RE: Submissive service or not? (Full Version)

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daddyncherry -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 9:54:10 AM)

i think the tammyjo put it well when she said it depends on how you and the recipient view it.

For me, i tend to be service oriented, wanting to do things for my Master/Daddy to please him...baking...laundry..cooking....that type of thing makes me smile inside....Recently i was alittle surprised by a sub friend of mine when she called it to my attention, because she doesn't have much desire to be of service at all.

i tend to be helpful to people in stores etc. i let people walk before me and that type of thing as well...i have always sort of been this way (much more so now)...but not until being my Master/Daddy's slave have i given it a thought....Each time i do one of these random acts for someone else, it just solidifies it in my mind that i am a slave and that my training must be becoming so second nature that it shows up in places and instances like that.

So maybe what was always in me to be a "helper", "pleaser" is a part of who i am as a submissive...like a natural progression from that which is inate in me. Something that is being honed very specifically for my Daddy, but a part of me that was just there....Under these circumstances it has been able to thrive and has without a doubt made me a nicer and better person.



LadyHibiscus -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 10:09:24 AM)

I don't have anything new to add to this thread except PARROTLET ENVY!!!  LOVE those little guys!

(And I am only a slave to my guinea pig.  The african grey is my life companion, and understands that the gpig comes first.)



MistressDolly -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 10:17:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x

 
What do you consider submissive service versus just being a nice human being or a good friend?



I believe most people enjoy helping out another human being, but what distinquishes them from a submissive is that the submissive experiences personal fulfillment in serving, pleasing, pampering, gratifying, catering, satisfying, etc the needs of a chosen individual through surrendering power and taking orders.




CalifChick -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 10:31:31 AM)

When all is said and done, and it sounds like everyone is pretty much in agreement so far.... you ARE in fact the bird's subbie.  [:D]  Now don't make that mistake again with the paper!!!!

Gotta love a bird with attitude.

Sharon





peppermint -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 2:00:48 PM)

quote:

So folks, let me have it. Do you think doing those types of things are a submissive type service? Or just a normal caring human beings type of thing. 


I'm curious to know why you feel you must be able to separate submissive service from kindness.  Does the act take on more or less significance if it's done for different reasons?  

If i were forced to categorize each type of service i would have to base the distinction solely on how the act makes the submissive feel.  If the act makes the submissive "feel" submissive...then it's a submissive service action.  If the act makes the submissive "feel" as though helping a friend/neighbor/stranger...then it's a kindness/being helpful service. 

Wouldn't it be nice if we could firmly define all words?  However, since people are individuals with their own definitions for everything, defining words is much much more difficult.  Life is too short to sweat the definition of a single word or act. 



mistoferin -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 2:00:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x
If my neighbor had said, twice, get over here and mulch my flower bed, i'd have laughed my ass off and said do it yourself!


I probably would have the same response. However, if the same neighbor said "Gosh, I've been so busy working I haven't had time to get to the flower bed. If you have some extra time would you mind giving me a hand?" that would get an entirely different response. Most likely, if I had the extra time I would jump right in and help out.

I'm a lot like you in those respects. I often go into the homes of my friends and cook food, do dishes or clean. Some of those friends are male (and some of those males are even dominants) and I've often wondered how such actions would be perceived by a partner. While it may appear as though I am "in service" to them, I am certainly not submissive to them. I am simply being me...and me is a good and caring friend who likes to help out when I can and make people smile.

The same thing goes for when people stop by my house. If you leave my house hungry...well, it's your own damn fault..lol. Maybe it's the Irish in me, maybe it was growing up in an Irish/Italian neighborhood...not sure...but I tend to force feed people. I don't think that such traits are submissive...I think they are warm and welcoming.



Padriag -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 2:36:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x


What do you consider submissive service versus just being a nice human being or a good friend?
 
But i've recently talked to a couple of subbies whose owners resent this type of thing, claiming they are providing a submissive type service. I just do not see it that way.
 
So folks, let me have it. Do you think doing those types of things are a submissive type service? Or just a normal caring human beings type of thing. 

A few points here.

First, what makes something a form of submissive service in my opinion is the motive behind the action, less so the action itself.

Second, I've encountered dominants before who seem overly concerned about whether any of their actions are perceived as submissive in nature... and most of them were insecure individuals.

