Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not?

Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (Full Version)

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daddyncherry -> Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 4:03:59 PM)
This may be a dumb question, but hey, i'm bored and watitng for cakes to bake so i thought i'd try to put this out there anyway.[:)] So in my relationship, my Daddy is not one who thinks that his slave is a reflection of himself. If i do something bad, or idiotic (which i'm prone to doing) it is all on me. Conversely, if i do something great, he doesn't take pride in that either. That is also, all on my side of the fence. The thing that made me think about the other part of this query is a conversation that we had the other night before attending a play party. i was doing my usual, "psycho girl getting ready" thang and was all concerned that i was gonna be a good reflection on him...as well as trying to be comfortable in my own skin (yeah right)....and fretting about protocols if he decided to share me with someone else. Because regardless of what Daddy thinks about the whole "reflection" thing, people do judge and there are those who look at a slave and make assumptions about the Master/Mistress...this may not effect our life on any real level but, still..people do it and i want to make a good impression and don't want ppl to look negatively at my Daddy if i don't do some protocol thing, or call someone Sir or whatever. So Masters/Mistress do you feel your slave is a reflection of you? Is it like how parents will sometimes "own" their UM when it's doing well but not when it is being bad? slaves... Do you try to do your best when in public situations so as not to embarass, not only yourself, but your M?...and Not only not to embarass but to let others see that your M has trained you well?

missturbation -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 4:13:58 PM)
quote: slaves... Do you try to do your best when in public situations so as not to embarass, not only yourself, but your M?...and Not only not to embarass but to let others see that your M has trained you well? Yes i try my best when in public with Sir so as not to embarass Him. I also try my best when in public without Sir so as not to embarass Him also. Just because He isnt there does not mean i am not a reflection of Him. In my opinion my behaviour does reflect on Sir whether He is present or not.

juliaoceania -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 4:18:16 PM)
Simply, we are a reflection of each other.

slavegirljoy -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 4:33:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: daddyncherry slaves... Do you try to do your best when in public situations so as not to embarass, not only yourself, but your M?...and Not only not to embarass but to let others see that your M has trained you well? i try to do my best, always, whether i am with my Master or not, simply because it's important to me that i do but, when i slip and do something silly or embarrassing, it's not a big deal. i'm comfortable and confident being myself and i know that my Master is proud of His slave. He has seen me handle myself in some very stressful and important situations, in the past several months, and He told me how proud He is of me for being strong and keeping my cool and getting the job done well. i do stupid things, sometimes, and He enjoys seeing me get embarrassed. Grace is not my middle name. Luckily, Wwe both have a good sense of humor and always get a good laugh about my goof-ups. i know what you mean, though, because when i was in my very early 20's i was married to a much older man, who was very 'wordly' and sophisticated and, when it was the 2 of us, i was fine being myself but, whenever we got around other people, especially since they were all around his age, i suddenly felt like i needed to act like i was 20 years older than i was. i even bought 'old lady clothes' to try to look older. It didn't work too well. i was very uncomfortable with my little charade and i felt like people could see right through me and realize that i was just a kid trying to play grown-up with the grown-ups. It was way too stressful for me to keep doing that and i finally realized that i wasn't in my 40's and i didn't need to try to act like i was. It was a huge relief to give up on the 'sophisticated' act and just be myself. slave joy Owned property of Master David

phedre81 -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 4:53:02 PM)
The few times I have been in public, and it was known that I was under the authority of a specific Domme, I have felt very much like a reflection on them. To me, this doesn't mean that my actions aren't my own, or that I'm not responsible for them. It means, rather, that there is a greater level of responsibility which accompanies my actions. Regardless of how I view things, people will look at my manner, and make some type of judgments about my Owner based on that. My Owner may or may not care about what those judgments are, but I cannot imagine her tolerating me acting in a way that she would find...unmannerly. B/c that would certainly give an inaccurate representation of her and what she values.

Stephann -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 4:56:15 PM)
I'm with Julia on this. My girls are a reflection of me, in a big way. I am a reflection of them. What they do in public when we are together, shows what sort of woman I have encouraged them to be. I am reflected in their actions and choices, as well. This isn't to say they don't have individual responsibilities for who they are; it simply means who they are shines in me, and I in them. With the slave, especially, I have a great deal of authority over how she dresses, walks, talks, and reacts to others. Thus, if she behaved poorly in a situation, I would feel responsible. If she shines, I feel proud. That's just me, though. Stephan

MasterRobsalayna -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 4:58:06 PM)
Always. alayna is always a reflection of Master. Vanilla or lifestyle, it doesn't matter.

