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RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/29/2008 8:21:15 PM   
Aimtoplease101


Posts: 319
Joined: 2/8/2006
From: San Diego, California
Status: offline 		Since everything we engage here is, in reality, consensual, there's not really a difference. We don't have literal slaves anymore, at least not legally and not in this country.

However, many have adopted connotative differences between the terms. The term slave tends to imply a person "owned" by one or more specific owners, and has come to be understood as essentially a deeper form of submission.

The term submissive has come more to identify the person's D/s orientation, and not necessarily his/her role in any specific relationship. Thus, dominant, switch, submissive signal a person's orientation, whereas Mistress, slave, etc., describe their role in a specific D/s relationship.

Take these as guidelines only-- terms like this tend to be somewhat elastic and free flowing, and many people will adopt their own working definitions along the way.

Regards, ATP

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Pleasing you pleases me.

(in reply to northwindrise)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/29/2008 8:44:21 PM   
petpete


Posts: 677
Joined: 7/6/2007
Status: offline 		i am sorry north for what has happened but we have to accept what is imposed by us. Part of a subs routine is to swallow his feelings and go on, take decisions of what to do and life goes on. You only live once boy and don't let it get to your head. i know Just like any relationship you will go through your grieving time deal with it and get over with it. Nothing lusts for ever boy at least for some of us anyway.. But everything will have an end sooner or later, and maybe its time for a new start for you. Maybe this relationship was getting not where You both expected and some of us cant accept it till we are told. Take care boy... Life is not over till the fat lady sings!! (ummm)

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Max: And loving it!


(in reply to northwindrise)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/29/2008 8:52:43 PM   
faerytattoodgirl


Posts: 5824
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: northwindrise

Thank you all that have responded. I must not be a slave, I do not work at mcd!!!!!
But seriously, I started working as a gardener a few years ago for a Domme (pro) in exchange for sessions and eventually she put a collar on me and deemed me her slave. I have never served another Mistress so I really do not know the differance other than I was told I was now owned. I was told to see certain Mistress for additional training. I was used in session for her benefit with clients.
The reason for asking is because the relationship has been going south as she has gotten new slaves that she prefers over me. I had complained to no avail. I was telling a friend about all this and he never realized that Mistress considered me a slave and not a sub. Then he told me there is a big differance and Mistress can treat her property as she wishes. The drag is that if I want to see another I have to ask for permission. And Mistress knows alot of other Mistess so cheating is out of the question.
It was his suggestion that I look up the differance. So I asked you guys because so often there are great words of wisdom spoken here.
Thanks again.
And I never eat at McDonalds or Subway. I am into healthy food.
Northwind rise
"Up in the morning , watch the northwind rise"  Jorma Kaukonan (Hot Tuna)


i'd just up and leave...so what if she knows others...she dont know them all.  you can also find one through collarme.  i have never been a fan of poly.  i tried it..and the same thing thats happening to u happened to me.  you eventually get ignored/neglected and un loved.  it was a 24-7 tpe.  your never going to get away if you dont take the initiative to leave.  its like alot of marriages..they just  dont want to leave them...

note that not all poly is this way.  so im not saying they all are.

and subway is healthy food.  most of us eat the same thing at home when we make sandwiches.


< Message edited by faerytattoodgirl -- 1/29/2008 8:53:28 PM >

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I did not reply to your cmail.
I am flawed.
Imperfect.
MUST SPANK!!!
SPAAAAAAAANK!!!

(in reply to northwindrise)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 3:18:52 AM   
MsCfromMelbourne


Posts: 777
Joined: 2/15/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: northwindrise


The reason for asking is because the relationship has been going south as she has gotten new slaves that she prefers over me. I had complained to no avail.

... The drag is that if I want to see another I have to ask for permission. And Mistress knows alot of other Mistess so cheating is out of the question.



Sorry to hear this has happened to you. 

However you have enjoyed a unique life experience.  You were the property of a pro-domme for a while.  Many men can only fantasise what that would be like.

Something like this has happened to me a long time ago.  A slave of a pro-domme was no longer happy serving her after about 8 years and wanted to ask me if I would be interested in spending time with him.

