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BitaTruble -> Build a Prez (3/21/2008 8:46:41 PM)
With so much partisianship during this election year (and every freakin' other year) I thought that rather than debate a 'who' we could debate a 'what' .. as in, what makes someone an ideal president for the current, modern America in which many of us reside. This question would go out to those outside the USA as well, because, regardless of how you feel, the US is part of the world. What characteristics would you like to see in the leader of the US? What matters and how much? Personal: Intellect Wisdom Credit Rating/wealth Education General Health Charisma/diplomacy Character Military Service Sexual Orientation Relationship Status Prior occupations/employment Associations/affiliations Religion Ethnicity Criminal record Popularity National/Global: Health Care Defense Education Free Speech Taxes Stem Cell/abortion rights Death Penalty Homeland Security Gun control Economy Outsourcing Border/immigration Trade agreements Foreign aid Infrastructure Global warming Feel free to add or subtract anything from either list to build your ideal president. Which of the listed attributes under 'personal' are important. Where will your ideal president stand on the National/Global issues? If there's any interest in the thread, I'll put together my president after giving others the chance to do so. Celeste

ownedgirlie -> RE: Build a Prez (3/21/2008 9:26:20 PM)
OK this is really cool and will take some thought, but my initial reaction was to envision a Mr. Potato Head. Then again...in some cases that's not so far off, is it?! [8D]

BitaTruble -> RE: Build a Prez (3/21/2008 11:09:11 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie OK this is really cool and will take some thought, but my initial reaction was to envision a Mr. Potato Head. Then again...in some cases that's not so far off, is it?! [8D] Hon, the purpose of the thread is to build an ideal president, not emulate the one who's already in office. [8D] Celeste

ownedgirlie -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 12:20:18 AM)
LOL! Laughed so hard the doggy looked up at me.

NorthernGent -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 12:29:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BitaTruble This question would go out to those outside the USA as well, because, regardless of how you feel, the US is part of the world. It most certainly is.......we tend to view it as the poor relation of more powerful and wealthy neighbours Mexico and Cuba.......about 5 minutes ago there was a clip on British tele of Americans scrambling over the border into Mexico to earn a living......propaganda ain't what it used to be eh..... For what it's worth...... I'd like to see everyone have a chance of running the country....from CEOs to the homeless.......basically, draw names out of a hat on a fortnightly basis to manage the country for a fortnight....the draw is fixed so that everyone gets at least one spell in charge in their lifetime......imagine that, everyone genuinely having a chance of being the top man/woman.....stability may be compromised, but you've got to be in it to win it..... Failing that, isolationist would be a useful trait considering recent history.........

fairerthanshe -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 1:19:07 AM)
Greetings Celeste, Great topic - one we should all be considering during these times of uncertainty... Personal: Intellect Wisdom Education General Health Charisma/diplomacy Character Prior occupations/employment Associations/affiliations This is my grouping and beyond this, I would say that the most important skills are the ability to build coalitions, to bring people together for a common goal, and to inspire others to greatness. well wishes ~ fairer than she

