RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (Full Version)

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MzMia -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 4:51:41 AM)

Thanks for the replies.
This topic was posted in "Off Topics" because I was not directly speaking
about BDSM activities.
I just think the issue is interesting.



Lashra -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 4:55:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: untrainedKajira

nea has been raped in a previous relationship which was vaniila, the Man who did is still walking the streets looking for her.
nea is not afraid to admit that she is scared but it was the rape that had shown her, her true calling, so though it maybe illegal, sometimes its nessesary


Not to be mean or anything, but you really need to see a counselor if you think rape is a way to teach someone their "true calling" whatever that maybe. Rape is NEVER necessary.

~Lashra



Aneirin -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 5:01:46 AM)

Sex between two people where one of them is non consenting IS rape. Spousal rape exists as does non spousal, having sex with a married partner who does not 'want it ' is the same, invasion without consent.



MissIsis -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 5:32:13 AM)

Yes, husbands do rape their wives, & often, it is obvious to those who know him, her, or both of them.  Non-consent is illegal in the US. This may be just my opinion, but it is one shared by many others, as well.  Relationships should not be oppressive, or terrifying.  They should not bring harm, emotionally, or physically to either party.  It is quite different than S&M play.  There is lots of information on the internet if anyone wants to search for the difference. 

I may be wrong, but I don't think just saying a spouse raped me is enough to get someone tried & convicted, or put away for life.  There would be a trial with evidence presented.  I suspect there was plenty of evidence against him if that man in the case the original poster here was talking about, was given such a harsh sentence. 

Contrary to what a poster on here thinks, rape is never necessary, & I worry about that person's perception, & mental health, as well, as those who they decide to call their own. I hope I read that wrong. 

Rape can shatter a person's self esteem & can physically & emotionally scar them for life.  The person being raped whether by a husband, loved one, or a stranger is often left with spending the rest of their lifetime with these scars.  Is it really such a harsh sentence when the rapist can walk out of prison someday, yet the horror the person who was raped will have to deal with, will be with them for the rest of their lives?  

I haven't seen it mentioned in here, but it is accepted that generally, people who commit these kinds of crimes, often continue to do so, often, escalating the damage they cause even after serving time. 

I didn't see the program, but I definitely suspect there was plenty of evidence.  And if not, that is where appeals come in.  Our justice system is not perfect, but I still think it is one of the best there is.





came4U -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 5:49:09 AM)

If anyone didn't see the show yesterday..the one guy got a life sentence for kidnapping w/use of a weapon, not necessarily for the rape itself.

The rape may or may not have been used in court as one offical cause in sentencing, but most likely it was mentioned as portion of the abuse cycle with that couple.



mya75 -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:02:32 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: untrainedKajira

nea has been raped in a previous relationship which was vaniila, the Man who did is still walking the streets looking for her.
nea is not afraid to admit that she is scared but it was the rape that had shown her, her true calling, so though it maybe illegal, sometimes its nessesary


*nea*....Its heart breakening to actually read that you believe rape is in anyway neccesary,seek counseling ASAP..and if you posted that thinking you will get uber brownie points for being ultra submissive or slave-like I pity you...**I am never amazed at what I read**
To answer the OP yes I believe rape of a spouse is illegal in reference to your comment **"It appears MOST of these men were attempting to get their wives to "perform" acts they
were not comfortable with, this is really fascinating"** The difference is their wives havent consented or submitted to being used for their hubbies sole pleasure.Also dont you think that is the typical thing to expect them to say usually people who commit those types of crimes try to find a way to blame the victim and make light of what they did.



camille65 -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:09:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

Okay, sitting here waiting for the late night showing of the "Oprah" show.
The subject tonight is spousal rape, which I have always found fascinating.
One of the guests is a beauty queen that was raped by her husband.
Beauty Queen Raped by Her Husband 

This particular man got 52 years in prison,sentenced reduced to 22 years.

Many men are going to jail for raping their wives, many for life.

What do you think about this topic?
 What do I think?I think a rapist should indeed be in jail. I don't understand the purpose of this post, rape is rape. It doesn't matter if they are married or strangers. Spousal rape IMO is harder to deal with than stranger rape, harder to bring to light and harder to internally get over.



caitlyn -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:14:38 AM)

Lashra hit on a very important point - this is something that happens to men as well. This point, or more specifically that notion that most people choose to ignore this point, ties in closely with what Meatcleaver mentioned about this being largely political fashion. This isn't about men raping women, or husbands raping wives ... it's about one person, committing a crime against another person.
 
To me, the biggest problem I see, is the random nature of the "help" available to victims. CuriousLord mentioned being paraniod about a bitter ex, etc ... well, date a poor girl, because she doesn't have a fucking chance.
 
To my simplistic mind, this is another no-brainer issue, with a no-brainer solution.
 
1. Government stops wasting money.
2. Use money to properly fund help programs for victims.
3. With proper help available, standards for proof could be raised.
4. Actual criminals get convicted, actual victims get help, actual false-accusors get exposed.
 
Next!!



RCdc -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:18:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: untrainedKajira

nea has been raped in a previous relationship which was vaniila, the Man who did is still walking the streets looking for her.
nea is not afraid to admit that she is scared but it was the rape that had shown her, her true calling, so though it maybe illegal, sometimes its nessesary



I don't want to hijack the thread, but as a couple of people have highlighted neas post already, I just wanted to offer up a thought.
 
