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The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 1:51:54 PM

meticulousgirl

Posts: 969
Joined: 2/20/2007
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Hello All,

i was speaking with a lifestyle friend the other day and we both were questioning why Masters choose to release a submissive or slave rather than just punnish them for whatever was done wrong.

Do you just believe that sometimes a slave is to much work, that they aren't worthy, or do you have other reasons?

i'm not asking for examples of release because it's such a personal thing between two people but, feel free to share if your ok with it.

Thanks All,

~meticulous~

Post #: 1

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 2:54:50 PM

julietsierra

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Joined: 9/26/2004
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Well, in our world, punishment is not an option. We don't have situations where I could contemplate whether the punishment is or is not worse than what I'm not doing. If I am not doing what I know is part of our agreed upon relationship, then I am refusing to submit. If I am refusing to submit, then why am I here?

Now this doesn't mean that I wake up in the morning and don't get him his coffee in 3.5 minutes made correctly and served in the perfunctual manner that I'm going to be released. Rather, release is something that is the option of final resort. Prior to that we do such strange things as talk about what's going on in our lives, how we're feeling and what he prefers I'd do and not do. I let him know if there are barriers to my submission that he's perhaps unaware of. (i.e.: he wanted us to go fishing one day and I said that since a really good friend of ours had just gotten married and was having a reception, I thought it would be important for me to attend even if he felt he couldn't. He thought about it, and did the "unthinkable". He put aside his fishing pole for that afternoon and we went to the reception. ok. so it was a bit easier on him that it rained that day, but still....) He listens and either makes adjustments or expects me to, depending on what those barriers are.

But for me, I like that I have this standard of absolute that is part of my life. There are no "negotiations." There are no moments when I decide "hey...the punishment is worth the crime. I submit. It's really that cut and dry.

juliet

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 2

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 4:10:11 PM

kyraofMists

Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
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He does not choose to engage in corporal punishment. There are consequences to our actions, but corporal punishment is not one of them.

On the other hand, I would only be released if I were to do something that irrevocably broke his trust; making a conscious choice to defy his will violates his trust in such a way that he could no longer continue the relationship.

Knight's Kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 3

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 4:53:34 PM

meticulousgirl

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Joined: 2/20/2007
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See i agree with both of you but in the case that my friend and i were discussing it's not something that was even lifestyle related and the slave ended up being released for not agreeing on an issue. Slave was under the impression after being told we are not mixing our lifestyle and "business" neither will reflect the other basicly but somehow it did in this instance and the slave has been released.

Punnishment maybe but release just doesn't make sense to me.

Now keep in mind there are more ways than just corporal punnishment to punnish.

Thanks all.
~meticulous~

< Message edited by meticulousgirl -- 10/7/2007 4:55:11 PM >

(in reply to kyraofMists)

Post #: 4

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 5:04:56 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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Joined: 10/25/2005
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Absolutely some relationships just need to be ended- punishment isn't always the answer.

That being said, lots of people end relationships because they really weren't ready or right for them anywy and will use any excuse they come across as a reason for it.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 5

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 5:53:57 PM

iammachine

Posts: 1549
Joined: 1/25/2006
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Punishment is a consequences, release is a consequences. "Punishments" should fit the criime, and sometimes, release is a final 'punishment' indicating there is nothing more they feel they can, or are inclined to do to salvage the relationship.

Release versus correction really depends on what the offense was. Sometimes, it's a matter of the sum of a lot of problems leading to a point where someone feels the relationship is not salvagable, or one event that just completely shakes or destroys the foundation upon which the relationship has been built.

If someone, in a D/s context or otherwise, does something that makes me feel that I can no longer trust them, or worse, make me lose faith and respect for them, that's when it's time for me to cut my losses. If someone just has trouble getting how I like my coffee right, that's minor.

Really it depends on how involved I am in the relationship, how important it is to me, and the nature, depth and expanse of the problems that are being faced.

_____________________________

I still hear you scream... in every breath, every single motion

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 6

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 6:22:46 PM

IrishMist

Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: meticulousgirl

Hello All,

i was speaking with a lifestyle friend the other day and we both were questioning why Masters choose to release a submissive or slave rather than just punnish them for whatever was done wrong.

Do you just believe that sometimes a slave is to much work, that they aren't worthy, or do you have other reasons?

i'm not asking for examples of release because it's such a personal thing between two people but, feel free to share if your ok with it.

Thanks All,

~meticulous~

In my past relationship, it was quite simple. It was his way or the highway; if I failed to comply, I knew where the door was and he would even help me pack my bags ( in fact, on one occassion he actually did that for me before proving to me that doors really can smack you in the ass ).
Since I had chosen to be in this relationship, knowing what his rules were; my choices were limited to one of two things. Obey, or leave. No discussion. No pleas for lieniency. And only ONE second chance.