NeedToUseYou -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 1:24:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BitaTruble With so much partisianship during this election year (and every freakin' other year) I thought that rather than debate a 'who' we could debate a 'what' .. as in, what makes someone an ideal president for the current, modern America in which many of us reside. This question would go out to those outside the USA as well, because, regardless of how you feel, the US is part of the world. What characteristics would you like to see in the leader of the US? What matters and how much? Personal: Intellect Very much so, Wisdom Most important. Credit Rating/wealth I care more about what they do and how they did it, rather than how much money they have. So, it's can be very important or a complete non-factor. Education They should be educated, and continuing to educate themselves. General Health I wouldn't vote for a 90 year old, or someone that has six months to live, but I'd vote for someone that was paralyzed, or in their 70's or who was suffering a long term disease, that didn't effect their brain function. Charisma/diplomacy I like good speeches and a pretty face as much as the next person, but I really don't care, if their are only moving words, and no substance. Character Definitely, undeniably essential. Which would mean a history of doing the right thing even when it's against the grain. Military Service Not very important. Sexual Orientation I don't think I vote for a gay or bi person as president, simply because that would severely hamper their ability to function in certain parts of the world. Relationship Status Don't care. Prior occupations/employment Yes, if they were a lawyer, that counts against them unless they have a very good record(guilty until proven innocent), I'd never vote for a banker, or anyone related to wall street. I think I'm actually the equivalent of racist against bankers. I don't trust them. They can't be human. Associations/affiliations To a vary minor degree unless it's really out there. Religion Not so much unless they make it part of their platform, then it's a complete negative. Ethnicity Don't care. Criminal record Don't care about minor offenses, I do care if they were caught embezzling, or had substantial dealing with more than a few that did get convicted of felony level crimes. Popularity I don't care. National/Global: Health Care Open it up to more competition, The federal government should get completely out of it(serving medical care), and if the states want to enact their own policies in that regard so be it. Defense Enough to protect our borders. Education Federal government should get out of it, it's up to the Families->Towns->County->State in that order. Free Speech Near complete except for intentionally inciting a event that will cause "PHYSICAL" harm. Taxes Much lower, especially at the federal level, and would ban property taxes in favor of a system that would allow land ownership again. Stem Cell/abortion rights Stem Cells are fine,Abortion a state issue. Death Penalty Undecided, depending on criteria enacted that would allow it. Though, I would support it if it were possible to ensure the government wouldn't abuse it eventually and only in cases that were completely open and shut, such as videotaped killings that clearly show the attacker and the motive was clear. But in a practical sense I'd say no on this point now. As people can't be trusted with such power. So, president against the death penalty. Homeland Security In it's present form, I'm 100% against it, if it meant protecting the borders, increasing port security, and not spying on us citizens. Then I would support it. Thus I'm for a president that will protect the country and not spy on it's citizens. Gun control Very little barring chemical weapons and Nukes. Economy The government needs to destroy it's alliance with big business, starting with the Federal Reserve, then IRS, then non bid contracts, etc... etc... Most of the tax revenue should be collected by the states, counties, and towns. I see no reason the federal government needs to run as much as they do. I require this characteristic in a president I'd want elected. Outsourcing it is a companies right to do so, but I'd be in favor of a standardized package display system that would be required, and indicate which countries took part. in the manufacturing, then assembly, then design of the product. So a president that watch nuetral to business, but promoted information on businesses. Border/immigration Lock them down now, though make it easier for legal immigration, increase and ENFORCE the penalties for businesses that hire illegals. Trade agreements I'd be in favor of free trade, with the condition that all conditions they impose will be met with a like condition. Foreign aid None, except in times of war to long-term allies in distress. Infrastructure Very important, and this is one area that the Federal government actually has a role in terms of interstates and should be a much larger percentage of the federal budget. Global warming I went from not believing, to fully believing, and now just confused. LOL. So, my belief is we should do things that make sense regardless of that reality, such as weaning off fossil fuels, trying to reduce pollution, etc... It doesn't matter really if one believes in global warming or not, IMO. As there are just as many other reasons to do things that would offset it anyway. So, I guess I want an agnostic in Global warming but environmentally concerned. Adding thought crime to the list: As it's my view, hate crime legislation, and pre-emptive arrests for probable activity fall under that classification. I against it 100% Feel free to add or subtract anything from either list to build your ideal president. Which of the listed attributes under 'personal' are important. Where will your ideal president stand on the National/Global issues? If there's any interest in the thread, I'll put together my president after giving others the chance to do so. Celeste I think I rambled on up there, but come to think of it, I'd be the ideal president[:D] So there you go.