If you are a guest in my home, you'll know whether you are welcome or not.  If you're welcome, I'll offer you food and drink, a place to sit, to make yourself comfortable.  There's nothing submissive about my doing so... even if I do bring you a tray of tea and short bread.  Such things are done out of friendship and hospitality.  Try making demands on that hospitality and you'll find out just how quick it can evaporate.  You are a guest in my home at my leisure, not yours.  A submissive too might show such hospitality, but I doubt she'd balk if her dominant made demands on it.

Part of the difference is motivation, part of it is also the nature of the choices being made.

As for the bird, even there I'd say we are different.  I wouldn't tolerate it.  I've never trained birds so I'd probably just get rid of it.  Dogs and cats however, which I have trained, learn who the boss is and again... don't go making demands on my hospitality.  I have very well behaved cats.   My point being, maybe even in that example some of your nature seems to be evident.



LaTigresse -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 3:29:08 PM)

Another thing, kind of along the line of what Erin said.

For me alot of it is in the attitude of the person I will, or will not, do something for. If someone expects me to do it, or demands me to do it, I probably won't. Especially if it is something I do not enjoy doing, and even then I might bite off my nose to spite my face, so to speak.

I love doing things for people that do not expect it and are genuinely appreciative. It's when someone thinks it is somehow owed to them that I get totally turned off and will just walk away.



kyraofMists -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 3:52:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x 
What do you consider submissive service versus just being a nice human being or a good friend?
 


I have not read any of the other responses, so this may just be a repeat...

For me, to submit is simply to follow the will of another. 

If I am doing service for someone because it is my will, then I am not submitting to them.

If I am doing service for someone because I am following their will, then I am submitting to them.

Knight's Kyra



ownedgirlie -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 4:40:42 PM)

Hi Twice,

My thought is unless you actually feel subservient to the bird, the friends, and whomever else, and unless you were doing such deeds for Scooter and Jewel (meaning they expected you to help the bird, friends, and whomever else), you are not submitting - you're simply being a kind person (and spoiling your bird!).



Michaelsangel -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 5:29:47 PM)

In our house, i do all the cooking but that doesn't make me a subbie to all the members of our household(i flat refuse to be a sub to my 19 year old son and his girlfriend) i do it because cooking is something i enjoy and am good at. There are things i do for Sir that make me submissive to Him and only Him....also that make me accountable to him for my actions and to no one else, if that makes sense.

respectfully,
Michaelsangel



slavegirljoy -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 5:49:03 PM)

It sounds to me like you are a very caring person, a responsible pet owner, and a thoughtful neighbor and friend, much like my sadistic Master.  He is the most thoughtful, caring and, considerate person i have ever known.  He has a Dominant personality but, He doesn't Dominate anyone other than women He is sexually intimate with.  He is a sexual sadist but, He doesn't get off causing pain in animals or people, outside of the women He is sexually intimate with.
 
As far as i'm concerned, being kind, generous, thoughtful, etc. has nothing to do with being submissive.  Submitting to another has to do with being submissive. 
 
slave joy
Owned property of Master David



LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/7/2007 6:05:37 PM)

For me it's not about the act- it's all service.  I think trying to label it as dom and sub is falsely imposing some sort of boundary there that leads to all sorts of issues "That's a dominant service, you slave shouldn't be doing that!" and so forth.

But I can see internally if you chose for yourself that you would be submitting and expressing that submission through service, that would be legitimate.  But it's a completely internal process.  I think we can all think of a few subs who served even their own doms without a shred of submission internalized.



Twicehappy2x -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/8/2007 3:30:24 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

this slave sees a difference between being polite and gracious, and actively seeking and providing submissive service to a Dominant other than one's Master.


That is exactly what i said beth, they are two totally different things. Even if the friend being helped happens to be a dominant, they are not my dominant, just my friend.



Twicehappy2x -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/8/2007 3:37:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: peppermint

quote:

So folks, let me have it. Do you think doing those types of things are a submissive type service? Or just a normal caring human beings type of thing. 


I'm curious to know why you feel you must be able to separate submissive service from kindness.  Does the act take on more or less significance if it's done for different reasons?  


For me, there is a huge difference, i only submit to one who is my dominant. But i care for all kinds of people/things. I feed the birds, give the toad under my porch fresh bath water every morning, love my plants up with what they need, take soup to sick neighbors, lend a hand where and when it is needed.
 
Like i said, i am lucky, my pair knows and understands that is just me being who and how i am, it is not submission of any sort. But for those couple of subbies it is evidently an issue.
 