MaamJay -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 5:19:14 PM)
Hmmmm ... tricky! Yes and no. That doesn't help does it. I'll try and explain: Yes - in the sense of overall manners and self-discipline ... that reflects on the Dominant's values as a sub/slave should reflect those values in their attitudes and general behaviours. So as Master's sub i should be polite, and well-mannered, but also friendly. As a Domme, I would expect My sub to be likewise, and add that as I generally dress "well" (as in choosing clothes that flatter Me, not expensive ones), I expect My sub to be well presented or well groomed. However, since I would be the One with control over that, not really a problem! Master accepts that I have better dress sense than Him so allows me to select my own clothes, though for an "event", He does have final approval. He usually gets me to select His too! It is expected that we all abide by the general protocols of the event we are attending ... for that is simply polite. So if it says "No play outdoors" then I wouldn't be chasing My sub around the yard with a flogger ... and Master wouldn't do the same to me either! Key here is that Master also abides by them, being a Dom doesn't put Him "above the law". No - in the sense of pernickety protocols regarding names etc ... they're not really an issue in the scenes We have encountered here in Australia, most people are very laid back! Most gaffes like calling a male sub Sir by mistake would simply be laughed off here. And if i tripped over and dropped something, or even said something thoughtless (without being intentionally hurtful) ... that would be entirely my embarrassment and not Master's. However if Master witnessed the conversation and thought that i was being intentionally hurtful, He would likely pull me aside and have a quiet word about it and remind me to exercise brain before tongue! So I guess I agree with julia in that W/we are reflections of each other to a point at least ... and also with phedre in that my actions are still my own and i am ultimately responsible for them ... but because i want to please Master, i don't want to be seen as an embarrassment to Him so there is a greater level of responsibility. And it applies whether He is present or not. When I fly back to Perth next week and catch up with bdsmers there, I would not want to do anything He would not want Me to do (either as Jay or violet!), even though He will be holding the fort all the way across the country. Maam Jay aka violet[A]

daddyncherry -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 5:20:04 PM)
my Daddy's only thing that he sees as a reflection is if i am happy or not...so that is something i suppose.

Stephann -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 5:24:07 PM)
Hiya cherry, something worth considering, is that different people have different approaches to ownership. Some people believe that their car is a reflection of their taste. Others think that their car defines their taste. I have a leather jacket that I wear, because I think it illustrates who I am; I am not defined by that jacket, but my personality is certainly expressed when I wear it, without even opening my mouth. From what I understand of your dynamic, it's a safe statement to say that he might simply be trying to show you how you can be anyone and any way you would like in your life; that he doesn't have to define who you are as a person, but rather you define yourself as a person. For him, he gets to nurture that person, whomever it might be and become. Think of it as a man content to water an orchid; he doesn't control the color or type of beauty it has, but rather wishes to see it grow, naturally. Regards, Stephan

breatheasone -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 5:26:46 PM)
Yes I think we do.... I had posted something on a thread in the Gor forums, and got several negative responses. I went to my Master and told Him what I had "said" verbatim and asked His opinion...He told me He could see the point of view of the negative responses and explained why. I went to the Gor forum and posted and apology...saying I had sought my Masters counsel and He explain how and why what I had said could have been offensive. The responses to that post were very positive and many commented on what a "Good Master" I have(and I agree[:)]). That is one of the times I know I have reflected well on my Master.

dawntreader -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 5:28:36 PM)
i am with Julia and Stephann on this as well. we are a reflection of those we chose to associate with and vice versa. This includes my default world as well. However, when i am with a Dominant as His for the evening, there is alot of self-induced pressure to conduct myself in a manner that reflects highly and positively on Him and His choice of me, publicly and privately. i enjoy pleasing...what can i say[;)]

TreasureKY -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 5:43:36 PM)
A very good thread, cherry. I don't know if I'm necessarily a "reflection" of FirmhandKY as my appearance and behavior don't reflect any specific doing on his part. I do, however, represent his taste and desires in a submissive, and as such I want my representation to be accurate. [;)]

RumpusParable -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 5:45:20 PM)
I believe they are to a large extent, just as anyone who you choose to have close to you is. Slave or not a slave, the type of people we choose to be close partners and friends does reflect on us... hugely. It expresses a strong and intimate part of your personality, preferences, standards for interaction and standards on others' behavior. If I take a racist sub or life-partner and let others see them being racist and that I accept that in them, then I am showing others I condone racism. My sub's behavior and opinions do reflect on me. Does that mean every little thing a slave does is a reflection on me, good or bad? No. They're still separate people with their own flaws and virtues and quirks and such. But who they are and how they are does show parts of me by my associating with them on an intimate basis.

