RE: Goth and BDSM (Full Version)

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EmeraldSlave2 -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 11:52:47 AM)

My problem is that I am NOT goth, but I AM kinky. I just happen to love goth/industrial/techno music that you only get at the good goth clubs.



haematopoiesis -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 12:39:37 PM)

black & silver go together?

grommets and d-rings and o-rings and chains make nice contrast to dark clothing and are somewhat off the beaten path for accessories

and a lot of leather is sold in black

so it all coordinates?


ahaha. i don't know. i get lumped into both labels, and stopped protesting it a long time ago

you listen to the right music, and you dress a certain way, and you're going to end up getting categorized

even if it's just to have you labeled a country hick xD

i think the visual aesthetic appeals to a lot of goth/punk/industrial types
but i know a lot of them would protest the practical application of bdsm


when it comes to generalizing, however, most people take the "like me" category, and then lump all of the other categories into "not like me".. and then if they do any subdivision, it doesn't tend to be very specific.



SophiaBelle -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 12:42:09 PM)

Notably I am particularly not-goth, but a good amount of my friends are goth (gothic revival or cybergoth... or whatever kids are calling themselves these days.) Of the people I told, my gothic friends (of the earlier persuasion, they are all older than myself, ranging from 25-40 or so, and tend to be pretty in their victorian bits) were the most congratulatory with my coming out of sorts with my kink. I've found that in my area there is some light and pleasant cross over between the goth and bdsm communities (in fact there was a club started up specifically for bdsm/goth crossovers, called Tomb.) I know a lot of goths with a kink persuasion- but aren't really into the bdsm scene, and I know relatively few bdsm'ers who I might call goth persuaded. There is a LOT of cross over with the fashion- but I also see cross over with other 'alternative' groups in fashion, and as one of my goth friends put it, the new blood lets the fashion go through cycles that are positive for the communities.



NakedOnMyChain -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 1:35:31 PM)

It could be because many of the fashion statements made by Goths happen to coincide with play wear. I've known many a Goth, both into and not into the lifestyle. However, they all tend to wear spiky collars, black leather corsets, and many styles of fetishwear at least several times. This could cause quite a bit of confusion when someone sees them on the street. Are they going to a play party? A goth party? Halloween? (JK). But seriously, the trends do overlap. I could see how people would mix it up.



CitizenCane -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 3:25:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: AbstractSavant


Goths are as varied as any group. You have your goth snobs, your Dungeons and Dragons goths, your kinky goths, your vampire goths, your goth wannabes, your 80's old school goths, your raver goths, your Hot Topic goths. And with the exception of the goth snobs, the goth community (at least in AZ) is one of the most open and accepting of people with all types of interests and ideaologies.




I gotta know- what's a Hot Topic goth?

Cane



Phoenixandnika -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 3:30:08 PM)

Ok , here some tid bids about Goths and the Gothic subculture.

Goth is a subculture much like the BDSM lifestyle. It is made of many parts depending on who you ask, and often times the gothic lifestyle like many is a huge contriditcion.

The main idea behind the Goth culture is a drive a need to be creative and to be self expressive to live outside of society's acceptable circle. Goth's embrace the dark part of reality that most of society fear, such as death.Individual self expression can be shown in dress, books read, or music.

As a subculture, Goths have no real steroe type or dress code. Not all goths are depressed, have black hair, listen to the same music, nor are they all obssessed with death.

The easiest way to spot a Goth is the need to to take the darkness and embrace it. Goths do not see life as a fairy tale or happily ever after they embrace both the light and dark.

Did you know that the Gothic subculture has been around for years?That it has appeared, flourished, vanished, only to reappear over and over again. This subculture has been around since the mid-eightys in Europe and North America.They were often refered to as the New Romantics and Deathers. In 1981 the Goth subculture reached it peak and split into to factions. Both groups embraces the darker side their of life,mixing fear and rebeled against societies sense of moral superiority. The difference, however; was their way of expressing these things. One group called the Appolonians where concerned with art and philosophy and were fairly non-confrontational. The other group where harder to define in tradition terms but still embraced the darkness. Many of the more popular Goth musicians belong to the second group. This group was also more openly confrontational and regarded as dangerous and rebelious.