The pro-domme eventually saw the wisdom of giving him away

She came to my house (with another Master), explained the seriousness of being given an old guard slave and spent some time telling me how to manage him properly.  I cannot say I took any of her advice, but that was not the point.  She wanted it to be very clear the slave was her generous gift to me and she was not being dumped! 

So my suggestion: ask your Mistress to release you in such a way that she does not lose face.  Tell her the time has come for you to be given to a new owner and you would appreciate her choosing wisely for you.  She might release you then.  And leave you free to find a new Mistress with her blessing

Good luck!!


< Message edited by MsCfromMelbourne -- 1/30/2008 4:16:03 AM >

_____________________________

<----- Corset, mask and collar designed and manufactured by metalsmith Karl H, chromed and lined in black suede. Masks and collars available from http://www.lucreziadesade.com.au/default.html. Corsets custom made only

(in reply to northwindrise)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 5:30:00 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: northwindrise

Thank you all that have responded. I must not be a slave, I do not work at mcd!!!!!
But seriously, I started working as a gardener a few years ago for a Domme (pro) in exchange for sessions and eventually she put a collar on me and deemed me her slave. I have never served another Mistress so I really do not know the differance other than I was told I was now owned. I was told to see certain Mistress for additional training. I was used in session for her benefit with clients.
The reason for asking is because the relationship has been going south as she has gotten new slaves that she prefers over me. I had complained to no avail. I was telling a friend about all this and he never realized that Mistress considered me a slave and not a sub. Then he told me there is a big differance and Mistress can treat her property as she wishes. The drag is that if I want to see another I have to ask for permission. And Mistress knows alot of other Mistess so cheating is out of the question.
It was his suggestion that I look up the differance. So I asked you guys because so often there are great words of wisdom spoken here.
Thanks again.
And I never eat at McDonalds or Subway. I am into healthy food.
Northwind rise
"Up in the morning , watch the northwind rise" Jorma Kaukonan (Hot Tuna)


Why do you accept all of that?

Unless she is committing a crime and holding you against your will, she cannot make you her slave. In order for that to function you have to recognize her authority.

So why do you recognize it?

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to northwindrise)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 8:10:02 AM   
DiurnalVampire


Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ineedotk

But seriously, I've always been under the impression that a slave is a sub which is permanently owned by a Dom(me).  A sub CAN be a slave, but isn't necessarily one.  Whereas a slave ABSOLUTELY is a sub.  Do you Dommes concur with this or no?

Part yes, part no.
I have never met a slave who didnt consider themselves submissive. However, I have met slaves who were unowned. I have also met permanently owned and collared submissives who did not consider themselves slaves.
Its all terminology... Each Dominant has their own definition of who and what makes a slave in their eyes. Obviously it isnt going to be the same across the board. What does someone owned by another Dominant really care about my definition of a slave. If their owner considers them a slave, but in my home they wouldnt be... does that change their status? Or, if they consider themselves a sub, but take a job at McD's...*wink*

You get the point.  Its semantics.
DV


_____________________________

I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

Snarko Ergo Sum
If you cannot change your mind, how are you so sure you still have one? -proverb

*Owner of Fox - collared 10/13/07*
VampiresLair

(in reply to ineedotk)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 8:30:13 AM   
atursvcMaam


Posts: 1195
Joined: 5/10/2004
Status: offline 		it was always my belief that submission is a state of mind of desire, whereas slavery is a state of obligation to avoid punishment or gain favor.  Using the McDonald's scenario, one submits when one applies for the job, and each day that one climbs into the uniform.  Slavery is when one cleans up the grease pit, the kid's party room or the bathroom in order to continue to collect the paycheck.  Just a thought.

(in reply to DiurnalVampire)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 10:16:49 AM   
ItalianSMistress


Posts: 427
Joined: 1/19/2007
From: Niagara Region Ontario Canada
Status: offline 		I just want to add something to My first post, to clearify what I was trying to say, as I think some may have misunderstood it.  Those terms can be interchanged, of course, depending on a number of things.  My point, was only that those that identify as slaves, are more likely to be the type I am interested in dealing with.  Those that identify as slaves, IMO, are more likely to have less limits, and less problem with the heavier types of play.  Of course, this is only My opinion, based on My experience.