CuriousLord -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 5:59:51 PM)
Yes, a slave reflects upon her Master. This isn't nearly so true for a sub and her Dom. Masters control and shape the essense of their slaves. What their slaves do, who they even are.. is, largely, the Master's choice and responsbility. She thinks and acts as he has her do.. how are her actions, so long as they're those he's directed or led to, not his responsibility? A sub, though, isn't controlled and molded so much as guided and strongly suggested to. Her actions are still her own choice, she still does as she wants, even if that want happens to be strongly influenced. She's not owned- she's still her own, free individual (even if a "collar" may seem to contract it). She's very much still responsible for her own actions. --- About the parent/UM comparison? No, not really. A good parent has no business exerting the amount of control over their child that a Master does over his slave, for an M/s relationship is one that, ethically, must be consented to, sexual or not. A parent is, if one uses the loose comparison to the lifestyle, a Dominant. A parent that tries to be anything more is just a control freak who will, sadly, likely lead to their child's future need for therapy. (Sadly, there are many bad parents out there.)

Littlepita -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 6:04:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: daddyncherry slaves... Do you try to do your best when in public situations so as not to embarass, not only yourself, but your M?...and Not only not to embarass but to let others see that your M has trained you well? Yes, I do my best when in public. I would do that even if we were vanilla because I believe in being respectful to your partner and never embarrassing them by being a brat. Of course in M/s situation I think it is very imporant to be a good reflection of your owner so as not to have others judge. I also try hard in private to be a good reflection because I love him and want to be my Daddy's good gurl.

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 6:48:40 PM)
I often say I CARE about what other people think of me, but what they think of me does not CONTROL me. I think we're ambassadors to others. We are a reflection of who we choose to be with- and the closer we choose to be with someone, the more that reflects upon us. I do my best because that's what good adults do. Otherwise it's just showing off and trying to be perceived as more "slavely" and while 95% of the doms will start drooling over it, the other 5% (who can see what's going on) will seek out the ones who are just comfy, graceful, witty without basing how they act on their orientation.

slavegirljoy -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 6:49:16 PM)
i have to say that i really don't get all this talk about one person being a reflection of the person they are with. To me, i am a reflection of the sum total of my life, which includes my upbringing, my heritage, my education, my religion, my travels, my experiences, both the pleasant and unpleasant ones, and every person who has ever touched my heart or left an impression on me, which includes, but isn't limited to, my Master. And, my Master isn't a reflection of me. He's a reflection of His life, His upbringing, etc. He didn't make me and He didn't remake me. He took me just as i am. How i dress, how i speak, how i behave are a reflection of my values and tastes and education, etc. Just as the way He dresses, speaks, and behaves is a reflection of His values and tastes, etc. When i look in the mirror at my own reflection and when others look at me, including my Master, it's not some creation of my Master that is seen. It's the culmination of a lot of influences and a lot of living that is seen. my Master didn't choose to own me so that He could make me into a reflection of Himself. He chose to own me because He liked the reflection of the woman that i am. i guess i'm in the minority on this issue. But, this is how i see it. slave joy Owned property of Master David

Tigrita -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 7:07:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross I often say I CARE about what other people think of me, but what they think of me does not CONTROL me. I think we're ambassadors to others. We are a reflection of who we choose to be with- and the closer we choose to be with someone, the more that reflects upon us. Bingo. Said exactly what I was thinking and said it much better than I could have.

junecleaver -> RE: Slaves a relfection of their M? Or not? (12/4/2007 7:12:50 PM)
I don't think this is a dumb topic at all. [:)] It's something I've spent a good deal talking thinking about and discussing with my Dominant. My two cents: The company you keep, romantic or otherwise, will always reflect on you. The way you dress will always reflect on you. The way you carry yourself will always reflect on you. These things are not the essence of you. On a certain day of the week or period of time in your life, they might be completely misleading as to who you are, but they do reflect on you nonetheless. People will use them to catagorize you and remember you and even interact with you. And maybe people should be less judgmental and more fair, but we have to deal with people as they are, not as they should be. When people look at us as a couple, I want them to think, 'Damn, he's got a hot girlfriend' and then after some interaction I want them to realize we love each other a lot. I couldn't ask for a better first impression than this. As far as seeming submissive...my past experience is that the people trying to judge my 'submissiveness' measure it by a sliding scale of how likely they are to receive a blowjob. The only standard protocol I've ever seen anyone (except complete dorks) expect is good manners. I am definitely a reflection on my Dominant, but he thinks I reflect best on him when I am being myself. I do not dress well and act like a normal person just because I have a Dominant, but I do think those traits I brought to the table reflect well on him.

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