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power of submission - 4/1/2008 1:42:29 AM

lally3

Posts: 595
Joined: 3/4/2008
Status: offline

hi peeps

a friend mentioned 'power of submission' and you know, i kind of understand this, but i dont and then i got to thinking that this probably means different things to different people. but i cant get my head around what it means to me, maybe i havent had enough coffee yet.

i know that without submission a dominant is powerless, but that isnt what this means or is it. i dont think im fond of that analogy, it suggests that we have power over our dominants - so what is it.

and apologies if this topic has been done to death.

Post #: 1

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 1:48:53 AM

BitaTruble

Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline

I've never even heard that term before, so it has no meaning for me. ::chuckles:: I certainly don't think of Himself as powerless without some sort of submission from me. His power is his own, regardless of whether I'm in his life and obeying him or not.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 2

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 1:54:00 AM

lally3

Posts: 595
Joined: 3/4/2008
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oh good im glad im not the only one thats clueless on this.

and i rate your posts highly, so if you dont know, who's going to....!

what i meant by, without submission a dominant is powerless is, that he cannot force submission from a sub, its there or it isnt.

well, friend is a well liked, respected member of this community, so with any luck she'll pass by and fill us in, cos so far we dont know....

< Message edited by lally3 -- 4/1/2008 1:59:35 AM >

(in reply to BitaTruble)

Post #: 3

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 2:39:13 AM

ownedgirlie

Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
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I'm with Celeste on this one, that my Master's power is his power, whether I am his slave or not. His power over me is what touched and evoked my submission, not the other way around.

I have heard the concept that the submissive is really the one with all the power in a D/s relationship but I do not subscribe to that concept of thinking...at least not in my relationship.

_____________________________

Good is the enemy of great.

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 4

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 3:43:15 AM

SovereignSlave

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Joined: 3/31/2008
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I've got a slightly different take on it. To me, the "power of submission" is the power of letting go. It can be a scary thing to do, but I'm strong enough to get past the fear, to trust my Dominant to take care of me when I let go. Not only that, I was strong enough to wait and chose a Dominant I knew I could trust. Being a submissive, there's a lot of opportunity to be misled, taken advantage of... it takes a "powerful" person to dismiss the riff-raff and wait for someone better, especially if you have a natural inclination towards service and submission. And yes, there's the power gained through the relationship with the Dominant. Ideally, I see myself as an extension, an addition, of their power. On my own, I am capable and strong, and I expect a Dom to treasure that, not just when I submit - which is then a greater token of my trust and respect and love for him - but also through recognition that my strength gives him strength, just as his gives unto me. I will staunchily defend his property so that he doesn't have to. That is my responsibility, and I have to have the power to do so.
So yeah, even though that was a rather disorganized ramble, I see a lot of power in the act of submission. In some ways, it feels a little like being chosen as a general under an emperor. If you get the right person to bow down to, you empower eachother through that act of submission.

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

Post #: 5

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 4:36:24 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
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If you don't choose to submit, then he can't dominate you. I'm assuming the phrase refers to the power that submissives give to their dominants. Which we don't give to a twit who sends a "kneel bitch" email.

As to who has the ultimate power in a relationship? Both or none. I can't walk up to somebody and announce I'm his new sub just like he can't walk up to me and announce he's my new dom. Either we're both in it or neither of us are.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to SovereignSlave)

Post #: 6

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 4:47:22 AM

lally3

Posts: 595
Joined: 3/4/2008
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yes to all the above.

was working on someones feet an hour ago, she was happily rambling away, so i started to think about this a bit more. in the context of what this phrase was used in i wonder too if its also to do with freedom to express in safety.

im talking about female submissives because, well, thats all i know about.

the power of submission on the submissive as a means of developing her sexuality, that she can turn herself into whatever her master requires because she is encouraged to be that feminine ideal of lover, friend and whore (for him). with attention to details on being the most she can for him she is being given the freedom to express the power of her own feminity. the power of submission on the submissive works to free a person from her hang ups and insecurities and let her just be whatever her dominant wants her to be.... maybe.....

its a key to unlocking the door behind which all and everything is possible that maybe in a different sort of relationship isnt there. recalling vanilla relationships there was so much that was taboo and unexplored.. neither one talking about what they wanted for fear of freaking their partner out and looking wierd.

i think.... something like that anyway

(in reply to SovereignSlave)

Post #: 7

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 6:20:50 AM

OmegaG

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Joined: 10/23/2007
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Besides what SovereignSlave said. I think there is power in acceptance of who you are and allowing youself to forgo societal convention and allowing yourself the freedom to be who you want, not just who everyone else wants you to be.

