RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom

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RCdc -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 10:43:55 AM)
Next thread to come up will be - 'How can a slave own property.' You just wait and see...[;)] the.dark.

Mavis -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 10:47:10 AM)
yikes. This could be a 21 pager F/folks! okies. i am both a sub and a slave, (but that is because of O/our definitions, which may differ from others. in O/our dynamic, negotiating rights go with marriage and the label "submissive", the label "slave" goes with non-romantic service, obediance, loyalty and authoritative development and guidance) i function as an alpha at one house, a beta in the other. i am sub to my husDom of 25 years. i also serve an outside Master, who has a wife/sub of 25 years. As i explained in this post... it's much like having two good parents that are on the same sheet with their kids. They look out for the Others preferences and best interests before giving me directives. http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=362874 They both have areas where They have the highest authority, and so far, in 3 years, i have only had one service conflict when They both asked for ketchup.. which One to hand the bottle to first?? They saw my buggy-eyes, and laughed, and each said "after You Sir.. no,no, Sir-- after You..." They work it out, i merely have to obey once the decisions are made. How easy is that? i guess the basic manners and decency of The Hims plays a huge part in the success of the thing. The same can be said of His wife/sub and i.. i know my role and position, and am delighted with that, so we have no jocking for position, she is secure as His alpha. As property, i can be dismissed at will, but i also know my intrinsic value, so that doesn't concern me either. Shared authority and shared lives work best coming from a place of security i'm happy to answer questions, but long long threads get scarey... so much is lost in the cacophony!

ownedgirlie -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 10:49:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark Next thread to come up will be - 'How can a slave own property.' You just wait and see...[;)] the.dark. LMAO!!! [sm=biggrin.gif][sm=biggrin.gif][sm=biggrin.gif] It's easy - Master brought me home a puppy! [sm=tongue.gif] (figuratively speaking)

Mavis -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 10:55:27 AM)
oh yeah. i own and can buy and sell property in husDoms name if i have the proper documents. i can bouce checks, make payments on the house, or sell my car which has only name name on the title. i also run the business i hired Master as a contractor for.. W/we do some hat swapping as far as that goes, since i am in charge of the day to day operations, i lord it over Him sometimes <g> But, since He has mastered my will and emotions, (work in progress!) essentially He has soo much input on the direction of the biz stuff, who is running what? <giggles> oh, let the confusion begin..

charlotte12 -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 11:00:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark Next thread to come up will be - 'How can a slave own property.' You just wait and see...[;)] the.dark. LMAO!!! [sm=biggrin.gif][sm=biggrin.gif][sm=biggrin.gif] It's easy - Master brought me home a puppy! [sm=tongue.gif] (figuratively speaking) LOL! I have a feeling that if Master ever brought home a puppy this slave would suddenly find herself owning property again... Master: Your dog threw up. slave: A girl thought she didn't own any property Master: Well you own the dog...and his messes. Now clean it up! And you're going to be responsible for potty training him too. He's yours! slave: Yes Master [:D]

ownedgirlie -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 11:02:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Mavis oh yeah. i own and can buy and sell property in husDoms name if i have the proper documents. i can bouce checks, make payments on the house, or sell my car which has only name name on the title. i also run the business i hired Master as a contractor for.. W/we do some hat swapping as far as that goes, since i am in charge of the day to day operations, i lord it over Him sometimes <g> But, since He has mastered my will and emotions, (work in progress!) essentially He has soo much input on the direction of the biz stuff, who is running what? <giggles> oh, let the confusion begin.. LOL aw c'mon, Mavis, you're not laying on the front porch with a daisy stamped on your ass?! [8D]

AquaticSub -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 11:06:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: chellekitty sociologically an indentured servant is the the evolution of a slave, when slavery became illegal, they changed it to indentured servitude, and then made it impossible to leave that servitude, leaving the indentured servants in the same physical, mental, emotional, fiscal, and basically everyother thing but legal status of a slave...so....you are arguing that you are a slave Oside? Check your Colonial American history. Indentured servants predate what we think of as American slavery, largely because it was cheaper. You secured an indentured servant for say... ten years. They would probably die at about year seven from attack or disease. Much more cost effective than buying a person for the rest of their life when they would probably die at about year seven too.

