
Do you know the ramifications?
If he dies, do you know what would happen to you?
Ever heard of assisted suicide? (not to mention themental fuck you'll have)
I think you should really do a lot a lot of research on this before taking any leaps.
and think really long and really hard.
I mean, haha, people only go through years of school in order to learn how to put someone out.

That's my advice.



AdoreMe5 -> RE: Medical Play (10/1/2007 2:29:27 PM)

[:D]



ThinkingKitten -> RE: Medical Play (10/1/2007 2:34:58 PM)

Chloroform and ether are both carcinogens, and ether is HIGHLY flammable. Cripes, if your subject is looking/willing/agreeing to be knocked out there are probably more readily available street drug options - any or all of which could cause serious harm or end in a fatality. Both you and they would need to be fully conversant with ALL the potential risks and ramifications. And that still wouldn't give you much of a defence if something went wrong I expect.

Sounds to me like the dude you were talking to, was doing just that... talking up a lot of hot air. To quote AquaticSub: "if it sounds like an ER Docs party story in the making, then its probably not a good idea".

I'd have to go with the "not a good idea".




Termyn8or -> RE: Medical Play (10/1/2007 2:42:52 PM)

OK, you are nuts, stick around.

You need to do some research. You need to know how much to administer based on the vital signs, and you had better be able to do CPR, perhaps long term.

Actually I thought pain was ½ the fun, but to each their own.

If you decide to do this nobody will stop you, but you had better know what you are doing. A single minute or so with a rag covering their face will niot put them out for long enough, and you can't just let it be. So you have to beat while administering the anesthesia. I would consult someone who knows what they are doing, and reconsider even doing it in the first place. Anesthesiologists make good money, know why ? Because the patient's life is in their hands. Short of death, brain damage can occur. Also when one is unconcious there is no safeword.

I can't see how this can be considered safe, sane and consentual. It may be consentual, but with loss of conciousness comes the loss of that consent.

But if you decide to do this nobody can stop you. If you do, use the rag and just use the little time to get in some really good thwacks or whatever, then the sub comes to. Don't try to extend the session. Every minute is dangerous.

Anything more IMO would require a competent anesthesiologist. Vital signs must be monitored constsnly. Overall I advise against the whole thing, but if you do it anyway, try not to kill the sub. They don't like that.

T



MistressHolly71 -> RE: Medical Play (10/1/2007 11:44:57 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AdoreMe5

He's requested a "session" of beatings while he's under so he won't feel the pain, but he loves the marks and I thought this would be a good reward plus it sounds like something I'd enjoy doing myself!


Maybe I'm missing something but if he's under & can't feel pain, how would you know if you've done any damage? He wouldn't be able to use a safeword or other type of signal to let you if he's in trouble. That fact that you think you'd enjoy beating an unconscious person is disturbing.




lurkingtiger -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 12:17:31 AM)

As an EMT/Paramedic, I'm going to say this. If you try to put your submissive "under", you are a moron, and will probibly end up in Prison when you kill or make your submissive brain dead from profound hypoxia. The chemical you are talking about is ether. It's used to start diesel engines. It's not used as an anesthetic anymore by an responsable medical doctor due to the fact it induces, among other things severe nausea/vomiting, (which, in someone who is unconscious can cause loss of airway, and aspiration), cardiac dysrhythmias, hypotension and hypoxia. In addition to the fact that you can put the subbie under so deeply that you supress their ability to produce respiratory drive. Do you have an Ambu-Bag and an intubation roll setting by your bedside? Guess not. Even in a medical setting, a surgical team will constantly monitor several physiologic variables such as oxygen saturation, heart rate, blood pressure, and level of consciousness. Even then, ether is never used. Usually, inhalation is something like Isofluorane, or more commonly for deep sedation, Diprovan or Etomidate in combination with a powerful pain killer such as Fentanyl is used. Good luck with getting any of the above absent of being a MD. What you are asking and describing to do is not only a bad idea, but in many states could result in your prosecution for several legal violations, including practicing medicine without a license, unauthorized use of chemicals, poisoning, or attempted murder. In additon to the fact it violates the safe AND sane concepts of BDSM. The fact you cant buy these chemicals



scifi1133 -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 12:20:26 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: lurkingtiger