_____________________________

If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 7

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 6:52:53 PM

Lumus

Posts: 5968
Joined: 9/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: meticulousgirl

Hello All,

i was speaking with a lifestyle friend the other day and we both were questioning why Masters choose to release a submissive or slave rather than just punnish them for whatever was done wrong.

Do you just believe that sometimes a slave is to much work, that they aren't worthy, or do you have other reasons?

i'm not asking for examples of release because it's such a personal thing between two people but, feel free to share if your ok with it.

Thanks All,

~meticulous~

For me, punishment comes into play when a submissive does something undesirable, is corrected and warned, and then repeats the same offence. [The first time I let slide with a warning and an explanation of why the action was deemed unacceptable. After that, there's no excuse.]

I will, and have, released for one of two reasons: either because the submissive is warned in advance that committing a specific act [or repeating a lesser act to a certain degree] will cause them to be released - and then they do it anyways; or because there are simply too many incompatibilities. This isn't to say I don't measure compatibility before I offer a collar [and I've only offered a collar a handful of times]; it's more reflective of things that occur afterwards, since people change and evolve over time.

I'd offer an example, but it would be based on my experiences and no one else's. It would more likely incite flames or muddle the original question via semantic argument than cause any good.

_____________________________

<Talk to educate; listen to learn.>

~ the other half of "L&L" ~

I have been dubbed the Rainmaker. Do not make me take your water for my tribe.

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 8

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 7:43:30 PM

Celeste43

Posts: 3066
Joined: 2/4/2006
From: NYS
Status: offline

Well if he released her for exercising her free will in an arena that he had agreed not to interfere with, then he was looking for an excuse to end the relationship. How could he punish her when he had already said he wouldn't interfere in her business? He couldn't and more importantly he didn't want to.

Personally I bet he replaces her shortly with someone he was already wooing and just kept the previous around until he was sure he had gotten the new one.

(in reply to Lumus)

Post #: 9

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/7/2007 8:48:30 PM

slaveluci

Posts: 4294
Joined: 3/2/2007
From: Little Rock, AR
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: meticulousgirl
the slave ended up being released for not agreeing on an issue. Slave was under the impression after being told we are not mixing our lifestyle and "business" neither will reflect the other basicly but somehow it did in this instance and the slave has been released

Then he said one thing and did another. That's dishonest and how could she be to blame for being under the impression she was when he told her one thing and then did something else? Maybe it's just me but I think he did her a favor. I personally could never trust someone who makes the rules and then changes them up with no warning. It would be like walking on eggshells and how could I be obedient if the rules change without my knowledge? I don't think (from the scant details given here) that either option was deserved (punishment or release).

quote:

Now keep in mind there are more ways than just corporal punnishment to punnish

Most definitely. I have had one formal punishment and it was definitely not corporal. That's not something He engages in..........luci

_____________________________

To choose a good book, look in an inquisitor’s prohibited list. ~John Aikin

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 10

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/8/2007 4:18:05 AM

RRafe

Posts: 2060
Joined: 8/29/2007
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Can be any number of reasons. From emotional control issues, to the simple realization that the bottom just isn't into the same things the Top is. You can't punish someone for being who they are. Futile.

_____________________________

I seem to be some wierd combination of Ren and Stimpy

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 11

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/8/2007 6:29:18 AM

meticulousgirl

Posts: 969
Joined: 2/20/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveluci

quote:

ORIGINAL: meticulousgirl
the slave ended up being released for not agreeing on an issue. Slave was under the impression after being told we are not mixing our lifestyle and "business" neither will reflect the other basicly but somehow it did in this instance and the slave has been released

Then he said one thing and did another. That's dishonest and how could she be to blame for being under the impression she was when he told her one thing and then did something else? Maybe it's just me but I think he did her a favor. I personally could never trust someone who makes the rules and then changes them up with no warning. It would be like walking on eggshells and how could I be obedient if the rules change without my knowledge? I don't think (from the scant details given here) that either option was deserved (punishment or release).

quote:

Now keep in mind there are more ways than just corporal punnishment to punnish

Most definitely. I have had one formal punishment and it was definitely not corporal. That's not something He engages in..........luci

I agree 100% that's just not fare to the slave who is going through it. You dont just mix business choices with lifestyle choices and that i cant compromise on. It's easy for a slave to feel obligated to just say yes Sir or yes Master to everything when it comes to the lifestyle but when a slave is flat out told dont mix the two, when she's been chastised for mixing the two and in a business conversation is told somethiing that disturbs her by her Owner how does the slave react without her disagreement coming off as disrespectful which is what happened.