chellekitty -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 4:05:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AquaticSub quote: ORIGINAL: chellekitty sociologically an indentured servant is the the evolution of a slave, when slavery became illegal, they changed it to indentured servitude, and then made it impossible to leave that servitude, leaving the indentured servants in the same physical, mental, emotional, fiscal, and basically everyother thing but legal status of a slave...so....you are arguing that you are a slave Oside? Check your Colonial American history. Indentured servants predate what we think of as American slavery, largely because it was cheaper. You secured an indentured servant for say... ten years. They would probably die at about year seven from attack or disease. Much more cost effective than buying a person for the rest of their life when they would probably die at about year seven too. i wasn't speaking of American history...that would be ethnocentricity in work....if you read the rest of the post that you took my quote from you would know what country i am speaking of and it was a trend that spread across much of the world...who's history is much longer than the United States of America by the mere fact of existing longer.... chelle

AquaticSub -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 5:54:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: chellekitty quote: ORIGINAL: AquaticSub quote: ORIGINAL: chellekitty sociologically an indentured servant is the the evolution of a slave, when slavery became illegal, they changed it to indentured servitude, and then made it impossible to leave that servitude, leaving the indentured servants in the same physical, mental, emotional, fiscal, and basically everyother thing but legal status of a slave...so....you are arguing that you are a slave Oside? Check your Colonial American history. Indentured servants predate what we think of as American slavery, largely because it was cheaper. You secured an indentured servant for say... ten years. They would probably die at about year seven from attack or disease. Much more cost effective than buying a person for the rest of their life when they would probably die at about year seven too. i wasn't speaking of American history...that would be ethnocentricity in work....if you read the rest of the post that you took my quote from you would know what country i am speaking of and it was a trend that spread across much of the world...who's history is much longer than the United States of America by the mere fact of existing longer.... chelle Chelle... your statement was "when slavery became illegal, they changed it to indentured servitude". You then move onto a specific country. That means that your statement only applies to a specific country and it's people. Meaning your point is completely invalid when you try to apply to anyone but those people. So... how does it apply to Oside? How is that defination any more valid than the American or European verisons of indentured servitude vs. slavery? If you want to talk about ethnocentricity so much why don't you look at yourself? You make an all-encompassing statement and then back it up with only a few countries and cultures and seem to expect it to apply to everyone in all cultures.

OsideGirl -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 6:23:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: chellekitty sociologically an indentured servant is the the evolution of a slave, when slavery became illegal, they changed it to indentured servitude, No, actually indentured servitude existed during the same period as slavery. In feudal England, common men would send their male children of to the homes of nobility to learn a trade, and in exchange provide labor for the nobility. It was widely practiced in the 1600s and 1700s as a method to pay for transport to America. It was a contract for set period of time typically 4-7 years. The United States during the colonial period even went to so far as to designate "free" and "slave". Indentured servitude could also be used as a way to receive professional training. So, you're incorrect that it was an evolution of slavery. So, while you give an example of what you've seen, you're giving an example of abuse of the system. And while I feel that the term "indentured" isn't an ideal description, I find it close. It's a voluntary contract of service giving the contractor rights for a set period of time.

OsideGirl -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 6:27:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: chellekitty sociologically an indentured servant is the the evolution of a slave, when slavery became illegal, they changed it to indentured servitude, No, actually indentured servitude existed during the same period as slavery. In feudal England, common men would send their male children of to the homes of nobility to learn a trade, and in exchange provide labor for the nobility. It was widely practiced in the 1600s and 1700s as a method to pay for transport to America. It was a contract for set period of time typically 4-7 years. The United States during the colonial period even went to so far as to designate "free" and "slave". Indentured servitude could also be used as a way to receive professional training. So, you're incorrect that it was an evolution of slavery. So, while you give an example of what you've seen, you're giving an example of abuse of the system. And while I feel that the term "indentured" isn't an ideal description, I find it close. Yes, some people were forced into it (just as some people were forcibly volunteered for military service), but again, that is the abuse of the system, not the definition of the system. It's a voluntary contract of service giving the contractor rights for a set period of time.

chellekitty -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/4/2007 11:57:38 PM)
the fact that indentured servitude existed before slavery became illegal does not negate the fact that people continued slavery under the title of indentured servitude....which is what i said, not that they created a new thing called indentured servitude

AquaticSub -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/5/2007 4:34:27 AM)
Actually... that is what you implied quote: sociologically an indentured servant is the the evolution of a slave, when slavery became illegal, they changed it to indentured servitude Nowhere do you mention that what actually happened is that they changed what was indentured servitude to fit their needs, allowing for what was basically a slave-like existence. You make this statement and immediately ask if she comparing herself to a slave, not allowing for the existence of other types of indentured servitude.

chellekitty -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/5/2007 7:55:53 PM)
i said sociologically, not etymologically...which would have indicated that i thought the word evolved from slave to indentured servant.... edited to add: and yes i asked...which is where i allow for the existance of other types of indentured servitude....you see thats how it works, you ask questions for clarification, then you wait for answers, not assume that this is what people mean based on your knowledge and experience alone....