As an EMT/Paramedic, I'm going to say this. If you try to put your submissive "under", you are a moron, and will probibly end up in Prison when you kill or make your submissive brain dead from profound hypoxia. The chemical you are talking about is ether. It's used to start diesel engines. It's not used as an anesthetic anymore by an responsable medical doctor due to the fact it induces, among other things severe nausea/vomiting (which, in someone who is unconscious can cause loss of airway, and aspiration), cardiac dysrhythmias, and hypoxia. Even in a medical setting, a surgical team will constantly monitor several physiologic variables such as oxygen saturation, heart rate, blood pressure, and level of consciousness. What you are asking and describing to do is not only a bad idea, but in many states could result in your prosecution for several legal violations, including practicing medicine without a license, unauthorized use of chemicals, poisoning, or attempted murder. In additon to the fact it violates the safe AND sane concepts of BDSM


I agree here completely......as a law enforcement officer im telling you there are numerous charges that can be brought against you for these acts. as a medic im telling you it is completely irresponsible and dangerous



lurkingtiger -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 12:22:19 AM)

If you're looking for a way to reduce pain from a flogging or beating, try to find a salve or balm that uses a 2% Lidocane HCL mixture in it. Some drugstores still carry creams and gels lke this for sunburns. As well, anything with Aloe Vera in it will help.

No offense, but this "Master" needs to be reported to local law enforcement/DEA if he is actually doing this. It's not medical play, it's death fetish play.



Ponyboy7 -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 12:37:55 AM)

First of all ether is regulated by the U.S. DEA, so I don't think it would be a good idea asking where to purchase it, or calling companies and asking if they will sell it to you.

More importantly though is that both chemicals, being anesthetics, can severely depress respiratory function. If administered incorrectly or in too high a dose, it is more than possible to induce respiratory paralysis, coma, and death. Recall that brain damage is "likely" if someone goes without oxygen for less than 5 minutes.

I don't know what profession you are in, but I presume you are not a physician since you don't have access to anesthetics. That being the case, what you are suggesting is extremely dangerous; I am not trying to insult you, but I think it is imperative that I convey this to you. It is even recommended that physicians who are not anesthesiologists refrain from administering general anesthesia. Without SpO2 monitoring you will have no idea if the person is being oxygen deprived. Without intubation and artificial respiration (or at the very least being prepared to intubate and conduct artificial respiration), should respiratory paralysis occur, death is significantly more likely. There is also the possibility that the person may experience a severe allergic reaction to the anesthetic, which could result in death.

Ether and chloroform are known to have caused repeated cardiac arrhythmias, and, speaking as a medical professional, I know that cardiac arrest is not rare during ether anesthesia (see Anaethesia Volume 8 Issue 2 Pages 108-111). Without an EKG, you wouldn't necessarily know if the person was experiencing arrhythmias which might soon lead to cardiac arrest, and without proper equipment or training, it would seem unlikely that you would be able to revive someone who went into cardiac arrest.

These are only some of the complications that might arise; there are still many others. There are also bound to be legal issues as well; I don't profess to know the law very well, but it is not hard to imagine that if the person died, you would be charged with a serious crime, perhaps even murder. I would imagine that this would still be illegal even if the person came to no harm.

Again, I am not trying to insult or demean you, but I think this is a very bad idea, and I am only trying to convey that it is likely something will go wrong if you do this. Even when performed by trained professionals in a hospital where monitoring and resuscitation equipment is readily available, there is still a real danger of complications. Medical play is fine, but administering general anesthesia such as you are suggesting is not play.



Ponyboy7 -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 12:49:40 AM)

I should note that ether is watched by the U.S. DEA because it is used in the illicit manufacture of certain drugs. Thus, by asking around and, if you for some reason stumble upon it somewhere, you open yourself to federal prosecution for intent to manufacture a controlled substance.

Seriously, I hope this is a joke because what you are suggesting goes well beyond dangerous into a realm I cannot even articulate. You will almost certainly do serious harm and quite likely kill any person you try and do this to.



AdoreMe5 -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 5:33:59 AM)

Ok, you all win, I won't be doing this scene.  Thanks for all the posts.



MissSCD -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 6:40:11 AM)

Surely you are  not serious about this.   You are opening yourself up to dangerous and brutal torture, rape, and anything else that falls on the category to reach serial killers and rapists. 
I think you may need to visit the doc.   Seriously, stop this before you get seriously hurt or killed, and we wind up seeing you on CNN.

Regards, MissSCD



mistoferin -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 7:39:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AdoreMe5
He unfortunately wouldn't share where to purchase to infamous over the counter ether/chloroform (sp). Well, that's a lie, he said his subs buy it at an auto store like trak auto but he wouldn't share the name of the product that contained the chemical.