It is very easy to see her statement as a bit of a shock one.  I would not dream for a moment that she is simply posting a comment to get herself brownie points.  I would suggest without hesitation that she get councilling for the incident and report it, no matter how long ago it was.
My thought is that before people come down too hard on her, to remember that many come to the realisation of their orientation/calling - whatever you want to label it - due to a traumatic or major event in their life and that it is quite possible that her words are simply her way of expressing that - and not making the statement that being raped is right - but rather that sometimes bad things happen that do make us take a moment to look at ourselves and see something much clearer.  She is new.  She is finding her voice.  She is discovering her place in all this.  That is simply how I interpret what she wrote.
 
the.dark.



Celeste43 -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:18:23 AM)

I doubt there are many men. However of course a husband can commit rape, if the wife doesn't consent. Just as if the wife doesn't consent to being beaten for burning dinner, it isn't s&m instead it's spousal abuse. It's violence and power being used without consent to force someone else to do what the abuser wants.



sadisticmaster11 -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:20:22 AM)

spouses should be property.



MissSCD -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:27:07 AM)

I did not get to see that episode yesterday; however, I will put in my two cents.
Rape, physical abuse, mental abuse, child endagerment should be zero tolerance.
I had a friend who was raped by her husband.  He tied her up and raped her against her will. 
I was yelled and screamed at in my own home for five years while my ex husband had an affair.  He pushed me backwards in my own kitchen.  I went backwards and nearly fell on the back of my head.
Then he tried to come back home.  I called the police.  They are your best friends in times like these.  
It all goes back to we need to treat each other as we wish to be treated, but abuse is just what it is. 
If they had the evidence to convict this man, he got what he desered.  The only thing is he will probably retaliate when he gets out of jail.

Regards, MissSCD



RCdc -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:31:30 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sadisticmaster11

spouses should be property.


And what's that got to do with the question, do expand.
 
the.dark.



IrishMist -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 6:34:32 AM)

~~ fast reply ~~
I only read the first couple of posts... just want to point that out

Marital rape... it's a tricky one for me because I have seen men put away for life, who DID DESERVE exactly what they got... but I have also seen men put away for life only to have the wife or GF at a later date finally admit to lying about what happened.

Whenever rape is screamed, we tend to automatically go into the mind frame of ' oh my god, that poor woman; that man should be shot ". Withe everything that I have seen over the years in my job, I tend to be a bit  cynical when rape is screamed.

It does not mean that I condone a man raping his wife or GF; I just prefer to take the accuasations with a grain of salt.

I also want to point out that the particular case mentioned here; that man DID get what he deserved... it's just that not all cases are what they seem to be on the surface.



slaverosebeauty -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 9:45:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

Okay, sitting here waiting for the late night showing of the "Oprah" show.
The subject tonight is spousal rape, which I have always found fascinating.
One of the guests is a beauty queen that was raped by her husband.
Beauty Queen Raped by Her Husband 

This particular man got 52 years in prison,sentenced reduced to 22 years.

Many men are going to jail for raping their wives, many for life.

What do you think about this topic?


My exhusband raped me, I was told, 'a man can't rape his wife,' by his then parole officer. That PO has lost their badge after I filed a witten complaint and offered proof [my cell had been tapped due to something on-going at that time]; they asked if him being sent to 'sensativity training' would be 'acceptable' and I contacted a lawyer, the lawyer got results [threatened to go to the media and DA]. 
 
Once a woman says 'stop' or 'no' etc regardless if they are married or not, it becomes rape. I can't say I find this subject 'facinating' I ind it disgusting. The group I run on yahoo has had the topic of 'rape' brought up a LOT in recent days, to the point where, I had to declare it a 'dead topic' for a while.  It was all flaming and splitting hairs, and nothing I want to deal with at the moment; so it's been tabled until 2008, the members agreed.

Remember, rape is defined by concent, if someone says 'no' or 'stop' or does not give concent, then becomes rape. It's very cut and dry as far as I am concerned and from a legal view.  No concent = rape.     



Aswad -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 11:09:08 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lashra

Not to be mean or anything, but you really need to see a counselor if you think rape is a way to teach someone their "true calling" whatever that maybe.


Quite agree, at least unless there's a long chain of reasoning from A to Z that wasn't mentioned in that post.

quote:


Rape is NEVER necessary.


Never is a big word, Lashra.
An absolute.

Health,
al-Aswad.



LaTigresse -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 11:46:42 AM)

Of course men rape their wives. Probably more often than anyone imagines. Unfortunately, most of the time, it remains unreported, no one knows. It is a dirty little secret. "What will it do to the kids if I try to do anything about it?" "What will my family think?" "It's not like he hit me, he just made me have sex with him. He is my husband, I am supposed to do that, right?" Not many women will want to admit it, even to themselves. Least of all to an officer of the law, probably male.  It is easier for them to suffer in silence. After all, they married the guy right........



Zensee -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 3:18:30 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sadisticmaster11

spouses should be property.



The legalistic and logistical details are a little thin here, sm11.

Do you mean that both spouses own each other?

      If so - who has final say on how they will treat or be treated by the other?
     
      If not - how would the role of owner vs owned be decided; drawing straws, odd and even days, archaic presumptions about gender roles?

      

Even throw-away lines bear some thinking about.


Z.



Zensee -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 3:25:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aswad

quote:


Rape is NEVER necessary.


Never is a big word, Lashra.
An absolute.

Health,
al-Aswad.



That's a big assertion, Aswad. Care to share a hypothetical instance when rape would be necessary?


Z.



laurell3 -> RE: Spousal rape, Can husbands rape their wives? (11/8/2007 3:32:18 PM)

It shouldn't come as a suprise to most adults that a marriage license is not any type of guarantee of sex.  Of course husbands can rape their spouses as can wives.  Any time sex is truely nonconsentual, it is rape regardless of relationship.



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