In the late 80's Goth as a subculture nearly died out being replaced with a new bread of Goths that where founded on posteruring, attitude, and dress codes.The old school goths had gone underground by this point and veiwed the new Goths as nothing more than druggies with bad attitudes that wore black cloths and make up. The bad opinions went both ways. The past 5 years or so, both the Old School Goths and New Generation Goths have merged and found new mediums. Thus, the goth subculture is once again flourishing and being embraced by many.

I am goth and consider myself more of the Old School Gothic mentality. I embrace the darkness through art,through my writing. I have had a rainbow of hair colors from blonde, strawberry blonde, to jet black, and soon to be marroon. I do wear alot of black ,however; my cloths do not define me. I would hope my attitude, my mentality, my personality do that.

I am also very much the slave of Phoenix. For me, the being slave is much like being goth as it for the most part is outside of societies box so to speak. It is misunderstood by many. And many make assumptions about it and those who claim to be gothic. For me and my Master, he enjoys my dark side. He enjoys that I am not typical and that even in my slavery I live outside the box. But then again I am also a wiccan so ....
as a friend told me today, your just a strange one girl!


Any ways, I just thought I would share these tid mits of Goth history and facts.


Nika{Phoenix}
His Gothic Slave



Phoenixandnika -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 3:42:01 PM)

*laughs hearing your classes of goths* A HoT Topic goth? That is a new one even for me.

Nika{Phoenix}
His Gothic Slave



AbstractSavant -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 5:33:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phoenixandnika

*laughs hearing your classes of goths* A HoT Topic goth? That is a new one even for me.

Nika{Phoenix}
His Gothic Slave


Oh come now. You know the type I'm talking about. The kids who one day are all Abercrombied out, and suddenly they discover Hot Topic and walk out in head to toe goth gear, complete with fishnet gloves, Manic Panic hair dye and PVC bondage pants.



krys -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 5:48:29 PM)

Before there was Hot Topic we used to refer to them as '"Wal-Mart goths" or "Insta-goths". Just add hair dye!




Phoenixandnika -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 5:55:12 PM)

*laughs*
I have heard wal-mart goth, granted not in ages!

I have been goth since before it was popular. I remember growing up everone thinking I was in the occult because of it.*laughs* Forget about trying to convice them other wise especially when they found out I was a wiccan as well as a goth and gosh when they toss in a slave! They think I am simply wacky......

Nika{Phoenix}
His gothic Slave



caitlyn -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 9:42:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Phoenixandnika

Did you know that the Gothic subculture has been around for years?That it has appeared, flourished, vanished, only to reappear over and over again. This subculture has been around since the mid-eightys in Europe and North America.


Goths are a bit older actually. In AD9, a rather foolish Roman by the name of Publius Quinctilius Varus had a rather nasty encounter with them, as dramatized in the illustration below by Gustove Dore, entitled "The Fury of the Goths."

These guys didn't need HoT Topics ... hell, they didn't even bathe. The Roman's thought less of them then a policeman in Texas, having to run security at an AFI concert.

Posted all in good fun ... c



[image]local://upfiles/73486/609A5D0688DD4E92B8EC0CDB922AB537.jpg[/image]



enchantemusique -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 9:54:40 PM)

I don't necessarily title myself a "goth", although I am labled as such by many people. If I had to classify myself, I suppose I'd agree.

But obviously, I am into BDSM and I don't think it is sick and twisted, and obviously, I don't think "real kinksters" are "arrogant asswipes".

While I'm sure what you have said can apply to a number of people, there are many that aren't anything like what you've described.



enchantemusique -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/16/2005 10:06:07 PM)

I think this post was a little too harsh and I didn't want to ruffle any feathers, but I can't figure out how to delete it.



