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RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/15/2008 6:25:19 PM

HouseDom

Posts: 17
Joined: 9/24/2008
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I think it's important to recognize this proposed "definition" for what it actually is: a disclaimer. It is a definition with a motive. It's essentially a list of all the aspects of R/L "slavery" that could/would/should be most distasteful to the vanilla reader in a purported effort to define what goes on in the rest of the website. The document is an attempt to "thin the herd" of its target audience to ensure that only the strongly kinky survive--so to speak--and increase the likemindedness of its membership. So while everything it says is true (or twue), the entirety of the document is falsely definitive. It's not a definition because it is purposefully overstating the case. A definition, by definition, will state the case with exactitude and there can be no ulterior motive to its publication. I don't think anyone here can deny that this exerpt is intructive to some degree; but "slavery," in our conception, is much larger and more varied than the strict confines of the OPs excerpt. I almost suspect that whoever wrote the excerpt would actually agree as well, when pressed.

House

(in reply to bandit25)

Post #: 61

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/15/2008 7:40:49 PM

Rover

Posts: 2634
Joined: 6/28/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HouseDom

I don't think anyone here can deny that this exerpt is intructive to some degree; but "slavery," in our conception, is much larger and more varied than the strict confines of the OPs excerpt. I almost suspect that whoever wrote the excerpt would actually agree as well, when pressed.

Do not discount the ability of a sizeable number of BDSM enthusiasts (particularly those encountered online) to reactively cling to their fantasy portrayed as reality, and to refuse all efforts to discuss the issue from a logical point of view.

John

_____________________________

"Man's mind stretched to a new idea never goes back to its original dimensions."

Sri da Avabhas

(in reply to HouseDom)

Post #: 62

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/15/2008 8:24:54 PM

HouseDom

Posts: 17
Joined: 9/24/2008
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Yes, but what if I was REALLY pressing them? Totally different story, right?

(in reply to Rover)

Post #: 63

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/15/2008 8:43:45 PM

Rover

Posts: 2634
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No... really.

John

_____________________________

"Man's mind stretched to a new idea never goes back to its original dimensions."

Sri da Avabhas

(in reply to HouseDom)

Post #: 64

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/16/2008 9:05:43 AM

bound4more

Posts: 128
Joined: 10/3/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: txnights05

The OP asked "What do you think?"

I would find it a lot more helpful if the responses were along those lines instead of finding fault with the OP.

Perhaps a discussion of your different POV's on the topic of slavery would be more productive. What parts of this article do you agree with, which parts do you find fault with?

. . . . . . . My first impression is that a lot of people here seem to quarrel and belittle more than discuss in any meaningful manner. For someone like me who is looking for information, interested in learning and wants to hear all opinions, it is sometimes a daunting task.

THANK YOU - me too. Live and let live.

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You can tell who someone really is by how they act

(in reply to txnights05)

Post #: 65

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/16/2008 8:53:58 PM

FetishRose

Posts: 212
Joined: 8/7/2008
Status: offline

* I have set my own "limits", like any "normal" person should and they must be respected! CHECK
* I don't want my hard earned career experience/education to just go to waste; I need an Owner who will allow me to keep my career/get a career in my chosen profession/let me stay in school. CHECK
* I have dependants (children, relatives, et cetera) that I cannot abandon. KINDA CHECK
* I don't want to give up any of my friends or risk losing contact with my family. CHECK
* I have a "vanilla" interest (or two, or more) that I simply will not give up. CHECK
* I would never allow my Owner to share me with someone else. EHHH DEPENDS
* I would never be willing to share my Owner with anyone else, after all - they know I am the jealous type; I would insist on being my Owner's only slave!
* It's not like it's 'real' slavery anyway, you know: it's more like 'role-playing'; isn't it?
* I am [insert: race/creed/gender/sexual preference here] and I am only interested in an Owner who is [insert: race/creed/gender/sexual preference here]. CHECK
* I am an "age-play slave"/"gang-bang slave" and I am only interested in Owners who are couples/groups.
* I am an "[insert: animal] slave" and I am only interested in Owners who have farms/barns.
* I am a "non-BDSM slave" and I do not want any Owners who practice/enjoy any type or variety of BDSM.
* I have rights, you know, just like everyone else; and I would never give any of my rights up! KINDA CHECK
* Pretty much anything that includes: "I want" or "I need" or "My Owner must" or "I'll only be a slave if" et cetera. CHECK

Oh no! I'm not a slave!! Whatever will I do?!?!
*runs off crying*
.....
*comes back*
Oh wait, I never was a slave to begin with.
Hurrah!

