questioning motives (Full Version)

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serisa -> questioning motives (1/4/2008 3:29:31 AM)

i have read about how it is important not to question a Dominants/Masters motives... please can anyone expand on this?   if You suspected something He said was not true would You trust Him and ignore it or point it out? perhaps it would depend on how often it happened?.

if He told You something was going to happen, could be anything, something He said He would do, something You would both do together... anything at all... and it didnt happen... without any word or explaination from Him... would You ask why it didint happen or trust there was a good reason for the fact it didint happen.... again perhaps it might depend on how often you were let down?

thanks



cinnia -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 3:34:21 AM)

Perhaps this is not the case with some people, but personally I would question what happened and I would respectfully ask why.



NakedGirlScout -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 3:35:40 AM)

serisa,
Take what you read with a grain of salt and consider the source. You'll read any and all sorts of things out there. They are merely the opinions of the author and nothing more.

I don't believe that a slave or sub should not question motives. I think they should do so when they're confused or worried, or just in everyday life for curiosity's sake even just to get to know each other better. I feel that a secure dominant will expect to be questioned, so that he can explain everything to you and gain your trust and reassure you.

I've always questioned my dom's motives and I don't know how else I could have found one whose motives matched my expectations. Now that we've been together for a couple of years I don't question him quite as much, but that's only because I already know him so well that I can judge his motives on my own most of the time. A new relationship is supposed to have tons of questions.



serisa -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 3:44:13 AM)

thanks

i think i on a personally level i agree with you.  i would have thought perhaps a caring Dominant would WANT to gain your trust by reassuring you and answering your questions and concerns in an understanding way that would make you feel safe and secure and happy.
i would hope there would be less need for this in time too, as the relationship grows from strength to strength



wisteriaV -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 5:13:09 AM)

Theres nothing wrong with asking questions to gain knowledge and insight so you can better yourself. Sometimes NOT asking questions can be a problem and cause communication issues within a relationship.



Focus50 -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 5:39:49 AM)

Unaddressed trust issues rapidly develop into terminal relationship cancer.  I don't always explain the choices I make, esp as many are simply what pleases me, but that's not the same as the trust issues you're describing.
 
The worst relationship I was ever in was where I was in love with someone I simply didn't trust.  Never again - it goes above and beyond relationship dynamics, hence my submissive partners are always welcome to discuss any trust issue with me.
 
Focus.



sunshinemiss -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 6:27:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: serisa

i have read about how it is important not to question a Dominants/Masters motives... please can anyone expand on this?   if You suspected something He said was not true would You trust Him and ignore it or point it out? perhaps it would depend on how often it happened?.

if He told You something was going to happen, could be anything, something He said He would do, something You would both do together... anything at all... and it didnt happen... without any word or explaination from Him... would You ask why it didint happen or trust there was a good reason for the fact it didint happen.... again perhaps it might depend on how often you were let down?

thanks


Like most things - the answer for me is "it depends."

If this is someone that I know well and know that he is generally trustworthy and reliable, I would presume that something happened and would wait for the right moment to bring it up to clarify.  ("I thought we had plans, can you help me understand what happened?"  If I didn't know him well, I'd not be so inclined as to give him the benefit of the doubt.  You gotta prove yourself trustworthy, particularly in the beginning. 

The thing is, if you are talking about "trust"  then that makes me think you are already suspicious.  Now, truth is a funny thing.  Truth is often about how we see things rather than what is.  In your example, which I've highlighted, I think that there is always room for misunderstanding.  Was he just daydreaming, thinking you two were talking about a possibility someday like "yeah, let's visit the Grand Canyon next time we have some free time."  In that case, he wouldn't even know it was an issue.  If however it was something where you two had definite plans ala "the 7 p.m. of movie Blow 'Em Up at the Roxy Theater on Saturday" and it didn't happen, that's different. 

The key in my mind is to be open and curious.  Asking what his understanding of the discussion/agreement was, and LISTENING.  It doesn't mean you were lied to, it could be a simple misunderstanding.  It could also mean you were lied to.  If he says you have no right to question him, then I'd be verrrrrrrrrrrry suspicious.

peace



came4U -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 6:33:23 AM)

quote:

if He told You something was going to happen, could be anything, something He said He would do, something You would both do together... anything at all... and it didnt happen... without any word or explaination from Him


I have nothing but distaste for a man who will not or cannot follow through. My opinion of a guy like that is 1. he is lazy or 2. He doesn't take his roll as a Dominant seriously or 3. both combined: he is a lazy undominant bore.

