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How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/17/2008 10:21:46 PM   
EXODUS1


Posts: 86
Joined: 3/16/2008
Status: offline 		EXODUS1 here.
 
Just wondering how you as Masters, Mistresses,
Switches, treat a sub or submissive?
 
Is it the same way or is it because one is stricter then the other? {meaning slave being stricter then submissive.}
 
When I've gone to munches I've seen where a slave was kept more secluded more silent.
 
Slaves, submissives, what gives you your distinction?
 
quote:

"It's late and my mind is racing sorry."
 
EXODUS1
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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/17/2008 10:24:09 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		Nothing.  One's personal relationship orientation is NOT social status.  Unless I'm under orders or within a personal relationship with someone, what their orientation is has absolutely no relevance on how we are to interact.

It is a stereotypical fallacy in the scene that quiet/shy = good sub...but such is life.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/17/2008 10:24:15 PM   
RumpusParable


Posts: 1923
Joined: 7/7/2005
From: NYC now!
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EXODUS1

EXODUS1 here.
 
Just wondering how you as Masters, Mistresses,
Switches, treat a sub or submissive?
 
Is it the same way or is it because one is stricter then the other? {meaning slave being stricter then submissive.}
 
When I've gone to munches I've seen where a slave was kept more secluded more silent.
 
Slaves, submissives, what gives you your distinction?
 
quote:

"It's late and my mind is racing sorry."
 
EXODUS1


I treat them on the same basis as anyone dominantly inclined or neutral to it all:  on the basis of how they present themselves, whether we find anything of mutual interest to talk about, etc.

And no, it's not at all a general rule that slaves are treated stricter than submissives in personal dynamics or in open company.  There is no universal there.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/17/2008 10:28:17 PM   
madshysoul


Posts: 105
Joined: 2/25/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EXODUS1

EXODUS1 here.
 
Just wondering how you as Masters, Mistresses,
Switches, treat a sub or submissive?
 
Is it the same way or is it because one is stricter then the other? {meaning slave being stricter then submissive.}
 
When I've gone to munches I've seen where a slave was kept more secluded more silent.
 
Slaves, submissives, what gives you your distinction?
 
quote:

"It's late and my mind is racing sorry."
 
EXODUS1


In my experience behavior is dependant on the rules of the gathering. At a normal munch in my neck of the woods, we're all just human. What we are in private has no bearing.  At a private gathering, or one where the rules are agreed upon by the attendees, then any other rule may apply. (IE secluded slave, submissives attendant on Tops etc)

For my own two pfenning, were someone that I was not in any type of relationship with to presume the right to treat me as a slave (whatever their definition of might be), I would find their behavior exceedingly rude. If they aren't my Captain, then I (and He) expect normal, cordial behavior out of all parties.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/17/2008 10:31:50 PM   
SteelofUtah


Posts: 5307
Joined: 10/2/2007
From: St George Utah
Status: offline 		I think you will find the term itself has little to do with the actions.

The Protocol for the event as well as the Protocol between Master and slave or Master and sub or Dom and slave or Dom and sub will play a greater part then the terms used to describe them.

I think the terms we use have very little to do with what it is that we want. Yes I know there are those who say I want a sub not a slave but in the end isn't it the behavior they are looking for? So if a sub caerries themselves they way a Master thinks a slave ought to do you think the Master will care that they girl does not consider herself a slave?

I want Surrender and Dedication she can call herself a sipiwalla for all I care..... as long as she is devoted to me and me alone.

Ultimatly what we want is an IDEA not a WORD. At least that is the way it works best for me. Your personal Mileage may vary.

Steel

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/17/2008 10:40:45 PM   
SlaveSimone


Posts: 95
Joined: 3/17/2008
From: Denver, Co
Status: offline 		Every one in the scene seems to have their own opinions on the difference between a sub and a slave and how they should be treated. i've heard from many in the scene that a slave has no limits and is willing to serve their Master or Mistress in any manner they so desire, where as a sub does have limits. As to if i agree with this.. i really don't know. Words can be so arbitrary.
Does Master treat me differently then if he were to call me his sub rather then his slave? Most likely not.  

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/17/2008 10:47:10 PM   
Kirren


Posts: 580
Joined: 9/5/2007
Status: offline 		I think its been said many times, that this lifestyle is personal and indivudalized with each couple, and their specific dynamic, what the day has in store for them, or what their home life is like.

Some do differentiate, others see no real difference, and some just dont care to contend with labels. I dont treat them any differently. I look at the person and that persons actions and I move forward from there. If the person happens to have a submissive nature, then so be it. If they have a submissive nature, but want to show their ass and act a fool in a group setting, I disacossiate with them and go on to some one more along My lines of thinking and behavior. Its really just personal preference I think.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 12:48:26 AM   
chamberqueen


Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline 		I think that it is an interesting question since you seem to have noticed a distinction.  However, the distinction might not be as much due to the treatment of the Dom/me but says more about the personalities of the people.  I have moved from the status of a sub to a slave in my own relationship, and I know that adoration came with that.  It makes me more confident, which leads to a more sparkling personality.