BitaTruble -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 1:25:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent For what it's worth...... I'd like to see everyone have a chance of running the country....from CEOs to the homeless.......basically, draw names out of a hat on a fortnightly basis to manage the country for a fortnight....the draw is fixed so that everyone gets at least one spell in charge in their lifetime...... Wasn't that an episode of South Park? Celeste

NorthernGent -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 2:27:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BitaTruble quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent For what it's worth...... I'd like to see everyone have a chance of running the country....from CEOs to the homeless.......basically, draw names out of a hat on a fortnightly basis to manage the country for a fortnight....the draw is fixed so that everyone gets at least one spell in charge in their lifetime...... Wasn't that an episode of South Park? Celeste 'No idea, Celeste, but the old turn of phrase, "....'better to have loved and lost....." comes to mind. Genuinely, I think this would have serious benefits; not least, social cohesion. At this point in time, I would take a Prime Minister who will not be swayed on one important concept: decisions reflect our views, rather than the personal prejudice of a leader and his inner circle. Unlike the United States, the majority of us didn't believe the WMDs scenario; we backed the invasion only in the event WMDs were found and the invasion was ratified by the United Nations; yet, we sat back and watched as the Prime Minister and associates acted against our wishes. Obviously, we have a weakness in our political framework and our resolve to ensure our requests are acted upon. I don't really know what goes on inside the United States, but I'd guess you have a problem that needs addressing: what on earth is leading a significant proportion of Americans to believe they have the right to dictate to foreign nations? If I were American, I'd be looking for a leader and government to address this situation. 'Characteristics/traits: wisdom, honour, compassion, resolve.

