RE: It makes sense....

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Feric -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:19:26 PM)
For the record, Daphne took off with three children in tow. After the beatings she had suffered, she was pretty well beyond caring about the law.

Kalista07 -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:20:40 PM)
I think most women who stay in abusive relationships are just being weak whiners who are afraid to do what needs to be done. Please tell me that was Your dumbass comment of the day, right?? Have You ever lied in Your bead and held Your breath to make someone else believe You are sleeping because You are not sure if You are going to live through the night? Have You ever spent 18 years of Your life being trained, programmed, and positioned to believe that men have all power and women are just there to fuck and clean the house?? Have You ever wondered how You were going to feed Yourself? God forbide You should have UM's in this?? OP, i need to tell You that i'm struggling with finding the validity in Your statement.... All states have domestic violence programs and offer free DV counseling for You and Your UM's. In addition (i'm not sure about the law where You live) but in many states now physical fighting between the parents (or other adults in the home) is grounds for removal by the department of human services (or DCFS, or whatever it is where You live)... i understand Your frustration, trust me i do..... But the negativity and resentment that You are carrying around is dangerous for You and for Your UM's. Kali

laurell3 -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:22:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Feric For the record, Daphne took off with three children in tow. After the beatings she had suffered, she was pretty well beyond caring about the law. Well I hope Daphne is never caught because foster care or living with the father would not be good for those kids and that is the likely result. It's not all that easy to hide in today's information world and it's far from legal. Offerring advice to kidnap and break the law is just astounding.

Kalista07 -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:25:42 PM)
quote: Will these agencies actually do anything for my lo or are they all for "me"? I OP, If You want to email me i'd be more than happy to assist You in locating some well...assistance..LOL...In the county i currently reside in OP's, Restraining orders, etc, are taken very seriously...We even have a county attorney who prosecutes nothing but abuse charges...There is a lot of help out there for You...i understand it can be very overwhelming at first, but nonetheless it can be done...And bottom line? If You've been strong enough to live through it You've already done the hard part.

MissMagnolia -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:29:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EponasChylde That's a huge load of bullshit. The police do care...that's why they keep coming back and arresting the scum bag even though they know said abused individual is a dumb bitch who's going to bail him out and bring him home again. They keep arresting him over and over again in hopes that said dumb bitch will EVENTUALLY figure out that she doesn't need this asshole. I think most women who stay in abusive relationships are just being weak whiners who are afraid to do what needs to be done. Ditch the asshole and get out. As for being "absolutely blind" about somebody, that's usually the woman's fault. They put up with "just a rude comment" or "just a small slap" or "just a push or shove" when they ought to tell the dumbass to pack his shit the first time he disrespects them. (I'm not talking about things that happen within a loving BDSM situation but in reference to TRUE domineering-type behavior.) What a fucking idiotic statement. Get some life behind you before you give advice or criticism. 24 years on the earth and posts like that.....seriously, don't give advice. Or remember this when it happens to you or someone you love.

laurell3 -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:36:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MissMagnolia quote: ORIGINAL: EponasChylde That's a huge load of bullshit. The police do care...that's why they keep coming back and arresting the scum bag even though they know said abused individual is a dumb bitch who's going to bail him out and bring him home again. They keep arresting him over and over again in hopes that said dumb bitch will EVENTUALLY figure out that she doesn't need this asshole. I think most women who stay in abusive relationships are just being weak whiners who are afraid to do what needs to be done. Ditch the asshole and get out. As for being "absolutely blind" about somebody, that's usually the woman's fault. They put up with "just a rude comment" or "just a small slap" or "just a push or shove" when they ought to tell the dumbass to pack his shit the first time he disrespects them. (I'm not talking about things that happen within a loving BDSM situation but in reference to TRUE domineering-type behavior.) What a fucking idiotic statement. Get some life behind you before you give advice or criticism. 24 years on the earth and posts like that.....seriously, don't give advice. Or remember this when it happens to you or someone you love. Actually MM that's a pretty apt description of how I've heard many law enforcement officers talk about it. It is really the best thing to say or helpful? Of course not. But the point that law enforcement doesn't care was just as silly. They are frustrated daily by responding to calls from the same families where the woman won't leave. If a "weak whiner" is someone suffering from rather low self-esteem and are trapped by the feeling of not deserving better or knowing how to survive alone then that statement may be true ableit worded rather unhelpfully. The evil that you know can sometimes be better than the unknown is what many have told me. The point is, our country right now is pouring money into dv assistance. I've seen people get HOUSES and CARS to get out, not to mention clothing, food, shelter, therapy, schooling, medical care, language skills, reading/writing, almost everything you can think of as a service is out there available for those who take that leap and decide enough is enough.