MsIncognito -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/17/2005 7:42:23 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: krys

Yes, and perky goths and fashion goths and philosophy goths... And in my experience slightly more sheep like than many.

And ummm... Abstract... you do know I AM goth, right? :) (Old school corporate in case you were wondering.)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Abstract Savant

You have your goth snobs, your Dungeons and Dragons goths, your kinky goths, your vampire goths, your goth wannabes, your 80's old school goths, your raver goths, your Hot Topic goths.



And I thought kinky people were a little over the top with categorizing and stratifying. Sounds like they've got nothing on Goths. Is there a site that explains all these different types of goths for mundanes like me? :)



Phoenixandnika -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/17/2005 9:43:57 AM)

This is one of the best sites I have come across regarding the subculture of goths.

http://www.gothicsubculture.com/

I hope it helps.

Nika{Phoenix}
His Gothic Fuck Toy - Forever Enslaved By Him




nella -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/18/2005 4:18:15 PM)

i did a bit of reading and it seame some of the conection pepole make is that many see both subcultures to be a bit on the darkside, perhaps that is why some pepole think they fit togehter.

Thanks for the links Nika, werry nice.



MistressAkasha -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/30/2005 7:38:14 PM)

Nella,

I try not to stereotype...........and I am not stereotyping here...at least not on purpose. BDSM is independent of goth. We often associate a certain style with a certain act/group. For example, it is universal that the color black represents death, or perhaps evilness....."darkness."

Going back to the gothic subject; I am not a goth. I believe that goth is a fashion statement and an attitude. I however communicate with goth people; some are into bdsm, some are not. From this, I concur that some gothic people learn of the bdsm lifestyle, and practice it because it is appealing to others, moreso than themselves. Again, I am not saying that all goths into bdsm are fakes, but the majority of those that I know that fit the description seems to fit the diagnosis of doing it for attention.

There's my two cents,
Akasha



IronBear -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/30/2005 9:19:17 PM)

Amongst the largish number of Wiccan friends I have, there are quite a few of the younger ones (under 30ish), who are also Goth. Some are dedicated to the culture, others just love the music and the gear they wear. I'd be curious what sort of estimated percentage of Goths may be both Wiccan/Pagan and BDSM.

Just to stop anyone asking if I'm doing an age thing.. I'm not, most of the ones over 30 something I can follow back to their joinging Craft especially some 200 who were at one time members on the original founding Wiccan Coven in Perth Western Australia and the one succeeding it both of which I ran and founded. None of those were Goth before they started in Craft.



SirKnottynNice -> RE: Goth and BDSM (9/30/2005 10:50:22 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: AbstractSavant


The same goes for any subculture, though.


This is true.
I've seen the same thing happen, with the punks/punk chicks & skaters, when they were wearing spiked collars, cuffs, chains, razorblades pinned onto leather jackets, or treanch coats, etc.

Maybe I'm just feeling old here, but I do believe before they (whoever 'they' are) called it "Goth" they called it other stuff, like "alternatine", or "grunge", or now this newer crowd the ICP Juggers, & Juggets...
They dress in skater clothing, looking "Goth"with their painted faces and all that, and they wear BD/SM type clothing too.

Don't get me wrong here, I'm not knocking others interests.
I'm just saying, that this has been going on for years.
Same types of people out there, they still dress the same, but they just call it something different so it *seems* new, but it's nothing new.

We A/all probably have dressed the same way, wore the same accessories, cuffs, metal, chains, etc, (think about the 80's and some of the 90's too) at some point in O/our life, but back then we called it... well who knows now, but you get what I'm saying.
Vanilla, or Kink, the clothing and trends have been the same for years.
Clothing style doesn't make the person, but W/we know that already.

Be well



TearCollector -> RE: Goth and BDSM (10/1/2005 12:47:44 AM)

I have an interest in Goth women but havent had any luck getting them interested in me. I guess they need a goth boy . Which I am not.

TearCollector



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