RE: Mournful slave seeks advice

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MidnightMaiden -> RE: Mournful slave seeks advice (11/7/2007 3:02:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RRafe As for the gift thing? I hate having that bullshit pulled on me-it's arrogant. If I have to put effort, time, and any degree of struggle into something I have...I earned it-calling it a gift is totally dismissive of what I have to do to make the relationship work.. Respectfully, I did not mean it in that manner. Master gives (gifts me with) his time Master gives (gifts me with) his attention Master gives (gifts me with) his love Master gives (gifts me with) a smack In all these examples Master could choose to give these things to anyone, he gives them to me, I receive them gratefully. Are those not the dynamics of gift giving? This does not mean that I minimalize his effort, intention and work, if anything I am more appreciative because I realize that he could be giving (gifting) his energy to anyone, and he chooses me. In our talks this morning- Sassi says: how are you feeling today? Master says: Like a god Sassi says: shall I worship thee? Master says: thats a good start, then we can move onto sacrifices Sassi says: giggle I am trying to think in what way a slave could make a sacrifice to her Lord and Master, all that I have is yours, I have nothing to "give" you Master says: that is very true I gave him my self, my obedience, my trust. I could have chosen another, but he earned the right to be the one I made the choice to give myself too. After that initial choice, all else is now his right and cannot be considered a gift I give to him, that does not mean I consider each act I perform for him a gift, but I do consider that first intial act of giving myself over an exchange of sorts. Hmmm I did not mean to offend. We think of gifts as something we thoughtlessly pass out at christmas parties, secret santa, distant relatives who we are in the habit of mindlessly exchanging presents with. Again, respectfully, I put much more weight into the giving and receiving of "gifts" than that.

RRafe -> RE: Mournful slave seeks advice (11/7/2007 3:10:44 PM)
My point is this. Beyond romantic concepts-everything we do in relationships are exchanges. Inclucating the idea that a submissive grants things altruistically as "gifts" may be very glamorous-but hardly realistic. Try to get into the head of your Top a bit more. He may decide to show you what he does to earn them. And you may come to understand the same dissonances that I see.

MidnightMaiden -> RE: Mournful slave seeks advice (11/7/2007 3:24:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RRafe My point is this. Beyond romantic concepts-everything we do in relationships are exchanges. Inclucating the idea that a submissive grants things altruistically as "gifts" may be very glamorous-but hardly realistic. Try to get into the head of your Top a bit more. He may decide to show you what he does to earn them. And you may come to understand the same dissonances that I see. Everything in life is an exchange. When I buy a burger and pay for it, that is an exchange, I do not see that as a gift, that is a trade. When the exchange is done with thought, purpose and direction, with intention, I feel there is more to it than buying a burger, or a trading of goods. I call that something "more", that intention and focus, a gift, perhaps there is a better word for it? I don't perceive that notion to be glamorous, but rather receiving the exchange consciously and with thought, and with above all else gratitude. I could say that there are times that what Master gives me are lessons (not intended as something pleasant), but if I learn from that, is that not a gift also, the gift of growth? What can I say, I am a hippy at heart [:)] Perhaps this slave lacks humility and understanding, I can only offer that such a "gift" is received gratefully, with full appreciation of the effort required, and is meant as acknowledgement, not to minimalize.

RRafe -> RE: Mournful slave seeks advice (11/7/2007 3:34:17 PM)
Here is the deal, I dislike things that shift importance from one person to another. With no servant the master serves himself. The servant has importance. Is of use-value. Without the master, the servant has no one to serve, lacks direction. The two could be happy apart, but happier together-they magnify two into more. The gift that they give each other is the unseen gain.

MasterofScyn -> RE: Mournful slave seeks advice (11/7/2007 10:57:36 PM)
A Gift is many things. One may see a gift as one thing while another sees it as something totally different. You can't really define a gift. It is in the eyes of the one recieving and giving it. I'm might be totally in the dark here, but I don't really see how anyone can argue about what a gift is. A gift no matter the form, or action, or words... if it's from the heart and it's accepted in the way it is given... that is a gift. It shouldn't matter if its a physical object, or if its the person heart and soul. It's the meaning behind what ever it is that makes it a gift. Scyn ~ [sm=flying.gif]

MidnightMaiden -> RE: Mournful slave seeks advice (11/8/2007 3:13:13 AM)
They say a gift is in the giving and not in the receiving. This is taught to us so that we learn to give without the expectation of receiving anything in return, so we can give selflessly. There is a quote I read once, and I apologise for those who know it better than I if I have butchered it... "I know what I gave you, but I do not know that which you received". Not all gifts are received in the manner in which we intended to give them. A new love might think you would be exceptionally thrilled with an expensive necklace, yet you could feel pressured and overwhelmed, rather than happy at this expression of love. Giving someone something does not guarantee gratitude or appreciation on their part as the receiving party. I believe that a gift is as much defined by the receiver, as it is by the giver. Although my Master does not view his actions towards me as a gift, in my gratitude, I do. Edit to add: My son is 7 and he is autistic. When he was 3 I was told that he would never understand the concept of love, not the way regular people do. It's not in their wiring. If he ever said the words "I love you" it would be learned behaviour, nothing given from the heart. Now that he is 7 and he has surpassed all expectations, he freely jumps in my lap and hugs me and says "I love you mummy". It's genuine and pure, and it is the greatest gift I have ever received. Does he see his love as a gift. No of course not. Do I? Absolutely, I should be shot if I did not.

GrayGhost -> RE: Mournful slave seeks advice (11/8/2007 1:27:02 PM)
Many good observations here, but the one that is the most accurate is that you DON'T serve online. If you do you are just living in a fantasy world. You open yourself up for every gamer there ever was. This is why so many subs/slaves have such difficulty finding someone....they can't hold their emotions in check online, and it clouds their judgement. No offense, but you seem the type that if the person doesn't say just exactly the right thing in an email, you never give them a chance, and are probably missing out on some good people. If you don't have the capacity to sort things out online, find a friend that can help you. Sometimes two heads are better than one.

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