_____________________________

Governess

"Dominance is the ability to create a hunger in someone that's so strong they will do anything, anytime, anywhere just to please you."


http://italianmistress.livejournal.com/


(in reply to northwindrise)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 10:32:51 AM   
faerytattoodgirl


Posts: 5824
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: atursvcMaam

it was always my belief that submission is a state of mind of desire, whereas slavery is a state of obligation to avoid punishment or gain favor.  Using the McDonald's scenario, one submits when one applies for the job, and each day that one climbs into the uniform.  Slavery is when one cleans up the grease pit, the kid's party room or the bathroom in order to continue to collect the paycheck.  Just a thought.


ewww cleaning mcd's bathrooms...thats the worst thing in the world!!!


_____________________________

I did not reply to your cmail.
I am flawed.
Imperfect.
MUST SPANK!!!
SPAAAAAAAANK!!!

(in reply to atursvcMaam)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 3:28:59 PM   
aidan


Posts: 904
Joined: 5/28/2005
Status: offline 		I see this as a form of the debate I constantly have with people about the meanings of the terms "nerd" and "geek" (beyond their creepy primary dictionary definitions).

They're really interchangable, and use is dependant on a person's previous experience, cultural background and even who they're speaking to.

One could say, like Italian Governess has, that a person who chooses to identify themselves as a "slave" might have certain qualities about them, but that I think speaks more about the person using the term than the term itself.

Personally, I don't terribly mind either lable in theory. But since slave can commonly connotate certain qualities that I might not wan applied at that time, I prefer to err on the side of caution and say I'm a submissive. Now, if I was in a long-term relationship with a Domme, she could call me whatever the hell she wants, because whatever that term is it'll have a meaning for us that I'm comfortable with.

And speaking of comfort, the word slave just has so much intellectual and historical baggage attached to it, when I really think about it hard it does squick me out a bit.


_____________________________

Do what now?

"I aim to misbehave."
-Mal Reynolds

(in reply to faerytattoodgirl)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 4:15:45 PM   
rubberpet


Posts: 1743
Joined: 4/6/2006
From: The Land of Voodoo
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: aidan

I see this as a form of the debate I constantly have with people about the meanings of the terms "nerd" and "geek" (beyond their creepy primary dictionary definitions).

They're really interchangable, and use is dependant on a person's previous experience, cultural background and even who they're speaking to.

One could say, like Italian Governess has, that a person who chooses to identify themselves as a "slave" might have certain qualities about them, but that I think speaks more about the person using the term than the term itself.

Personally, I don't terribly mind either lable in theory. But since slave can commonly connotate certain qualities that I might not wan applied at that time, I prefer to err on the side of caution and say I'm a submissive. Now, if I was in a long-term relationship with a Domme, she could call me whatever the hell she wants, because whatever that term is it'll have a meaning for us that I'm comfortable with.

And speaking of comfort, the word slave just has so much intellectual and historical baggage attached to it, when I really think about it hard it does squick me out a bit.



Amen, brother!  Mistress refers to me as Her slave, but I'm also Her pet, Her pookie, and Her boot licking slut.  It's a label, but to Her, it's also a description of my service to Her.  If that's what She classifies me as, then that's what I am.

_____________________________

Collared and devoted property of Mistress Lorelei (vampchick88) as of 3/26/08.

Rubberpet - The Resident Anti-Subby and mysterious shadowy figure known as Voodoo, proud hitman and wiseguy for the Subby Mafia.


(in reply to aidan)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 4:18:10 PM   
aidan


Posts: 904
Joined: 5/28/2005
Status: offline 		Hehe..."pookie."

_____________________________

Do what now?

"I aim to misbehave."
-Mal Reynolds

(in reply to rubberpet)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 4:27:57 PM   
rubberpet


Posts: 1743
Joined: 4/6/2006
From: The Land of Voodoo
Status: offline 		Watch it, buddy!  Pookie will kick your ass!  LMAO!!!

Psst...have you seen my owner?  She's really cute, so She can call me whatever She wants!

_____________________________

Collared and devoted property of Mistress Lorelei (vampchick88) as of 3/26/08.