Holy shit, he's using starting fluid to knock out his subs? Do you know what kind of chemicals are in that shit? Have you ever really read any of their posts here on the boards? NO ONE takes them seriously because they are OBVIOUSLY full of shit. 



mistoferin -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 8:17:25 AM)

You might also want to do a search and read some of the literature. There are reports that about 40% of the deaths attributed to inhalant abuse occur during 1st time use.



lurkingtiger -> RE: Medical Play (10/2/2007 9:32:22 AM)

<b>Ponyboy07</b>
I worked a guy who was sniffing ether to get high and collapsed. When we threw him on the cardiac monitor, he actually had Torsades Du Pontes, a rare cardiac dysrhythmia usually seen with pregnant or magnesium deficient people. My jaw dropped

And pretty much, he is actually opening himsef up for prosecution under the Patriot Act. It makes it llegal to use any commercial chemical such as ether to affect another person in such a manner that can be deemed poisoning.



tactileartist -> RE: Medical Play (10/14/2007 12:04:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AdoreMe5
When he said he wanted me to visit NY so he could put me under that was it for me! lol  Does anyone know what I could use that would put my slave under that I could buy over the counter? 



Wow.  Just... wow.

I congratulate you on your sense in not meeting anyone who wants to have you come over so they can put you under.

Aside from that...

My dom and I have a dynamic that focuses more on RACK than SSC; but what you're asking is way over the top.  I'm moderately concerned that you posted to the forum without doing any research yourself as to the potential dangers of administering chloroform/ether/any other general anesthetic to someone.  This information is easily found by a simple Wikipedia search:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloroform

Scroll down to "Safety".

Please, do yourself and your sub a favor, and do some simple internet research before seriously considering medical play of any kind.

Start with the following topics (as they will serve you well in other situations also):
Medical hand washing (not the same as surgical scrubbing)
Sterile field
Cleaning Small Wounds
Wound Care
CPR
First Aid
Tourniquet Safety
Anaphylactic shock

Frankly, it's my opinion that EVERYONE engaging in kink should be aware of these at the very minimum.  Accidents happen, and it's a good idea to have an idea what to do, or when to see a doctor.  Floggers and riding crops can easily raise welts or possibly break the skin; do you know what "clean" is in a medical sense?  Infected cuts suck, and not in a good way.  Ropes and carpet can abrade, or scrape, the skin.  ANY break in the skin is a source for infection.

Tying someone up improperly (as we all know) can cut off circulation; so tourniquet safety articles should have some good information to supplement the numerous essays already out there on circulation checks.

Allergic reactions can happen to some of the weirdest things, and it's quite possible to develop an allergic reaction to something you were fine with before.

[:(].... It sucks becoming allergic to aspirin at 34 years old.  I was fine for YEARS, and now I have to read all the labels for aspirin, acetysalicylic acid, and willow bark. Ugh.  Annnnnyway....

Whether you're Safe-Sane-Consensual or Risk-Aware-Consensual-Kink oriented, these are all very basic things that anyone can look up in a few minutes using Google - and for that matter, even if you're just plain Vanilla, I think these are things everyone should take the time to look into.





bottombob -> RE: Medical Play (10/14/2007 12:26:39 PM)

any time you put someone "under" u risk death, that way there's so many people present at operating rooms, all monitoring different functions so that person don't die. i say think real hard before you do that..



bottombob -> RE: Medical Play (10/14/2007 12:29:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

quote:

ORIGINAL: AdoreMe5
He unfortunately wouldn't share where to purchase to infamous over the counter ether/chloroform (sp). Well, that's a lie, he said his subs buy it at an auto store like trak auto but he wouldn't share the name of the product that contained the chemical.


Holy shit, he's using starting fluid to knock out his subs? Do you know what kind of chemicals are in that shit? Have you ever really read any of their posts here on the boards? NO ONE takes them seriously because they are OBVIOUSLY full of shit. 


i think their tring to start them up



slaverosebeauty -> RE: Medical Play (10/14/2007 12:42:32 PM)

I went 'under' whenI had surgerylsat year, adn I had ot sign all sorts of wavers and papers saying that I knew the 'risks,' I was of sound mind and body, and that I had someone to drive me home afterwards and she had to sign some stuff saying that under NO circumstances would she allow me to operate a vehicle, etc for at LEAST 24 hours; and that was minor surgery.  I cannot imagine 'playing' while under that stuff; I didn't feel any pain until AFTER I was coming out if it, {shutters}. 
 
I will admit, I DO know masterhxb, we have spoken on the phone more than a few times; and every time he spoke about that stuff, I would have panick attacks, and we were just talking as friends and sharing ideas.
 
Being 'put under' is serious stuff, even if you WERE able to get your hands on something, the legal ramifications if something went wrong out be through the roof. 



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