My natural way when out in public settings tends to swing between being the center of attention (typically as the hostess type, making sure everyone is being taken care of, purposely seeking out those not talking) to wallflower.  I am not very good at the in between.  What you noticed may have simply been some who are not particularly good at mixing, or whose minds were so focused on watching for their Top's needs that they chose not to get as involved.  I think it has much more to do with their personalities than the way they are treated.


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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 5:07:48 AM   
sambamanslilgirl


Posts: 10926
Joined: 2/5/2007
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline 		speaking for myself solely - i treat my pet the same way Daddy treats me - loving care and dominance however with a slight twist.  since mine is a pain sissy, he loves it when i mix pain and humiliation together.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 5:40:19 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		Well, at a kink event I'd doubt very much that anyway would notice a difference between how I treat a slave and how I treat a submissive because if we are at a scene event, we are in scene.

The only possible difference I can think of is that I'd probably introduce my slave first because he's been with me longest.

Other differences might relate to how long training has been going on with the submissive. His first munch? I'd send him with my slave to go get me food or refill my drink.

I would never isolate or silence my slave or submissive at an event. In fact, I've often made a point of pulling them into conversations because one of my biggest scene pet peeves is people being treated differently because of their Ds identity by folks who are not in that dynamic. I do not, however, pull other people's slaves and sub into conversations because I respect their dynamic's rules.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 5:51:02 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		He doesn't want me silent and obedient. Because for me, that means I'm operating out of fear. He wants me feisty and passionate, the opposite of silent obedience.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 1:48:45 PM   
EXODUS1


Posts: 86
Joined: 3/16/2008
Status: offline
quote:

I treat them on the same basis as anyone dominantly inclined or neutral to it all:  on the basis of how they present themselves, whether we find anything of mutual interest to talk about, etc.

And no, it's not at all a general rule that slaves are treated stricter than submissives in personal dynamics or in open company.  There is no universal there.


So in accordenance to what your quote says,
you feel that a Slave and Submissive are 1?
 
quote:

He doesn't want me silent and obedient. Because for me, that means I'm operating out of fear. He wants me feisty and passionate, the opposite of silent obedience.

 
Are you Submisse or a Slave?
 
EXODUS1



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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 1:50:59 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EXODUS1
So in accordenance to what your quote says,
you feel that a Slave and Submissive are 1?

For me, they are different orientations (which may be contained in ONE person in case you weren't aware).  But their orientations are meaningless and irrelevant in a social gathering unless specifically structured to be so- in which case all attendants would have been identified by orientation and the expectations would have been clearly laid out beforehand.

I believe dominant is a different orientation from a submissive...I just don't care which you are presently identifying as and won't treat you differently unless I want to form a personal relationship with you.
 


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Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 1:53:22 PM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline 		LA; I appreciate this pov as I was treated shabbily not too long ago because I apparently wasn't slave-like enough for the person we were meeting with.
HoneyMaster expects me to be myself...unless He tells me to be a pony, or a kitty, or...well...whatever He comes up with...

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 1:58:11 PM   
EXODUS1


Posts: 86
Joined: 3/16/2008
Status: offline
quote:

For me, they are different orientations (which may be contained in ONE person in case you weren't aware).  But their orientations are meaningless and irrelevant in a social gathering unless specifically structured to be so- in which case all attendants would have been identified by orientation and the expectations would have been clearly laid out beforehand.

I believe dominant is a different orientation from a submissive...I just don't care which you are presently identifying as and won't treat you differently unless I want to form a personal relationship with you.

 
Why not just combinethe 2 together and call them  {Subsaves}?
 
I'm going by what I see in profiles and in person.
 
If it is different then please tell me how?
 
EXODUS1
 
 


< Message edited by EXODUS1 -- 4/18/2008 1:59:36 PM >

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 2:14:24 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EXODUS1
Why not just combinethe 2 together and call them  {Subsaves}?

Becuase it's not for me to label another.  They may choose to go with whatever label they like.
quote:

If it is different then please tell me how?

I can only tell you my own definitions, which are repeated multiple times in the "sub vs slaves" thread which abound if you search for them.

I will not impose my definitions on another.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 3:15:21 PM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline 		Exodus - I am unsure of what you are meaning by your OP.. but I will answer as I understand your meaning.

I see a difference between slave and submissive.  Ultimately.. the only difference at it's core is a slave will tranfers all authority.. while a submissive transfers limited authority.

In all areas that I have authority in my given power dynamic.. I will hold the slave/submissive accountable.   If held accountable is being strict.. then I suppose I am.

However,... with a submissive... I do not have authority in all things and therefore... I will, in general, being hold a slave accountable more often than a submissive because of the difference in authority structures.

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An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

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RE: How much differently do you treat the 2? - 4/18/2008 4:38:46 PM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline 		I am slave to my Sir - in public (BDSM), i defer to my Sir, but i am allowed to be myself - and in public i tend towards outgoing and cheeky. I tend to let my mouth get ahead of my brain, whereupon my Sir reins me in. He has never had to gag me  - yet!

I have seen quiet subs and slaves, and think they are just quiet people. It would be a hardship for me to be made be quiet, and i  would not enjoy the gathering at all, and since i have seen no sign of distress from the sub/slaves, i think it is just their personality.

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