BitaTruble -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 3:18:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou Personal: Intellect Very much so, Wisdom Most important. Huge, enormous, gigantic DITTO! Credit Rating/wealth I care more about what they do and how they did it, rather than how much money they have. So, it's can be very important or a complete non-factor. This is probably a little more important to me. Not the wealth part, but the credit rating part. I don't want someone who fucks up their own budget trying to control the federal budget. Education They should be educated, and continuing to educate themselves. I agree but I'm giving a lot more credence to someone with an MBA than an AA in Art History. General Health I wouldn't vote for a 90 year old, or someone that has six months to live, but I'd vote for someone that was paralyzed, or in their 70's or who was suffering a long term disease, that didn't effect their brain function. Charisma/diplomacy I like good speeches and a pretty face as much as the next person, but I really don't care, if their are only moving words, and no substance.Agreed with the additional requirement from me that the president have a keen understanding of diplomacy. Without it, I don't think there can truly be compromise with other nations and as Fairer wrote, building colitions is an important attribute and especially timely now. Character Definitely, undeniably essential. Which would mean a history of doing the right thing even when it's against the grain. 100% agreement. Honesty, personal responsibility and accountability all required. I want a president who's not afraid of telling the truth to the rest of us even when we don't think we want to hear it. Military Service Not very important.Agreed - sort of - but I would like to see the 2nd in command have this attribute if not the president. The prez is still the Commander-in-Chief but I admit to a bias because so many of my family members have/still serve in the armed forces. Sexual Orientation I don't think I vote for a gay or bi person as president, simply because that would severely hamper their ability to function in certain parts of the world. Agreed because my OP specifically pointed to our current nation. I hope for something much different in the future and that our children's children will makes leaps foward on this issue as we make the small, beginning, baby steps. Relationship Status Don't care. I'd actually prefer a single president then no one will care if he/she gives/gets a blow job in the White House. ::chuckles:: Prior occupations/employment Yes, if they were a lawyer, that counts against them unless they have a very good record(guilty until proven innocent), I'd never vote for a banker, or anyone related to wall street. I think I'm actually the equivalent of racist against bankers. I don't trust them. They can't be human. Fair enough. I lean towards someone who has pulled themselves up by their own bootstraps in a business which they owned and operated. The little guy who has his shit together and surrounds himself with amazing people. Associations/affiliations To a vary minor degree unless it's really out there. I'd like to see a president who has spent some time in volunteer service unrelated to anything military. Religion Not so much unless they make it part of their platform, then it's a complete negative. Ethnicity Don't care. Criminal record Don't care about minor offenses, I do care if they were caught embezzling, or had substantial dealing with more than a few that did get convicted of felony level crimes. I don't mind traffic violations, but I'd like to see full and complete disclosure even for minor offenses. I have a pet peeve about accountability. Popularity I don't care. National/Global: Health Care Open it up to more competition, The federal government should get completely out of it(serving medical care), and if the states want to enact their own policies in that regard so be it. Defense Enough to protect our borders. And a little bit extra from me but not too much. Enough to give our men and women what they need to max their survival potential in times of crisis without it costing 800 damn dollars for a hammer. Education Federal government should get out of it, it's up to the Families->Towns->County->State in that order. Free Speech Near complete except for intentionally inciting a event that will cause "PHYSICAL" harm. Taxes Much lower, especially at the federal level, and would ban property taxes in favor of a system that would allow land ownership again. Stem Cell/abortion rights Stem Cells are fine,Abortion a state issue. Our first real disagreement. Stem cells yes.. abortion though, an issue which is decided between a woman and her doctor and the government can stay out of my bedroom and my womb and my president will feel the same way. Death Penalty Undecided, depending on criteria enacted that would allow it. Though, I would support it if it were possible to ensure the government wouldn't abuse it eventually and only in cases that were completely open and shut, such as videotaped killings that clearly show the attacker and the motive was clear. But in a practical sense I'd say no on this point now. As people can't be trusted with such power. So, president against the death penalty. Homeland Security In it's present form, I'm 100% against it, if it meant protecting the borders, increasing port security, and not spying on us citizens. Then I would support it. Thus I'm for a president that will protect the country and not spy on it's citizens. Gun control Very little barring chemical weapons and Nukes. Economy The government needs to destroy it's alliance with big business, starting with the Federal Reserve, then IRS, then non bid contracts, etc... etc... Most of the tax revenue should be collected by the states, counties, and towns. I see no reason the federal government needs to run as much as they do. I require this characteristic in a president I'd want elected. Yes! Just say no pork, quit kowtowing to special interest and stop the earmarking. Have some balls (man or woman) and be the fucking president! This whole bank business has me scared, too. How close are we to a 1939 level depression? Outsourcing it is a companies right to do so, but I'd be in favor of a standardized package display system that would be required, and indicate which countries took part. in the manufacturing, then assembly, then design of the product. So a president that watch nuetral to business, but promoted information on businesses. I hadn't thought of that. Might be good idea but is it going to raise prices at a time when we can't afford to spend the money, as consumers? Maybe something to consider during the second term in office. We've got a lot of big fish to fry and packaging is a shiny that can wait. I don't want to pay for or see any incentives go to businesses to keep them here, I'd rather see penalities for taking the business out of here. You want to ship all the jobs to another country, it's going to cost you heavy to ship your products back in. Make it too expensive for the companies, build the shit we need ourselves and fuck the rest. We have to get back to a manufacturing. Build products instead of buy products. Pay those employees a livable wage and make it painful for companies not to keep their business here. We have too many service jobs and not enough manufacturing ones and Americans are too willing to forego quality for a price cut. With a livable wage, they won't have to. Border/immigration Lock them down now, though make it easier for legal immigration, increase and ENFORCE the penalties for businesses that hire illegals. Trade agreements I'd be in favor of free trade, with the condition that all conditions they impose will be met with a like condition. Obviously, by what I wrote above, you can guess where I stand on this issue! ::laughs:: Foreign aid None, except in times of war to long-term allies in distress. I need a different president for this one. We could cut what we spend on foreign aid now by 99% and still have have a president who is a clear supporter and advocate of Peace Corp expansion and take that wee 1% of the 3 billion we currently spend and put it to some real use. Double the pay for service from $6000 to $12000 to help with transistion when returning home and expanded the student loan cancellation policy by upping the % in addition to expanding it beyond Perkins loans. While I don't really want to see mandatory service, I can't help but believe it would build strength of character in our youth so strong incentives are needed to get our kids to enlist in this form of foreign aid and have a way to get an education when they come home. A little hard work and dirt under your nails never hurt anyone. In addition, it's a way to expand one's global view and I just can't think of that as a bad thing. My ideal president is going to pave the way for future ideal presidents. Education and exposure to global thinking is a good start in that direction. Right now there are less than 10,000 Peace Corp volunteers .. how many Xbox's do we have? To me, that's a sad comparison. Right now, Americans are paying about $10 a month per person in foreign aid. Cut that down to $1 a month and put it into incentive packages for the Peace corp. Hell, think of how much parents will save not having to feed teenagers for a couple of years! It's win-win! Hmm.. maybe I would like to see it be mandatory. ::chuckles:: We spend a pittance of our budget in foreign aid right now. At least make what we spend do some good for our kids, our future and the future of our global neighbors as well. Infrastructure Very important, and this is one area that the Federal government actually has a role in terms of interstates and should be a much larger percentage of the federal budget. Global warming I went from not believing, to fully believing, and now just confused. LOL. So, my belief is we should do things that make sense regardless of that reality, such as weaning off fossil fuels, trying to reduce pollution, etc... It doesn't matter really if one believes in global warming or not, IMO. As there are just as many other reasons to do things that would offset it anyway. So, I guess I want an agnostic in Global warming but environmentally concerned. I recycle damn near everything. I pay the exact same fees as my neighbors who don't recycle at all. While it wouldn't be the president's job to get my city to lower my recycle rates, I'd at least like to see a president who recycles the way I do. Hey, it's my ideal, damn it! ::laughs:: Adding thought crime to the list: As it's my view, hate crime legislation, and pre-emptive arrests for probable activity fall under that classification. I against it 100% Good add! Thanks. I'd like to see a president who wants to toss about 90% of Nanny Laws to boot. (It may be 100% of Nanny laws, but there are so many, I'm not sure I know them all!) Thanks for the great post! As I read back through to edit for grammar etc, I realized there is much I listed that is not the true responsibility of the president .. so, I'm going to have to install my ideal congress as well. That should just about cover things. ::grins:: Celeste