Maestro66babycak -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:39:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DisenchantedLife Will these agencies actually do anything for my lo or are they all for "me"? It does seem, atleast here, that there is no hope. I actually have spoken very little to judges (mostly been spoken too) and have not spoken to any da's. So crazy, demanding, whining doesnt really apply here. I've spent very little time in court. I'm not excatly sure how to work the system either. The reason I say "stay" instead of leave, is while YOU may be able to leave... all you are doing is leaving the lo behind.. because the courts don't allow the lo's to leave. Leave as in - not be put in bad situations ever again. Before I left - I was always there. Always in the middle, always taking care, always allowing all the responsibility to fall on me. Now I am not there and he is often there. With out me. With out me shielding. Now there is no shield. Now he just suffers. Now his cries just fall on deaf ears. In leaving, I took my lo's shield away. I am at a loss and pretty damn hopeless in how to put one there for him. Still trying, but yet it still seems hopeless. I will look into the agencies. I will follow any road if there is hope in putting a shield in place for my LO. I do appreciate the responses. Even the flamatory ones. You've given me hope that there might actually be hope and if nothing else - another road to persue in search of hope. I do not understand why you didnt take your children with you when you left! If you gave birth to them you have as much right to take them and flee as he has to keep them and stay. I think it is selfish of you to leave them behind. I do not believe you couldnt take them with you when you left. You may not be able to take them now , because you are already gone... so now you must find someone to help save your kids. That falls under ' "Child Protective Services" . YOu can report any abuse of your kids to that agency and they have to investigate. Here are a few places that may help you...since i dont know what type of abuse the child is suffereing there may be some info here that is not helpful... www.childhelp.org www.safepassagecac.org www.childabuse.org www.childrenatriskinterventionfund.org Child Abuse and Neglect Hotline which is staffed by child protective staff 24 hours a day, seven days a week. The toll free number is 1-800-842-2288 There is a DCF in every state. You should be able to ask information for a telephone number for your town or state. Department of Children (and/or family) Services. CASA: www.voices4children.com Child Protection Services: www.nspcc.org. Self Help Center for California Courts(Families and Children) www.courtinfo.ca.gov Services - Project Sister Family Services www.projectsister.org/services Child Advocates www.childadvocates.org Well there you go.... There are lots more , but I am tired and I think you have enough here that you can at least begin with. Good luck and remember this: never give up hope. As long as there is life, there is hope.

Feric -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:39:41 PM)
I'm not suggesting she break the law or kidnap anybody. I'm just saying that if she's getting no satisfaction from the law, then she ought to think about running. Abusive relationships are the worst kind in the world, because the psychological trauma that the victim suffers is the worst in the world. The best thing to do is get out while you can. Sadly, abusive relationships are as old as the hills. I'm reminded of a Blackfoot Indian woman who was found on the American plains in 1835. She had run away from her home. Here's an excerpt of her tale: "I was the wife of a blackfoot warrior. Who was so well served as he? Whose lodge was so well provided or kept so clean? When he went out to hunt or to war, who aided to equip him but I? While he sat and smoked, I unloaded the horses...I served him faithfully and what was my reward? A cloud was always on his brow and sharp lightning on his tongue. I was his dog and not his wife. Who was it scarred and bruised me? It was he."