AquaticSub -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/5/2007 8:46:42 PM)
Given the nature of the post, it really didn't come off a request for information. It was more a "This is what indentured servants really are - slaves. Is that what you are?" Either way, you are wrong regarding the evolvution of slavery and indentured servants. Sociologically it only went that way in a few places, and I would argue that it was not an evolvution but a corruption of a system, which hardly deserves the all encompassing terms you used. I do find it interesting that you say ask questions and wait for answers. You not doing that is what started this whole mess. You could have easily asked her what she meant instead of scolding her.

chellekitty -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/6/2007 7:35:53 AM)
glad that you know what i am thinking and the entire history of every country in the world as to interpret for me... also glad you know what Oside is thinking and feeling so well that you can speak for her... now that we have that all straightened out, we can let this die, since i cannot explain what i meant because you are not reading (nor are you going to) with an openmind and with expectations of what i am going to say... good day chelle

AquaticSub -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/6/2007 9:16:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: chellekitty glad that you know what i am thinking and the entire history of every country in the world as to interpret for me... also glad you know what Oside is thinking and feeling so well that you can speak for her... now that we have that all straightened out, we can let this die, since i cannot explain what i meant because you are not reading (nor are you going to) with an openmind and with expectations of what i am going to say... good day chelle Nowhere did I say I know what you were thinking or how Oside was feeling. I said what it came off as. Obviously, that is my opinion. You held Oside responsible for how her comment came off to you, why can I not do the same?

ghitaPVH -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/6/2007 10:07:11 AM)
~FR~ Ok, I havent read all of this thread and Im not going to jump into the argument just above me.... I am owned by only one, P. My Dom, Daddy, Husband, all those things...but Im also squired to M (my Knight)...and have sworn an oath to obey him. Ok, yea, I know its not anywhere near the same thing but it has caused me problems in the past. (made more so by the fact that M is also a Dom and is P's best friend and is Who is in charge of me when P is in Iraq or some other such unavailable place). There have been times in the past where their orders contradicted each other and casued me large amounts of worry and strife. Until I made a thread about it here and someone suggested I tell them and I did and they both laughed at me cause apparently I was thinking way too much into the issue than I should have and things are much better now. Now, if orders ever contradict..and yes, it actually happens rather often...things like where to stand, where to sit, who's drink to fetch, who's armor to re-string or polish or put on or take off in what order..I just tell them to work it out and get back to me. We had to work on "in batle" commands...things where I dont really have time to go "hey, you said go left, you said go right, fuck it Im going forward"....so whenever we are fighting, M is always Alpha...and whenever we arent in Armor, P is Alpha. Somedays I think they do things on purpose just to confuzzle me. But it works. They both talk constantly, and know what the others standing orders for me are....so they are good not to contradict and when one has issues with the others commands they work it out among themselves and dont leave it to me so it isnt too bad. ghita~

CreativeDominant -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/8/2007 8:22:07 AM)
I haven't read through this whole thread either. I can only speak for myself and I know that I would have difficulty adjusting to any situation in which I was co-owner of something, let alone someone. As Ghita noted, there are going to be conflicts...I know that I would have to be the 'alpha' dominant in such a situation if I were to enter into it and even then, I just don't see myself always in agreement with another male dominant as to the best direction for "our" girl. Like many on here, I will state that I suppose it is up to the individuals involved to make it work and maybe it can for some people. It certainly seems to for mavis...but there again, mavis is not involved sexually with her Master (I believe that is what I have read before). It certainly seems to for sambaman'slittlegirl but there again...no sexual involvement or romantic involvement with her daddy. And maybe I am cynical but I can't help wondering what happens the first time the husband dominant's orders or wishes come into conflict with the Daddy dominant's orders/wishes/guidance. One thing I have noted on this thread is that many who say it can work are those submissives who themselves have only one dominant. Several others have noted that it could work while also stating that it would not for their dominant. Yet, other than mavis and Ghita and sambaman'slittlegirl, very few examples are given of known relationships of this type. And I wonder...when play and sex are involved with more than one "owner", what happens when both want to play with the girl but not together? Do they flip a coin? Do they have set nights and throw spontaneity out the window? "puts on flame-retardant suit"

sambamanslilgirl -> RE: how can a sub be owned by more than 1 Dom (12/8/2007 11:33:16 AM)
to answer your question - Daddy and i will continue to have "play" time together (though the 3hr time difference will somewhat suck come August) as we do now. we're going to keep our morning/evening rituals as well as weekend time as scheduled. the rest of the time will be divided between UMs/hubby and/or both together. SO doesn't want anything i have with Daddy to ever change. he's such an understanding man and i'm very lucky to have found him.

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