BitaTruble -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 4:05:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NorthernGent 'No idea, Celeste, but the old turn of phrase, "....'better to have loved and lost....." comes to mind. Genuinely, I think this would have serious benefits; not least, social cohesion. I understand the thinking but I'm afraid I can't agree with it. Not everyone has the capability of doing something so important as lead a nation even for 2 weeks. (10 mins in a room with my ex-husband would disavow anyone of that notion!) The risks outweigh the benefits. That said, I'm not entirely against the idea of a national lottery for congress as long as certain criteria are met. We already have crack heads and mental patients in congress .. so those two groups are out. They've already had their chance! No exceptions. ::chuckles:: I'll have to give some thought as to what criteria I'd like, but the notion is intriguing and has been something in the back of my mind for more than a few years. I am and always have been an advocate of term limits. I'd like to see one 6 year term for presidents and senators so 1/2 way through the office, no one is distracted with trying to get reelected. 3 year terms for congress, period.. then you're out of there. That gives the 6 year president two chances to get it right. That's more than most of us get. quote: I don't really know what goes on inside the United States, but I'd guess you have a problem that needs addressing: what on earth is leading a significant proportion of Americans to believe they have the right to dictate to foreign nations? You want the truth? A significant portion of Americans want to pay their rent, feed their kids and have more money than month left over when all is said and done. The truth is, most live paycheck to paycheck. Don't confuse the rich elite with the vast majority. Most of us are poor slobs who, if we own houses have a mortgage on them. We are much more likely to sit around and talk Superbowl, Nascar and Survivor than plot ways to dictate how to get foreign nations to do things the American way. Most of us want to be able to go to work, come home, have a meal and be left the fuck alone. This is not meant to be offense at all, but most Americans just don't give a fuck what happens outside of their own little castles. You don't hear about the majority though. We're boring and don't make the news unless one of us flips out and goes and shoots up a Post Office because we couldn't get laid or some stupid shit like that. You hear the noise from those who flap their lips and squawk like chickens. Don't take it personally though, even from them. The noise makers don't just want to dictate to the rest of the world, they want to tell those of us who dwell here as citizens how to live as well! Guess what.. that noise hurts my ears as much as yours, but damned if I won't defend anyone's right to say anything they want even if I disagree in a vehement fashion with what they say and may call them a total ass for saying it. I won't begrudge them for calling me an ass either. As long as no one tries to tell me what to do (with one most notable exception!), we're all good. quote: If I were American, I'd be looking for a leader and government to address this situation. 'Characteristics/traits: wisdom, honour, compassion, resolve. Those 4 characteristics are an outstanding start .. and one we haven't seen in an American president for quite sometime now. I dare to dream. Celeste

