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pollux -> Sex (9/2/2005 3:09:23 PM)
Ok. Complete newbie question here. Pretend I don't know anything about D/s or WIITWD or whatever (actually you don't have to pretend very hard because I don't). I see lots of posts that seem to want to keep the subject of sex and bedroom kink at arm's length. What's more, it seems that there's this undercurrent that interest in sex/bedroom kink is some kind of a sentinel that someone isn't "real" (there's that word again). One of our esteemed sub males was asked to list his strengths, and among them, he said this: quote: My feelings are genuine and not driven by bedroom kinks. Now, seeing as there is a prominent female dominant on the board here who advertises the following among her interests, which take up about 1/3 of the screen real estate on her CollarMe profile: quote: Ass Worship CBT Chastity Belts Creampies Cuckolding / Forced to Watch Enema Training & Conditioning Foot Worship Watersports Medical Scenes Oral Service During Sex Strap-ons Orgasm Denial Single Tails Spanking & Flogging Objectification Training Submissive Couples Vaginal Worship ....this is puzzling to me. Is it just a matter of politeness? Is it a sign of D/s maturity that one "grows out of" an interest in the sexual component? Is it an elitist thing? Is it really true that people who have bedroom kinks are not "real"? Is it the fact that some people just aren't interested in the sexual component? Is it part of the Mistress/slave dynamic that the dominant partner is permitted to profess an interest in certain activities, while subs/slaves are supposed to repress this? Some kind of a cultural tease & denial thing going on? And if it is considered desirable to minimize the sexual component for whatever reason, why is an entire area of the CollarMe profile form dedicated to sexual activities? Just a little puzzled by this dynamic. I might be imagining it, but I don't think so. P.S. Don't mean to open an old can of worms, as I'm sure this has been discussed. I'm just intimidated at the thought of sifting thru the results that will come back if I type "sex" into the search box. Links to previous threads much appreciated.

JohnWarren -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 3:29:40 PM)
One thing to consider what is meant by "sex." On one hand we have Clintonian sex and on the other JanetHardy sex. To Clinton, it was penis in vagina. To Janet, it's "it makes me wet." One needs to make clear where one means using this word. I see my play as highly sexual, but Libby and I reserve genital/genital sex just for ourselves.

KittenWithaTwist -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 3:30:38 PM)
In my opinion, sex is definitely a part of our lives as human beings. We're in a "lifestyle" that, if not always, at times, drives us in a sexual fashion. I was always frustrated by the naysayers who proclaimed that "D/s has nothing to do with sex". Frankly, I'd be a bit frustrated in a relationship that had nothing to do with sex. On the other hand, if someone sends me an email that says: "Mistress, I wish to serve you by licking your cunt" instead of "Kitten, your interests are compelling and I would like to talk to you about [something that isn't directly related to screwing]", I'm likely to mentally screw the mail up and throw it in the trash. D/s certainly has sex involved in it for me. I enjoy kinky things and I love having sex with my partners. But that isn't all there is to it. I also enjoy companionship, friendship, and nonsexual service. I rambled.

FelinePersuasion -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 3:31:47 PM)
A lot of people are not looking for sexual contact in their bdsm. I don't think being a bedroom kinkster makes someone any less real than all around kinksters. I personaly prefere people who can focus on stuff other than sex, because I don't think bdsm is all about sex, not to me anyway. but that's just me.

luvdragonx -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 3:36:00 PM)
I don't think that it's an aversion to all things sexual so much......just take a look at the regular posters and I think you'll see why it's not so prominent. The people who take the time to post their thoughts, gained through experience, are mostly people who don't see BDSM as just kinky sex. Power exhange is a huge part of BDSM. I believe that it takes a great deal of introspection and observation to participate in healthy PE via BDSM. The ones who have done so have probably found more fulfillment by incorporating both kink and PE. Sure, there are the apparent 'purists' who seem to put power exhange on this pedestal, and seem to feel that bringing kink into it just defiles the principle. Others aren't interested in the deeper points of BDSM and PE, they just like the kinky sex. Most folks fall somewhere in the middle, and if you look, you'll see who they all are. Some folks might think that if you limit yourself to one aspect of BDSM, there's no way you can grow. Those people have likely spent a lot of time on themselves, and would like to share with someone of a like mind. I'm sure you've seen enough threads about HNG to see why topics related strictly to sex are seen as suspect. I would also venture to guess that should one of the more established member start a thread on a purely sexual topic, the response would be better. Although they probably couldn't help but take it back to the mental/psychological discussion after a while [:D]

EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 3:36:55 PM)
The biggest reason I think is elitism. If you're into bdsm for the purity of the bdsm experience, it's somehow better than "just having kinky sex." If you would serve someone without sex, it's somehow purer than also being a sex slave. The other reason is that Ds and bdsm is about AUTHORITY, not sex, at its core. People in bdsm and Ds have the SAME hang ups and issues about sex that vanilla people do. Thus, they will hold it at arms length and be fairly puritanical about it just like vanillas.