girlygurl -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:47:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: EponasChylde That's a huge load of bullshit. The police do care...that's why they keep coming back and arresting the scum bag even though they know said abused individual is a dumb bitch who's going to bail him out and bring him home again. They keep arresting him over and over again in hopes that said dumb bitch will EVENTUALLY figure out that she doesn't need this asshole. I think most women who stay in abusive relationships are just being weak whiners who are afraid to do what needs to be done. Ditch the asshole and get out. As for being "absolutely blind" about somebody, that's usually the woman's fault. They put up with "just a rude comment" or "just a small slap" or "just a push or shove" when they ought to tell the dumbass to pack his shit the first time he disrespects them. (I'm not talking about things that happen within a loving BDSM situation but in reference to TRUE domineering-type behavior.) WTF!!!!!! I was going to agree with you about the police caring, but I don't want to agree with anything you've said in this post. Where do you get off saying shit like this. How disrespectful can you be? Who's the dumbass? Pleaseeeeeeee tell me you're just being really off color here, and you don't mean this... on second thought, screw it, I don't care what you think. edited to say: pfft... and I just looked at your profile "glimpsed" I can't believe you're a chick and saying this shit. girly (not usually this vocal, but this pissed me off)

DisenchantedLife -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:48:00 PM)
quote: I do not understand why you didnt take your children with you when you left! thats not what I meant. I didnt physically leave my lo behind. I am talking about how the courts allow my ex to take my lo away from me for periods of time and god knows what happens in those periods of time and the lack of protection during those times. Sure there are no marks yet. Apparently I have to wait for marks to appear before I can do anything about it. The emotional marks have already appeared - but I dont think those will matter much in court. thank you for the links

laurell3 -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:48:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Feric I'm not suggesting she break the law or kidnap anybody. I'm just saying that if she's getting no satisfaction from the law, then she ought to think about running. Abusive relationships are the worst kind in the world, because the psychological trauma that the victim suffers is the worst in the world. The best thing to do is get out while you can. Sadly, abusive relationships are as old as the hills. I'm reminded of a Blackfoot Indian woman who was found on the American plains in 1835. She had run away from her home. Here's an excerpt of her tale: "I was the wife of a blackfoot warrior. Who was so well served as he? Whose lodge was so well provided or kept so clean? When he went out to hunt or to war, who aided to equip him but I? While he sat and smoked, I unloaded the horses...I served him faithfully and what was my reward? A cloud was always on his brow and sharp lightning on his tongue. I was his dog and not his wife. Who was it scarred and bruised me? It was he." She has a court order allowing contact or even custody (not clear here) with the father. Changing her identity and running with the ums is a federal offense and felony. REALLY bad idea.

Bound2One -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:48:49 PM)
quote: I'm not excatly sure how to work the system either. You need to get some good, solid legal advice that you will listen to. I'm assuming you can't afford it, but you can get it free or deeply discounted from your county's bar association. Google your county's name and 'bar association'. Call them and get some guidance. I worked in family law for 5 years and it was heartbreaking the stories. You need to be sane, logical and intelligent when presenting your case. The loopy/crazy ones tend to not present their cases coherently and this works against them. Another thought - do you have your act together? Do you have a home where you can provide for your lo? Do you have a job, a way to survive? That will work in your benefit when discussing custody with the courts.

laurell3 -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:49:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DisenchantedLife I do not understand why you didnt take your children with you when you left! thats not what I meant. I didnt physically leave my lo behind. I am talking about how the courts allow my ex to take my lo away from me for periods of time and god knows what happens in those periods of time and the lack of protection during those times. Wait...he was awarded supervised visitation only? Is that temporary or permanent? You WON this fight. Can you not see that?

Bound2One -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:50:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DisenchantedLife I do not understand why you didnt take your children with you when you left! thats not what I meant. I didnt physically leave my lo behind. I am talking about how the courts allow my ex to take my lo away from me for periods of time and god knows what happens in those periods of time and the lack of protection during those times. OP, I am so glad to hear that you didn't leave your lo behind. Honestly, I thought you took off w/o him/her and it bothered me greatly. As a mom, I couldn't understand leaving one behind to suffer. I do totally understand your issue with what happens during visitation. May I ask - how old is your lo?