Imagine, making soup to take to a neighbor who was not feeling well or pitching in to put up a fence and your Master getting upset about it because he felt like you were submitting to the person you were doing something for.
 
Personally, i could not belong to somebody like that.



Twicehappy2x -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/8/2007 3:45:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mistoferin

I'm a lot like you in those respects. I often go into the homes of my friends and cook food, do dishes or clean. Some of those friends are male (and some of those males are even dominants) and I've often wondered how such actions would be perceived by a partner. While it may appear as though I am "in service" to them, I am certainly not submissive to them. I am simply being me...and me is a good and caring friend who likes to help out when I can and make people smile.


Me too, Scooter has come home and found me across the street, helping our neighbor who is an aspiring dominant work on his motorcycle. Luckily for me, he just pitched in. I don't know what i would have said if Scooter had taken that as an act of submission. Lol, thank the goddess Scooter knows better. I was just being me.

quote:

  The same thing goes for when people stop by my house. If you leave my house hungry...well, it's your own damn fault..lol. ...but I tend to force feed people.


Yesterday Jewel's daughter came for lunch with her friend from work again. I had just made a batch of chocolate cupcakes. "Eat the cupcake i told Shi. Her friend laughed until Shi told her "you think you are getting out of it?" Then i told her friend "Eat the cupcake!"
 
You know i am exactly the same way.



soultoshare -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/8/2007 5:11:36 AM)

I myself like to do all of the "little things" for people that often get overlooked in any kind of friendship or realtionship.  My last vanilla guy thought it was totally unnecessary for me to keep his favorite coffee in the house.  I'm a tea drinker myself, so I just bought an extra coffee basket for my maker to use for him.  And I'd have it ready when he got there.  When friends or family come over, I always have things on hand that I know they like to drink, or munch on.  I'm a nurturer, so that's the reason for that.

I do all sorts of random acts of kindness, and don't even think about it when I do...letting someone in traffic, the checkout line, carrying a bag, opening a door.  I like to think that we as adults haven't forgotten the basic manners we were taught as kids, even tho sometimes I see it as the opposite in most younger kids today.  One of my coworkers loves Whopper malted milk balls....I'll grab her a box of them when I'm in the store and stick them in her box at work.....just cuz I know she loves them.  That's just what I do.  And my work personality is definitely NOT submissive by any means!




Sinergy -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/8/2007 9:52:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

I don't see 'service' as strictly a submissive trait, whereas some people seem to see the word 'service' and automatically equate submissive - last time I suggested that dominants actually give a service, I was accused or wanting everyone to be switches...[;)] which seems completely illogical to me.
 
the.dark.

 
I have been a very service oriented person most of my life.  Years in customer service.  Years teaching self defense.  Years parenting and learning to teach and working at summer camps and whatever.
 
I dont see a contradiction between these and being a Dominant.  I am doing what I think is important and relevant. I is where I choose to devote my time and energy.  The purposes or drives which motivate me to do these things are of my own choosing.
 
I tend to think people who see Dominance and service as being antonymous behaviors are very similar to those who think Dominance and rude or obnoxious behaviors are synonymous.
 
Sinergy



fairerthanshe -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/8/2007 10:50:06 AM)

Greetings all,

This is a great topic.  He does not enjoy and will not participate in activities where he perceives himself as being a 'service top'.  However, he does take great care of me and of his pets.  Just in case he reads this, he is mean and cruel and is never nice...

well wishes ~ fairer than she



SayaNereida -> RE: Submissive service or not? (11/8/2007 4:43:17 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Twicehappy2x

What do you consider submissive service versus just being a nice human being or a good friend?

So folks, let me have it. Do you think doing those types of things are a submissive type service? Or just a normal caring human beings type of thing. 


I've been considering the question myself.  Here's the thing, even if I wasn't his sub, and we were a vanilla relationship, I would still be doing all the things I do: set up the coffee, get Him coffee when I get mine, His laundry, preparing His things for work so He doesn't have to hunt for them, etc.

About a month ago our coffee pot FUBARed in the morning and left us without coffee.  We were outside with the kids waiting for the bus and our neighbor came out.  She said 'good morning'.  We said 'morning, but not good'.  When she asked why we told her of our coffee problem.  She laughed, said she was sorry and left for work.  20 minutes later her husband, that works from home, came over with a thermos of coffee. 

It's just being a good friend, lover, wife, mother, and doing things to make others lives a bit easier or happier.  IMO





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