I go rounds with feminists as they don't see me as a true feminist because I advocate individual choice and I think that women should have just as much of an oppurtunity to be a stay at home mom as the CEO of a fortune 500 company.

There is power in being true to yourself.

_____________________________

Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable. Sydney J. Harris

Sex without pain is like food without taste.
- de Sade

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 8

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 7:08:28 AM

mistoferin

Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
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I think that the phrase is along the same lines as "freedom in slavery".

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Peace and light,
~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

When you make a habit of playing on the tracks, you thereby forfeit the right to bitch when you get hit by a train.

"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

(in reply to OmegaG)

Post #: 9

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 7:11:21 AM

Leatherist

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline

In any relationship-the party with the most need-has the least power.

Labels mean nothing in that regard.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 10

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 7:14:23 AM

brokenheart56

Posts: 14
Joined: 3/4/2007
From: south carolina
Status: offline

hi!!! i am a dom an would like to respond an give a males input. you subs are correct in saying you have power. without your willing desires to be submissive a dom can not control you. an i belive you should do this for people you trust an know will listen to your needs an limts. i feel a subs desires an limts are very inportant. she should feel safe an secure an her biggest fear when she or he is being punished is what it will be done with, not will it go to far an me being forced into something i do not want or fear. remember both of you should respect the others needs an wishes. give yourself because you care for this person an you feel safe. yes you are your masters slave an sex toy, but you are a person. you desire to serve does not mean you are not inportant. take care an good luck

(in reply to OmegaG)

Post #: 11

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 7:32:31 AM

epiphany

Posts: 41
Joined: 12/31/2004
Status: offline

Power in submission...I wrote something years ago on "The powerful submissive / slave", it could be the same thing maybe. Not sure

It was about knowing yourself well, and being brutally honest concerning your motivations in this. It was about self awareness and comming into this as a powerful person in your own right, who has chosen to submit to an individual as opposed to a title, desire or fantasy ideal.

It talked about responsibility in self developement and growth as opposed to wanting someone to take control of your life ( or staying stagnant while waiting) because you wanted an "out" for having to be an adult.

It was about the idea that if you are not a powerful person in your own right, you have little to offer in a power exchange dynamic. The more you bring to the table as a fully evolved, self aware adult...the better able you are to serve well, and the less likely you are to make bad choices on who to serve out of a place of weakness or desperation.

It said a bunch of other things, I can't remember...sorry, getting older and no longer have that piece, lol.

It was mainly me thinking out loud and really, those things apply to just being human as well.

epiphany

(in reply to brokenheart56)

Post #: 12

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 7:58:51 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

some folks see submission as a gift---to be given, others as some sort of power---to wield, yet others see it as weakness----something they would never want their offspring to be.

this slave sees submission as:
an inherent trait of personality
the process of training for various things and reasons
a sexual orientation
and/or
a relationship orientation.

submission in the context of a relationship could be a gift or a nightmare, a wielding of power or a surrender of it, a perfect fit or a horrible mismatch, depending on the individuals involved.

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 13

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 8:13:57 AM

Poetryinpain

Posts: 341
Joined: 3/20/2008
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epiphany, thank you. That was lovely. And it spoke my thoughts as well.

pip, applauding

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There is none so blind as he who will not see.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 14

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 8:53:37 AM

chamberqueen

Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline

In a sense the sub has the ultimate power, because if they are not getting what they want out of the session (or relationship) they can simply walk out the door. As much as it is for the Dom/mes pleasure, if the sub is not receiving enough pleasure of their own they will simply end the relationship.

Of course, that doesn't mean topping from the bottom or purposely misbehaving, or expecting that everything will always be pleasant. It shouldn't mean that at the first sign of a disagreeable task a mature sub is ready to bolt.

This goes back to my favorite part of the lifestyle: communication. If a sub isn't getting what they need it is their job to talk it over, respectfully, with their Dom/me. I find it very useful to compliment the things that I like the most about Him and O/our relationship. It is a very small form of power and manipulation, but He has the final say in whether something will be done again or continue.