OsideGirl -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 3:43:10 PM)
Sex is almost always a part of Dominance and submission. But being a submissive is more than just kinky sex, a play session, or bedroom play. It extends beyond that. People that engage in the dynamic only in the bedroom frequently get labeled as "Tops" or "bottoms". Which another way to say the BDSM D/s does not extend beyond whatever the scene/session/whatever you want to call it. So, what that person was saying is his submissivion goes beyond the bedroom.

anopheles -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 3:43:36 PM)
I would encourage you to ask any questions that you have related to specific activities. Folks here have a lot to say about particular activities, good practices, bad practices, etc. Just general sex talk though, doesn't garner much interest because most of the participants of this message board want or need to talk more about their relationship dynamic, keeping things smooth and comfortable etc. I think the vast majority have mastered the sex part, so it isn't talked about as much. [:D]

FLButtSlut -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 3:59:45 PM)
As pollux say, a good portion of the profile is about sexual activity. Certainly between the "serve for the purpose of serving" and "anything goes in the bedroom" we have all varieties in between. I get so annoyed with those who feel there is a right way and a wrong way to practice this lifestyle. For those who say sex has nothing to do with it, yet have a full time master/dom or slave/submissive, I would like to know if sex has nothing to do with it, then do they only engage in your purely "vanilla" types of sexual activity? As John Warren said, play is highly sexual. If one wasn't at least a little aroused or excited by it, why do it? At the very base level is the enjoyment one gets from the activity, whether it be licking your master's boots or making your slave stand in the corner in my opinion.

masterstrict -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 4:07:25 PM)
in answer to emeraldslave i must be living on a diffrent planet i have not found in all my years as a master that is so the most hang ups are from the vinala world where they dont talk about there desires and wants to each other i talk to all my subs and sluts as we go through training then you cant have this at all its all down to sharing with each other , puratanical never open and to the point yes nothing is tabo as long as the sub or slave life is not in jeperdyany thing is ok masterstrict

KnightofMists -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 4:33:51 PM)
sex - sexual Intercourse sexual - of relating to, or associated with sex or the sexes sexuality - the quality or state of being sexual These definitions come out of my Webster’s Dictionary of 1981. Our Traditional society has had a very narrow term of what sex is and ultimately many are redefining what sex means to themselves. The definition of sexual intercourse is very narrow indeed. Essentially it means either sexual penetration of vagina with penis or genital contact between persons. These definitions are much broader in the sexually enlightened world of liberal society. Understanding how one defines sex is an important implication on what you mean by being sexual or ones sexuality. The person that has a broader definition of the meaning of sex will result in a sexual state that encompasses a broader spectrum of behaviors and activities. Beyond this, ones inhibited or uninhibited nature as the case may be will affect how one will express their own individual sexuality. So one not only needs to understand our definitions of sex, but how we express our sexuality given by our individual comfort levels. Personally, my definition of sex has evolved to be much broader than the traditional definitions. I see sex more and more as a condition of intense arousal. How I choose to sedate this arousal can result in many actions/behaviors. Yes intercourse is very high on my methods of sedating this arousal, but so are other methods that can be equally as pleasing. BDSM to me is very sexual and provides a lot of gratification to my sexual arousal. I prefer to look at the BDSMseX, rather than BDSM alone. For me, D/s itself is a reflection of intimacy and not sexuality - which is another story all together.

lovingmaster45 -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 4:38:42 PM)
If I beat your ass, I will fuck your ass... Now that attitude has gotten me all kinds of grief from "formal" bdsm groups...ask me if I give a flying fuck.

StarAndRock -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 5:18:41 PM)
D/s is a style of relationship to me, a building of trust between people. However, sexual activity is associated with that style of relationship - but that's certainly not all it's about.

Nuke718 -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 5:19:02 PM)
While my BDsM activies do not always include sex in the strictest sense, it IS sexual for me. I can engage in a scene where neither I nor my partner will be anywhere near orgasm which for me defines sex. BUT the mental, and sometimes physical, arrousal that would accompany a sex act can and iften will occur. To put it another way, my dick gets hard in Ds or SM play regardless of the role I am in. So, while I think I understand the basics of sex, it is not ALL I need. WHich brings me to m y participation in the lifestyle. Do some people think I am not as REAL because of my outlook, sure! But some look down on me because I am a swithc and therefore cannot be a real Dom or sub LoL. Nuke }:-