Rubberpet - The Resident Anti-Subby and mysterious shadowy figure known as Voodoo, proud hitman and wiseguy for the Subby Mafia.


(in reply to aidan)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 5:50:21 PM   
ItalianSMistress


Posts: 427
Joined: 1/19/2007
From: Niagara Region Ontario Canada
Status: offline 		 
quote:



Mistress refers to me as Her slave, but I'm also Her pet, Her pookie, and Her boot licking slut.


Hehe..."pookie."


Watch it, buddy!  Pookie will kick your ass!  LMAO!!!





OMG you two have Me laughing like crazy,. I do believe that is the best thing I have read today!!


_____________________________

Governess

"Dominance is the ability to create a hunger in someone that's so strong they will do anything, anytime, anywhere just to please you."


http://italianmistress.livejournal.com/


(in reply to rubberpet)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/30/2008 5:56:44 PM   
aidan


Posts: 904
Joined: 5/28/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ItalianSMistress


quote:



Mistress refers to me as Her slave, but I'm also Her pet, Her pookie, and Her boot licking slut.


Hehe..."pookie."


Watch it, buddy!  Pookie will kick your ass!  LMAO!!!





OMG you two have Me laughing like crazy,. I do believe that is the best thing I have read today!!


*bows deeply and beams*

Happy to be of service, Governess. ;)


_____________________________

Do what now?

"I aim to misbehave."
-Mal Reynolds

(in reply to ItalianSMistress)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/31/2008 6:43:35 AM   
rubberpet


Posts: 1743
Joined: 4/6/2006
From: The Land of Voodoo
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: aidan

quote:

ORIGINAL: ItalianSMistress


quote:



Mistress refers to me as Her slave, but I'm also Her pet, Her pookie, and Her boot licking slut.


Hehe..."pookie."


Watch it, buddy!  Pookie will kick your ass!  LMAO!!!





OMG you two have Me laughing like crazy,. I do believe that is the best thing I have read today!!


*bows deeply and beams*

Happy to be of service, Governess. ;)



*Pookie shoves aiden out of the way*

"Happy to be of service, Governess." 
 
Aiden, you suck up!  LOL

ItalianSMistress, I'm glad the pookie and suck up could amuse you.    We'll be here all weekend!

_____________________________

Collared and devoted property of Mistress Lorelei (vampchick88) as of 3/26/08.

Rubberpet - The Resident Anti-Subby and mysterious shadowy figure known as Voodoo, proud hitman and wiseguy for the Subby Mafia.


(in reply to aidan)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/31/2008 8:58:43 AM   
ItalianSMistress


Posts: 427
Joined: 1/19/2007
From: Niagara Region Ontario Canada
Status: offline 		Oh God Ladies, get your requests in now,,,,for all weekend entertainment,,,,,provided in part, by Mistress Lorelei.......
 
No matter what is going on, I know somewhere in this forum there is a good laugh going on!!

_____________________________

Governess

"Dominance is the ability to create a hunger in someone that's so strong they will do anything, anytime, anywhere just to please you."


http://italianmistress.livejournal.com/


(in reply to rubberpet)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/31/2008 12:58:59 PM   
zoescherry


Posts: 8
Joined: 11/13/2007
Status: offline 		As others have already hinted at there is very little difference between the 2 terms..slave is like the term sadist hugely over used on the net and those who bandy the terms around devalue their true meaning. The only thing im slave to is my lust and desires..my Mistresses know that only to well and use it for their own ends. Those who cling to labels tend in my experience to be furthest from they say they are in the truth..Those who are the real deal tend not to have to boast about their status and just get on with it amongst those that share their particular kinks...They simply dont have to try that hard..

zoe

(in reply to ItalianSMistress)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Differance between sub and slave - 1/31/2008 4:09:10 PM   
vampchick88


Posts: 346
Joined: 4/10/2007
Status: offline 		ROF, its nice to know that even though I've been offline for a week due to no internet that pookie has still been doing well on the forums. How can anyone resist a pookie? I know Myself and Garfield can't. ~Lorelei

_____________________________

Proud owner of rubberpet, the best investment of my time, trust, and heart that any Domme could ever dream of.

(in reply to zoescherry)
Profile   Post #: 39
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