Besides, some are lame enough to exclaim that 'any minute now the other shoe will hit the floor' yet they know full well it is only a tactic to keep you hanging on.  What a man says SHOULD be what he intends.

quote:

perhaps it might depend on how often you were let down? 


How many let downs will it take for you to walk?  One is too many IMO. 



breatheasone -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 8:05:53 AM)

Serisa, I understand how you feel. I believe you can and should talk about whats on your mind, and how you feel about it. Remember we are ALL human, and I for one would NEVER walk away from someone just for being human. Having said that, if he continues to break his word, then there maybe some more important issues going on. Only you can decide if its something you can or want to live with



batshalom -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 8:33:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: serisa

i have read about how it is important not to question a Dominants/Masters motives... please can anyone expand on this?   if You suspected something He said was not true would You trust Him and ignore it or point it out? perhaps it would depend on how often it happened?.

if He told You something was going to happen, could be anything, something He said He would do, something You would both do together... anything at all... and it didnt happen... without any word or explaination from Him... would You ask why it didint happen or trust there was a good reason for the fact it didint happen.... again perhaps it might depend on how often you were let down?

thanks


Questioning your partner in any dynamic is part of self-care. If you feel led to question him often enough, if you don't trust him to tell you the truth or to follow through with promises, compare that to what is healthy for you and make good decisions for yourself. Blindly trusting someone who proves himself not trustworthy isn't sublike - it's foolish.



littleone35 -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 9:31:41 AM)

There is nothing wrong with asking questions.  If you don't ask them you will be wondering why did he not do "whatever".  Ask him hopefully he will give you an answer that explaines everything.

Matt's littleone



meticulousgirl -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 10:46:09 AM)

it really depends on the situation as each situation we come across is different.

~meticulous~



Leatherist -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 10:52:51 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: serisa

i have read about how it is important not to question a Dominants/Masters motives... please can anyone expand on this?   if You suspected something He said was not true would You trust Him and ignore it or point it out? perhaps it would depend on how often it happened?.

if He told You something was going to happen, could be anything, something He said He would do, something You would both do together... anything at all... and it didnt happen... without any word or explaination from Him... would You ask why it didint happen or trust there was a good reason for the fact it didint happen.... again perhaps it might depend on how often you were let down?

thanks


If it's going to break the relationship, question it.

Better that, then get to the point that you just give up on him as a lost cause.



LadyLynx -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 11:32:36 AM)

Any person who tells me, not to question them, is not for me. regardless of their role.  I do not intend to do that to someone else.



juliaoceania -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 12:09:57 PM)


As far as following through, if I knew what was going on with him and why he did not follow through, why ask? If I do not know why, I may ask... depends on how important it is to me



RedMagic1 -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 12:35:57 PM)

It's almost *never* productive to question motives, but for a different reason.  Consider politics.  "The real reason George Bush did that is because of <fill in here>."  This leads to unresolvable arguments.  On the other hand, if you confine your statements to a pattern of events that unquestionably happened, you can take a strong position against people who disagree with you, and they don't want to knock your block off at the end of it.

I suggest that, when possible, you make declarative statements about things that really happened, and then explain how those patterns affected you, and ask for help in improving the situation.  "The last seven times you said you would come over, so I cancelled plans to wait for you.  You did not come over.  This is starting to cause me problems in several areas of my life, and I'd like to work out a solution with you."

It's also good to assume he honestly doesn't recognize this as a problem, and it's your job to point it out in a non-accusing way.  Assume malice only as a last resort.  You'll get less reaction that way.



DesFIP -> RE: questioning motives (1/4/2008 7:25:42 PM)

If you need a relationship where you have the right to question, then don't accept anything else.

Personally, trust here is earned. Both ways. We both have the right to ask and question, and learn.

But in the beginning there wasn't anything he wouldn't ever answer, ever. He knew I needed to learn whether or not he was a man of his word, a man who could take control and use it wisely.