(in reply to bandit25)

Post #: 66

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/16/2008 9:00:10 PM

sunshinemiss

Posts: 17673
Joined: 11/26/2007
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Who woke up this dead horse?

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Post #: 67

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/17/2008 4:50:28 PM

Huntertn

Posts: 715
Joined: 10/7/2006
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lolololololol..I'm sorry but......

(in reply to bandit25)

Post #: 68

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 1:38:18 AM

blacksword404

Posts: 2068
Joined: 1/4/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrPBK

In many ways i am still a novice posting here; however those who see my words seem to think I am way ahead of the reality. My take on the initial posting is simple.

What it describes classical slavery from the 1600's and 1700's.

In the 2000's there is no such thing as legalized slavery [period end point]. The concept of classical slavery is 100% illegal (as far as I know). One of the responders above would be closest when they said that slavery is a consensual agreement between TWO persons. A contract of ownership will not hold up in court and ... in fact ... may put the Master/Mistress in further legal trouble as other charges maybe placed before them in court by state and federal law enforcement agencies.

SOAPBOX

What we have here is ... the extreme scenario of a consensual ownership agreement. From my biased opinion it is the most dangerous form of agreement that can be made. One from which I can only imagine the slave to be shut, locked, and totally forgotten about at some point; or worse yet killed because it was the Masters/Mistress' "pleasure". These are the types of agreements I speak so loudly against; and it ought to be what the whole of the leather community ought to be opposed to and fight against as well.

From my own view of being Master: "The slave has the right to choose whom they serve; The Master/Mistress has the control during length of the relationship, and EVERY slave has the right to have an legal and respectful exit from the relationship" if they so wish.

Respectfully submitted,
MstrPBK
St. Paul, MN

LMFAO. I am sure there are people out there fighting hard as hell against your lifestyle also. May you both have success.

_____________________________

Don't fight him. Embrace your inner asshole.

Tu fellas magnus penum meum...iterum

Genuine catnip/kryptonite.
Ego sum erus.

The capacity to learn is a gift, the ability to learn a skill, the willingness to learn a choice. Dune HH

(in reply to MstrPBK)

Post #: 69

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 5:36:53 AM

JustDarkness

Posts: 1461
Joined: 7/25/2008
Status: offline

quote:

How Do I Become a Slave?

name yourself slave.....
no one is to judge you (besides perhaps your Owner)

< Message edited by JustDarkness -- 10/18/2008 5:37:57 AM >

(in reply to blacksword404)

Post #: 70

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 6:19:01 AM

tazzygirl

Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

some are slave to the throb between their thighs... even goes for some men... lol.. but that isnt the point of this thread

some are slave to the world around them... bills... duties...ect

some are slave to the thump of their heart

this is, in part, why gor is so attractive to me... a Master-slave relationship is a personal thing. not something for anyone else to understand, question or try and control. between TWO people, not some outsider looking in saying "tsk tsk, thats not the true way"

i am a slave to my heart, i find it almost impossible to serve a man i cannot respect and love. i serve men... i can only serve one man completely.

everyone is entitled to their opinion, the only one that counts for me is the opinion of the one i kneel before

(in reply to JustDarkness)

Post #: 71

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 7:10:53 AM

JustDarkness

Posts: 1461
Joined: 7/25/2008
Status: offline

quote:

this is, in part, why gor is so attractive to me... a Master-slave relationship is a personal thing. not something for anyone else to understand, question or try and control. between TWO people, not some outsider looking in saying "tsk tsk, thats not the true way"

it is not gor that makes the difference...if you ignore the outsiders then you can reach the same outside gor.
And lol....goreans do as much of the " tsk tsk...not the true way" (real time gor vs online gor for example)
..and an other gor is not about TWO people..it is between as much as people as you Master wants. :P

but besides that...I am glad gor does help you find what you want.

< Message edited by JustDarkness -- 10/18/2008 7:53:14 AM >

(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 72

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 7:45:02 AM

VivaciousSub

Posts: 446
Joined: 9/7/2008
From: Tampa, FL
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrPBK

In many ways i am still a novice posting here; however those who see my words seem to think I am way ahead of the reality. My take on the initial posting is simple.

What it describes classical slavery from the 1600's and 1700's.

In the 2000's there is no such thing as legalized slavery [period end point]. The concept of classical slavery is 100% illegal (as far as I know). One of the responders above would be closest when they said that slavery is a consensual agreement between TWO persons. A contract of ownership will not hold up in court and ... in fact ... may put the Master/Mistress in further legal trouble as other charges maybe placed before them in court by state and federal law enforcement agencies.

Quibble! The concept is not illegal whatsoever. The practice may be.