pahunkboy -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 4:22:15 AM)
1. So-called entitelment reform. the third rail-; 2 corporate meddling into government 3. lobbiests and lawyers run amuck 4. the fiat currency.and debt 5. updating governemnt to 2008, instead of being stuck in the last century of governance. 6. checking the power of global multi-national corpoartaions. 7. revoking corporate personhood 8. fixing the patriot bill 9. restoring whistly blower protection. 10. delete no bod contracts 11. delete war price gouging profiteerring. 12. safe food and trinkets. 13. sanctity of human life- in that a machine is not human...a human can have mechincal parts and still be human, but a machine can not become human if it has human parts. 14. clean air. 15. clean water.

Level -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 7:34:48 AM)
Hi Celeste [X(] Personal: Intellect - book learnin' is good. It can give one wider perspective. Wisdom - but wisdom trumps book smarts. This includes awareness of self, and of others, and the ability to see what needs to be done. Credit Rating/wealth - meaningless, except I don't want the Pres to have shitty credit, I suppose lol Education - meaningless, as far as what school they went to, or if they even went, really; just have the wisdom. General Health - health is good; don't be keeling over Charisma/diplomacy - charisma is okay, it's nice to feel pumped up about things, just don't bullshit us. Diplomacy is very important, especially in today's world. Character - matters hugely Military Service - good in that it may give extra perspective if military conflict rears it's head, but not a must Sexual Orientation - doesn't matter Relationship Status - doesn't matter Prior occupations/employment - doesn't matter Associations/affiliations - like hanging out with the Cosa Nostra? [8D] Religion - doesn't necessarily matter, but if they are religious, I don't want them of the fire-and-brimstone variety, and if an athiest, I don't want them hostile to religion. Ethnicity - doesn't matter Criminal record - depends on what it was! Popularity - like, really, fer shure, doesn't matter. [:D] National/Global: Health Care - I want to see universal health care, that doesn't sink the economy Defense - a strong defense, and a smart one; there is so much waste in gov, and much of it seems to be in the military. Education - we have to do better, somehow; a nation of dumbasses isn't what we need; maybe ditch some of the touchy-feely there is no wrong answer, little Billy crap....but I'm not sure how much of that exists. Free Speech - abso-fucking-lutely vital Taxes - I would like to see how a vastly simplified, 3-tier system would work; this shit we have now, is much like our election system overly complicated, and moronic-- and for crying out loud, close the loopholes! Stem Cell/abortion rights - stem cell research is incredibly important, and I'm also strongly pro-life; makes for some nice headaches...... Death Penalty - abolish it Homeland Security - this seems to have turned into our newest cluster-fuck; but losing our rights isn't the way to be secure. Gun control - needs to be tightened up a bit; everyone buying a gun should go through a check. Economy - a good economy is good; I wish I had some better suggestions..... [:)] Outsourcing - I don't begrudge some poor bastard in India having a decent job, but we need to look after our folks, first. Border/immigration - tighten it up; build a wall, or some sort of high-tech safeguards from the Jetsons Trade agreements - they don't seem fair, so look at renegotiating or doing away with them Foreign aid - a good thing; we spend a tiny amount, and generally see good results from it. Infrastructure - something we need to look at, and soon, shit's falling apart. Global warming - build a big-ass coat sewing factory and put all of our outsourcing victims to work..... no, it's something we have to work on; even if some of the predictions are wrong, we should strive to clean things up, and get off the foreign oil teat, and that would be a win-win for us.