You already know he isn't trustworthy, that you can't take his word to the bank. Do you need that to stay in a relationship or not? Only you know. I wouldn't stay in such a relationship but I'm not you.



laurell3 -> RE: questioning motives (1/5/2008 6:42:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: batshalom

quote:

ORIGINAL: serisa

i have read about how it is important not to question a Dominants/Masters motives... please can anyone expand on this?   if You suspected something He said was not true would You trust Him and ignore it or point it out? perhaps it would depend on how often it happened?.

if He told You something was going to happen, could be anything, something He said He would do, something You would both do together... anything at all... and it didnt happen... without any word or explaination from Him... would You ask why it didint happen or trust there was a good reason for the fact it didint happen.... again perhaps it might depend on how often you were let down?

thanks


Questioning your partner in any dynamic is part of self-care. If you feel led to question him often enough, if you don't trust him to tell you the truth or to follow through with promises, compare that to what is healthy for you and make good decisions for yourself. Blindly trusting someone who proves himself not trustworthy isn't sublike - it's foolish.


Agreed.



sakidorei -> RE: questioning motives (1/5/2008 7:20:35 AM)

i think RedMagic1 had a great way of approaching this type of situation.  Each relationship is different ... with different personalities and dynamics.  Asking why something you were told would happen doesn't happen is one type of questioning ... repeatedly questioning about motives is another issue altogether in my relationship currently. 
 
Master does not tell me that He is going to do something that He doesn't do.  If He is unable to do it ... He has always been willing to address that in specific with me because it involves His word given.  Now the answer might not be some long indepth revelation ... usually it's simply that He was dealing with a work issue.  He is very reticent to give His word about things or make firm plans unless He is VERY sure that He will be able to keep His word ... it's important for Him and for me in establishing and maintaining trust ... i know that i can rely on what He says.
 
However ... giving an explanation for broken plans is very different from -questioning- Him in general.  In every M/s relationship i have had prior to this one ... i actively asked a lot of questions.  While i think understanding is important ... in a slave dynamic i've learned that it isn't exactly essential.  If your Master/Dom is the type who wants His needs anticipated or wants you to live by the -spirit of the law- so to speak then ... understanding whys is critical.  If your Master/Dom is like mine and is very literal ... He gives a directive or makes a statement and that's it.  It's pretty black and white with Him and an extensive line of questioning is NOT welcome with Him.  He generally has no ulterior motive or one that He has no intention of discussing with me for whatever reason.
 
i trust Him to provide me with any additional or ancillary information that i may need because He has proven to me over time that He will.  i have always felt that the more whys i understood, the better i could understand my Master but in fact, i've learned that i've used that in the past to unconsciously manipulate or try to get my way ... understanding the motives leads to understanding where someone is going and well ... that can be good and bad.  ~laughs~
 
In questions regarding safety, the future, or plans ... i'm fine to ask.  The questioning of His motives on why i need to wear an item ... write a paper ... contact a person ... or whathave you isn't essential to our relationship and isn't something that He enjoys.  He wants my obedience ... not my psycho-analysis.  If it's an issue of me being asked to do something that seems confusing ... of course we can talk about it most times.  However, even then ... in the moment there are times when i am NOT to question, simply to act.  There will be time for processing later.  We may be out and i don't perceive a threat or see a situation developing that He does.  He might say ... "saki get back in the restaurant NOW" and if i am standing there questioning Him ... i may put us both in danger.
 
Learning the dynamics takes time ... i don't think there is a hard and fast rule that questions ALWAYS have to be allowed or can never be allowed.  Too many factors come into play for absolutes. 
 
~saki
Property of Master D.



starshineowned -> RE: questioning motives (1/5/2008 7:44:40 AM)

Greetings..~smiles~

There is a small saying that always keeps in the back of the mind: If you have brains..use them.

Think the overall statement of not questioning is only a resultant behavior After the slave has been shown that trust, and then it will naturally come for the slave in whatever area's that happens to be. Finds that trust will not be forth coming unless the initial communication from both present. Demand explanations? No, never. Ask the whys, and how-comes? Absolutely.

Well Wishes
starshine
Happy slave of Master Delvin



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