KnightofMists -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 5:30:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nuke718 While my BDsM activies do not always include sex in the strictest sense, it IS sexual for me. I can engage in a scene where neither I nor my partner will be anywhere near orgasm which for me defines sex. BUT the mental, and sometimes physical, arrousal that would accompany a sex act can and iften will occur. To put it another way, my dick gets hard in Ds or SM play regardless of the role I am in. So, while I think I understand the basics of sex, it is not ALL I need. WHich brings me to m y participation in the lifestyle. Do some people think I am not as REAL because of my outlook, sure! But some look down on me because I am a swithc and therefore cannot be a real Dom or sub LoL. Nuke }:- depends on what you consider real is.... I consider real as a person that is being true to themselves and not to some society or cultural defined standard that one should live to.

krazysubbiekat -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 5:57:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nuke718 While my BDsM activies do not always include sex in the strictest sense, it IS sexual for me. I can engage in a scene where neither I nor my partner will be anywhere near orgasm which for me defines sex. BUT the mental, and sometimes physical, arrousal that would accompany a sex act can and iften will occur. To put it another way, my dick gets hard in Ds or SM play regardless of the role I am in. So, while I think I understand the basics of sex, it is not ALL I need. WHich brings me to m y participation in the lifestyle. Do some people think I am not as REAL because of my outlook, sure! But some look down on me because I am a swithc and therefore cannot be a real Dom or sub LoL. Nuke }:- Hmmmm...i personally define real as having a pulse...quick check...do you have a pulse? lol No seriously, i think that if someone has a grasp on WIITWD, like you apparently do, Nuke, then you are real. My defintion of non-real people are the HNG's, the deliberately uninformed, and the wankers. None of which i would call you.

sultryvoice -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 6:00:52 PM)
Yes bdsm is sexual, sensual and all those good, fun things! But I want more than that.. A relationship based on sex only, never makes it. There has to be more to hold a relationship together. I want to know that the person I am with has more in common with me.. I look for those things first. It doesn't matter if you are lifestyle or vanilla, it still holds true. The power exchange, to me, is very much a turn on. But it doesn't mean that I jump on that Dominant. Good things come about in time..The trust and respect should be established first. Everything can follow suit.. If the Dominant writes only on a sexual plane, I won't have anything to do with him. It's not elitist, it's that I know there is more and sex is the fudge topping on the sundae! Respectfully, sultry

MsPurrmeow -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 6:24:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pollux I see lots of posts that seem to want to keep the subject of sex and bedroom kink at arm's length. What's more, it seems that there's this undercurrent that interest in sex/bedroom kink is some kind of a sentinel that someone isn't "real" (there's that word again). My intention in avoiding focusing on the conversation is simply that it is not the central core of a relationship for me. I want the relationship where sex is optional (and desired) not required, or even the basis it is built on. When and if I find the person who otherwise fits my desires, they will also be close enough and intimate enough with me that it will happen. We're human, it's pretty much a default. There are a few assumptions I can make in this lifestyle. In GENERAL (yes, a generalization) I can expect that some level of intimacy will exist. Just about everyone has genitalia and most people have a sex drive, what we do with that will depend on how the rest of the relationship develops. If there is an ongoing developing relationship between two healthy adults, there is usually a sexual aspect. Whether it's sexual tension, sexuality/sensuality, or plain old "Tab A-Slot B" action, it will be there. If someone tries to focus on it up front, there usually isn't a relationship underneath to dig up. That's been my experience. I think it's more about trying to get someone to focus on the OTHER part of the interaction. I don't focus on sex in my interactions online because online, it doesn't matter. When I'm conversing with a person, I don't care how horny they are at that moment. If they are looking for stroking material from a simple conversation, I know that they are not capable or interested in the other /insert percentage here/ of real, daily life. If our bodies, hearts and spirits are revolving in similar orbits, there WILL be something sexual. It just doesn't matter before we get to that point. Oh yeah, a person who fulfills my D/s, kink and daily life needs and puts me first will highly likely keep my motor running rather well, so it's not like it's going to be a platonic exchange. I'm being honest in focusing on service, honor, trust and power exchange. Those ARE the things that will turn me on and get me in a sexual mood. Purr

WickedKev -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 6:29:51 PM)
My domination of my slave is very sexual now if that make me ;not real' in peoples eyes so be it, I am not out to impress anyone but my slave. If I play with someone in a club that is more topping but it is still sexual (without sexual intercourse). I have no time for people who proclaim my brand of BDSM is the only real brand. If two people in a relationship decide that picking each others noses is part of BDSM for them then who the hell am I to say otherwise?

NakedOnMyChain -> RE: Sex (9/2/2005 6:53:51 PM)
To me sex is an integral part of my play experiences. I'm not saying that I don't play without having sex, just that I enjoy that part of it. I like the way that it makes me feel closer to master. Maybe it's the fact that I'm married to my dom. Maybe it's that I just genuinely enjoy sex. It could be any number of factors. But my enjoyment of sex in relation to the scene doesn't make me a poser. It just makes me, well... me. You could ask someone else in a similar situation, and get a polar opposite in response. Hey, to each their own. I have my strange kicks, and I'm not going to deny someone else theirs.

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