_____________________________

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To yield readily--easily--to the persuasion of a friend is no merit.... To yield without conviction is no compliment to the understanding of either. ~ Pride and Prejudice

(in reply to blacksword404)

Post #: 73

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 8:27:03 AM

Katchoo

Posts: 57
Joined: 11/11/2007
Status: offline

"slavery" is one of those terms like "love" that people may debate from here unto eternity. Mental masturbation.
In everyday life, in practice, the one and only definition that matters for a slave is that of her/his owner.

(in reply to OnyxDelphi)

Post #: 74

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 11:03:36 AM

anamericaninfife

Posts: 12
Joined: 10/7/2008
Status: offline

The problem with strict definitions such as these is that not all Owners are the same, and individual subs/slaves are free to pick their Owner. I, for instance, don't have any interest in using my slave as a dart board. I think that was probably written as hyperbole to get a point across, anyway, but still, the point is that not every single Master/Owner out there is going to want the same thing from His or Her slave. I also think that it's entirely possible for a "slave" to have a few limits or prerequisites, so long as they are established up front and clearly communicated at the time that the M/s relationship begins.

(in reply to OnyxDelphi)

Post #: 75

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 11:16:49 AM

Talandra

Posts: 111
Joined: 7/15/2008
Status: offline

Greetings subspace08,
the article did indeed come from rlslavery.com, it is infact the opening article of the website.

Wishing all well talandra

(in reply to bandit25)

Post #: 76

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 11:27:46 AM

OsideGirl

Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OnyxDelphi

A slave has no rights.

I've always found this statement horrifying and amazingly wrong.

"Slaves" have the right to be happy, they have the right to have a healthy relationship, they have the right to protect themsleves, and they have the right to leave if previous items mentioned aren't met.

I hate that this myth gets perpetuated.....and you've just added to it. That myth is why we have people in miserable or abusive relationships that think they van't leave.

There is no consentual slavery. It's an oxymoron. There is, however, an agreed upon dynamic which is consentual. That means that you can agree to give up your rights if the situation works, but you have to have rights to be able to give them away.

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to OnyxDelphi)

Post #: 77

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 2:24:09 PM

blacksword404

Posts: 2068
Joined: 1/4/2008
Status: offline

Being happy is not a right any of us have. Only the pursuit of it.

_____________________________

Don't fight him. Embrace your inner asshole.

Tu fellas magnus penum meum...iterum

Genuine catnip/kryptonite.
Ego sum erus.

The capacity to learn is a gift, the ability to learn a skill, the willingness to learn a choice. Dune HH

(in reply to OsideGirl)

Post #: 78

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/18/2008 5:35:05 PM

tazzygirl

Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: OsideGirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: OnyxDelphi

A slave has no rights.
I've always found this statement horrifying and amazingly wrong.

"Slaves" have the right to be happy, they have the right to have a healthy relationship, they have the right to protect themsleves, and they have the right to leave if previous items mentioned aren't met.

I hate that this myth gets perpetuated.....and you've just added to it. That myth is why we have people in miserable or abusive relationships that think they van't leave.

There is no consentual slavery. It's an oxymoron. There is, however, an agreed upon dynamic which is consentual. That means that you can agree to give up your rights if the situation works, but you have to have rights to be able to give them away.

i disagree. there is consensual slavery, alive and well, and living most probably next door to you.

i consent to being a slave.. his slave... the minute i say "no", all consent is retracted, and im no longer a slave to him. i see no oxymoron in that at all, but, to each thier own.

as far as being unable to leave... thats hardly the case for me. not too long ago i left a relationship i had thought i wanted for a long time. the fantasy didnt mesh with the reality, and it became unbearable. i left. took me a long time to walk out, but, i did leave. i have second guessed myself a million times over that decision, but, im still gone.

i often marvel as how some people equate slave with terms such as doormat, stupid or robotic. its far from the case for most of us. perhaps this is where honor comes into play, as much as gor tells us slaves have no honor. i have an honor to hold to my word once given. it takes alot to get me to break that word. once broken, there is no going back, alot of self doubt over the breakage, and some self introspection as to the cause.

i ended up breaking my word to this man. didnt matter that he had broken his to me many times with the excuse "I changed my mind".

"just because someone isnt what they say they are, doesnt give me the right to be less than what i know i am"

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to OsideGirl)

Post #: 79

RE: How Do I Become a Slave? - 10/19/2008 9:52:11 AM

NihilusZero

Posts: 4036
Joined: 9/10/2008
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

i often marvel as how some people equate slave with terms such as doormat, stupid or robotic.

"Stupid" especially.

Everything I keep thinking of to type sounds like it will go on into a rant. I think I'll go back to the OP and point out the parts that make sense instead. *nod*

_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

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(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 80

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