I can understand where the choice of words may sound off or, may sound as something the slave needs to be punnished for but when she was told that the two were not going to be mixed, when the Dominant chastised her for mixing the two how backwords is it for Him to go and do the same thing and bring the lifestyle and the slaves release into a verbal disagreement over something that wasn't lifestyle related.

The whole subject just erks me beyond belief, I dont understand it but want to understand the Dominants logic in why there was a necessity of releasing her vs just maybe punnishing her for her choice of words.

~meticulous~

(in reply to slaveluci)

Post #: 12

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/8/2007 8:43:27 AM

toservez

Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

Absolutely some relationships just need to be ended- punishment isn't always the answer.

That being said, lots of people end relationships because they really weren't ready or right for them anywy and will use any excuse they come across as a reason for it.

I agree it really is not complicated.

Very simple, Punishment equals I still care for you and want to be with you but the power exchange part of our relationship needs work on your side. Release, means I do not want to be with you anymore.

These are relationships like all others in the world. There just is not any more complexity to the “release” because this life has a fancy term for it and just like in all other relationships a few people doing the breakup might try to keep it simple and guilt free by pointing to some mundane reason.

Those who release their submissive over and over are no different then a vanilla person breaking up over and over for whatever reasons from insecurity and the need to be in control to avoiding holiday gift and family time.

_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 13

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/8/2007 9:20:06 AM

WLC053

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Joined: 1/29/2006
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Interesting question, with no easy answer. If you make commitment and then break it for doing what was said would not have an effect then something went wrong from the git go. I would venture he was not seriously commited in the long run (personal opinion). It's a contract between two persons and one uses it to drop the other, using the very thing they said would not cause a problem. When I took my slave for a life partner we agreed that we could disagree on somethings as long as we did not go overboard with it.

(in reply to toservez)

Post #: 14

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/8/2007 7:28:51 PM

Redoubt

Posts: 185
Joined: 8/11/2007
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From the masters perspective, one does not simply throw away something of value... and if she (gender neutral) was slave, then the value of that relationship would have to be compromised before a master let it go.

Either one or both of the two were not equipped to deal with this relationship or simply - trust was compromised and this was the fallout.

(in reply to WLC053)

Post #: 15

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/8/2007 8:14:39 PM

Owner4SexSlave

Posts: 1311
Joined: 4/4/2007
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There are a number of reason's why a Master would release a slave. Does not all have to center around the slave having committed or done anything wrong.

First and foremost, I had released a slave because I want to persue a relationship where I myself wanted to feel an emotionally connection. Basically, Love and emotions were not why her and I entered into a M/s relationship.   It was a temporary/trial arrangement with no real set time. But after nearly a year, I felt it was time to let her go.   Basically, she was somebody I had know for a few years. She got out an M/s relationship and had nothing to her name, needed a place and was lost without serving somebody.   So there was a level of trust and knowing each other before hand.

I've had conversations with other Doms/Master that have released a slave due to lack of emotional connection. Amazing how much the desire or need for feeling emotions can be.

Now, other reasons I am aware of.   The Master releases a slave because the Master has a major life change going on. Such as no longer wanting a M/s relationship for whatever reasons.   Some people seem to find Religion. Some people discover they have terminal cancer, and want the slave to move on and find somebody else.   Again, all these things are nothing a Slave can be punished over.

Some in fact, release a Slave because the Slave requested for their Master to release them for <insert multiple legit reasons> here.   The master simple Grants this request.

Some Masters simply get bored with the Slave for whatever reason, Boredom can be a motivation in itself. Hey, I'm not going to pass judgement on anybody. I'm just sharing with you Reasons for Release.

A Master might be getting back together with his Ex wife of 10 years, this shit really does happen. A Master might be relocating due to a change in Job and the slave is unable to move for (insert legit reason here).   Not everybody doing M/s lives together. A slave might have kids in school and family and a Job of her own.

Now, in regards to a misbehaving. Yes, punishment is an option along with good old fashioned communication to fix a problem. Why is the slave not following the Golden Rule of OBEY? If nothing can be done to correct such behavior, what else is a Master to do but shit can their ass out to the curb?

Anyways, a slave does not have to do anything wrong to become released. It can be for completely personal or life related issues alone.

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 16

RE: The why's of release vs punnishment - 10/9/2007 12:21:35 PM

arayofsunshine55

Posts: 545
Joined: 8/1/2004
From: San Francisco, CA
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People grow apart. People get to know each other and discover they don't like each other. All kinds of things happen which cause a relationship to end. Even for those with a punishment dynamic, most of those things are not "offenses" but rather life. Like any other couple.

_____________________________

Sunshine

Is it not most transformative, most earthshaking, to pierce the veils of self-deception and illusion, and crack the eggshell of ignorance, to most intimately encounter oneself? Lama Surya Das

(in reply to meticulousgirl)

Post #: 17

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