Bound2One -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:51:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: laurell3 quote: ORIGINAL: DisenchantedLife I do not understand why you didnt take your children with you when you left! thats not what I meant. I didnt physically leave my lo behind. I am talking about how the courts allow my ex to take my lo away from me for periods of time and god knows what happens in those periods of time and the lack of protection during those times. Wait...he was awarded supervised visitation only? Is that temporary or permanent? You WON this fight. Can you not see that? Laurell, I'm missing something - where did she say it was supervised?

Feric -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:52:31 PM)
She has a court order allowing contact or even custody (not clear here) with the father. Changing her identity and running with the ums is a federal offense and felony. REALLY bad idea. [/quote] Ah. I wasn't aware of that. I must read more carefully in the future. Despite the unfairness, she must obey the courts until a final ruling is made. You are correct Laurell3. Added to which, if she is convicted of a felony she will lose all custody or visitation rights.

Maestro66babycak -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:54:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DisenchantedLife quote: I do not understand why you didn't take your children with you when you left! thats not what I meant. I didn't physically leave my lo behind. I am talking about how the courts allow my ex to take my lo away from me for periods of time and god knows what happens in those periods of time and the lack of protection during those times. Sure there are no marks yet. Apparently I have to wait for marks to appear before I can do anything about it. The emotional marks have already appeared - but I don't think those will matter much in court. thank you for the links Well sweety I apologize for jumping to the conclusion that you did leave them. You are very welcome for the links... any way I can help , just ask...

DisenchantedLife -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/18/2008 11:57:40 PM)
no its not really supervised. The fight hasnt been won, because my lo is still suffering. The emotional marks and affects are apparent on him. My neighbor came by last week and took one look at my LO and said "why isnt he smiling has he seen his father recently". The fight isn't won, because I still hear his cries, his suffering. My lo is 7 months. Until this started he was exclusively breastfed and hadn't been away from mommy for more then 3 hours. Can you imagine how he dealt with his first 8 hours? And yes my act is together. and no - I would never leave my lo behind. i am patiently waiting for something good to happen. Yet so far with everything going against us, I dont see how any good will happen. My next move is talking to an infant psychologist and hoping the courts will listen and take stock in that. I would be a happy woman if we were granted supervised visits and can't understand why they werent given in the first place. Why didn't the judge care? Or ask? I do appreciate everyones help/advice and even support. Especially the links which I will have to check out tomorrow. Its late and I am exshausted and people like to wake up awfully early around here. Thank you all.

laurell3 -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/19/2008 12:01:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DisenchantedLife no its not really supervised. The fight hasnt been won, because my lo is still suffering. The emotional marks and affects are apparent on him. My neighbor came by last week and took one look at my LO and said "why isnt he smiling has he seen his father recently". The fight isn't won, because I still hear his cries, his suffering. My lo is 7 months. Until this started he was exclusively breastfed and hadn't been away from mommy for more then 3 hours. Can you imagine how he dealt with his first 8 hours? And yes my act is together. and no - I would never leave my lo behind. My question was where is the legal case? Is this permanent supervised visitation? It's quite possible the um is upset because his mother is so upset. Eight hours of supervised (there is someone else present during all visitation correct?) visitation is something to cheer for as a legal victory. I understand it wasn't what you wanted, but it nonetheless is a victory.

laurell3 -> RE: It makes sense.... (1/19/2008 12:03:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Feric She has a court order allowing contact or even custody (not clear here) with the father. Changing her identity and running with the ums is a federal offense and felony. REALLY bad idea. Ah. I wasn't aware of that. I must read more carefully in the future. Despite the unfairness, she must obey the courts until a final ruling is made. You are correct Laurell3. Added to which, if she is convicted of a felony she will lose all custody or visitation rights. I'm actually not aware of any state that takes away visitation for felony convictions that are not um related offenses. I know of several convicted felons who have custody. However, stalking away with the child is clearly related to the child and I sure would not risk it.

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