_____________________________

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 15

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 9:12:11 AM

metalmiss

Posts: 341
Joined: 5/4/2005
From: Croydon, UK
Status: offline

i have heard this referred to before, my take on it is this..

Firstly, the power in the relationship is His, no question or doubt, completely & utterly His.

To me the power of my submission refers to its effect upon myself, what it does to me, the way it holds me so tenderly even at my most fragile moments. When i have an soul touching submissive moment i do feel powerful, but that is a power that lies dormant within me. It is the spark within that makes me love so much what i am, what i do, it reassures me of the fact that it takes alot of strength to be a slave & that power within me fuels that strength.

_____________________________

"The longing to serve, to submit, to abandon oneself sexually, emotionally, and physically makes one a slave either to a Man, a Woman or to God. Submission to that passion is divine degradation." - Dorothy C. Hayden

Owned by RavenMuse

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 16

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 9:19:23 AM

colouredin

Posts: 4279
Joined: 2/2/2007
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Umm I see submission as powerful, to submit, the word means to yeild which suggests that you have something to yeild, you are choosing to submit to someone often when you wouldnt submit to just anyone. Just look at these boards most of the respected submissives on here are thoughtful, bright, well spoken and strong willed, they arent weak.

There can be dignaty and grace in submission I know many of you dont like the story but when O is asked to pick the mask and Stefan says sorry she says "Dont say sorry I am not ashamed of who I am" she then picks the bird of prey due to its symbol of power, the scene that follows is a beautiful scene I think. Its a good analogy though I dont know how many people have been to a bird sanctuary, a bird like a hawk to me is a fantastic symbol of independance and power and pride, in a sanctuary they submit to their trainer they come when they are called but they remain the same symbol. I think its probably a bit romanticised but thats how I like to look at it.

Also though i dont think a Dominant person is powerless without a submissive but the submissive does empower them in a physical way, you can see their Dominance in the submissive.

_____________________________

Resident Lime(y) Tart
There would be no gossip without secrets
I don't want to be anything other than what I've been trying to be lately

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELvfMJoKDAk

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 17

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 9:32:26 AM

charlotteS

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Joined: 3/9/2008
Status: offline

I have to agree with beth on this one. I see submission as an inherent part of who I am and if I had to say there was some sort of power in it I would equate it with a personal power or strength. The closer I come to being true to myself the more powerful I feel but that doesn't mean I feel power over Master because I am submitting to him. I feel the most personal strength when I feel the smallest in his arms.

charlotte

_____________________________

"When you are your freest self, who are you?" Jack Rinella

(in reply to colouredin)

Post #: 18

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 9:40:20 AM

Stephann

Posts: 4214
Joined: 12/27/2006
From: Portland, OR
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3

i know that without submission a dominant is powerless, but that isnt what this means or is it. i dont think im fond of that analogy, it suggests that we have power over our dominants - so what is it.

Rather than derail this thread, I've offered my hijack comments here.

Stephan

_____________________________

Nosce Te Ipsum

"The blade itself incites to violence" - Homer

Men: Find a Woman here

(in reply to lally3)

Post #: 19

RE: power of submission - 4/1/2008 9:47:10 AM

softness

Posts: 2918
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: Leeds, UK
Status: offline

echoing charlotte and beth

submission is a word, amoung many, that labels part of my character and personality... am not weak person,or a hopeless person, I cant not survive alone. By giving control of myself over to my Dominant I dont have power over Him (its why I dislike the "submission is a gift" thing ) I am utterly empowerd by being owned. Everyday I am faced with evidence that who I am and the choices I make, the way I chose to behave and dress and spend my time is all pleasing to another person. Eventually those choices will all focus on what I can do to serve and please Him everyday ... what I can give and be that will promote and enrich His contentment. Every time I please Him, or see evidence that His life is more filled with ease and happiness because of me I feel wonderful about myself, every timeI struggle and suffer and achieve I know that it is for and because of Him.

For me the power of submission is the power I get from being given the space and opportunity to be the whole and entire me. It'snot about power to be used on something external, its the power that keeps yourself going, and makes you radiate a very compelling energy. Thereare few things harder to resit in a person, that seeing they know themselves,and are making positive and confident choices based on that knowledge

< Message edited by softness -- 4/1/2008 9:53:33 AM >

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veritas, respectus honorque in corio

(in reply to charlotteS)

Post #: 20

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