celticlord2112 -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 11:55:17 AM)
Personal: Intellect - He should not be a dunce. Wisdom - Solomon-like would be nice Education - doesn't have to be formal education, but he should well and widely read Charisma/diplomacy - Leaders have to work with people Character - I want to know in concrete terms what he stands for. No guesswork. National/Global: Defense - This is job #1. Free Speech - We need to be safe so we can be free to shoot our mouths off as we want. Education - Future generations need to have the mental resources to solve the problems of their day Taxes - figure out how to pay for all of the above without bankrupting us

TheHeretic -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 11:55:43 AM)
Short answer to a really good question; I want a socially liberal, fiscal conservative. I want someone willing to throw the malpractice lawyers under the bus when we talk about overhauling how we handle health care in this country. I want someone with the stones (or ovaries) to radically overhaul programs and policies that have made things worse. Mostly, I want someone who won't keep us locked into partisan division. On foreign policy, I'm afraid we need a machiavellian pragmatist to handle the mess.

SL4V3M4YB3 -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 1:00:42 PM)
Charismatic Consistent Honest Free thinking Liberal Human Shares my world view on most issues. I don't think the person described above exists but it's who I would vote for.

NorthernGent -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 2:26:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BitaTruble You want the truth? A significant portion of Americans want to pay their rent, feed their kids and have more money than month left over when all is said and done. The truth is, most live paycheck to paycheck. Don't confuse the rich elite with the vast majority. Most of us are poor slobs who, if we own houses have a mortgage on them. We are much more likely to sit around and talk Superbowl, Nascar and Survivor than plot ways to dictate how to get foreign nations to do things the American way. Most of us want to be able to go to work, come home, have a meal and be left the fuck alone. Sounds fair enough and I know where you're coming from....the English don't have such a thing as a Motherland, Fatherland, Patrie etc...we have "home" i.e. an individual's house and garden - that's where our interest lies. Perhaps the question should be expanded to "and what will the people do in order to fulfill their side of the bargain; what characteristics should the people display in order to control government?". A disinterested population is unlikely to elect a virtuous government, for obvious reasons. This is not peculiar to the United States by any stretch of the imagination; you could pretty much be describing England. And therein lies the root of the issue: something like 55% of the population turned out in England at the last general election; as I understand it, there was a similar turn out in the United States. I suppose if you, I, we can't make the effort to control our elected servants, they'll run amok. quote: ORIGINAL: BitaTruble I dare to dream. Celeste It's possible, but the people have to make it happen - a people gets the government it deserves.

SL4V3M4YB3 -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 2:33:00 PM)
Only 40% out of that 55% turnout voted for the current UK government and only a few thousand people voted for Gordon Brown.[8\|] Yet they say the EU constitution referendum campaign result shouldn't be recognised because it was a small cross section of the UK polled.[:D]

NorthernGent -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 2:36:18 PM)
A topic for a different thread. If I were American, I'd want someone who is good for their word and knows that actions are everything........."I could have", "it could have been", "if only".....are totally useless.

SL4V3M4YB3 -> RE: Build a Prez (3/22/2008 2:40:08 PM)
I think that fact alone points out that our politicians only care about what they can get away with rather than what is right. I'd want someone that does the right thing and knows when they are in the wrong.

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