need advice about bowing basement wall

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needsadvice -> need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 2:44:23 PM)
i know is strange thing to post here, but i come to this site only pretty much....anyways wondering if anyone knows anything about bowing basement wall and what is best permanent and cost effective way to fix? i have heard everything from braces to digging up all around it from the outside and replacing the wall. it is a corner of the basement, bowed out almost 4 inches i think. is no apperent sinking of foundation though. i am wondering how they determine what caused it whether it is just water or???... any advice or comments from anyone who has experienced this or esp someone who does this for a living(i can dream right grin) would be soo very much appreciated i want to get his fixed so i can rent it out and find a 24/7 situation and become a slave, so am very ready to get it fixed and get the ball rolling thanks everone

popeye1250 -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 3:42:15 PM)
Ask me next week, after the fire.

Aylee -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 3:44:52 PM)
You really need to hire a contractor or a civil engineer and have them come out and look at it.

RealityLicks -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 3:48:46 PM)
I would call a builder first thing, if I were you. It's impossible for anyone to tell you too much online - maybe you need a new damp course or maybe the house is about to fall on your head. Good luck and I hope you get to make a second post.

seeksfemslave -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 3:50:54 PM)
Look needsadvice its no good asking questions like that. If you had said anything about putting the world to rights then this is the place to ask. A solution to your problem needs hard work, and we thinkers dont think too highly of that.

Padriag -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:08:42 PM)
Well... as it happens I am a building contractor. Unfortunately Realitylicks is right, its impossible to tell you too much online. Based on what you have said it sounds like it might be one of two problems. You said the foundation hadn't sunk, assuming that is true then the bow could be caused by improper drainage and the resulting water pressure building up. Or, depending on the soil conditions it could simply be pressure from sandy soil. Or it could have been an improperly built foundation wall. Or a very old house. Or some combination of any of that. If its water pressure then drains and a sump pump will have to be installed to take care of the water... or else you can dig up the foundation on the outside and fill with 57 grade gravel adding a drain line to carry the water away from the foundation. For the short term bracing can work, but its not the best solution. Most likely soil needs to be removed, a new wall poured or built (in some cases a block wall can be used, but a poured concrete wall is stronger and better), gravel placed behind the wall and a drain pipe installed below grade to carry off the water. However, that's just speculation based on the sketchy information you gave and my own experience... you won't really know until you get a reputable building contractor in there. Make sure they have the following certifications on their license (ask to see it), BLD (building contractor), CEM (concrete contractor), BRK (masonry contractor). They should also be a registered land disturber (RLD) due to the amount of excavation required (probably more than 10,000 cubic feet). Also make sure they are insured with a general liability policy covering at least $1,000,000 per incident. Anyone who can't meet the above qualifications doesn't have any business messing with your foundation.

needsadvice -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:16:25 PM)
thank you padriag.. and yes it is an older house-and i am just wanting to know from someone who has an idea, if i should have someone else come out besides the companies doing estimates, for obvious reasons...also if it is best to dig it up and have new wall poured, would whoel two walls have be replaced? it is just the corner, about 5 ft of each corner is all that seems to be affected although im sure going a bit past that would be what theyd do even if dont have to replace entire wall right? i am assuming that is very expensive but i had heard diff things so dont know the ballpark at all. so should i have a building contractor come out to tell me what the problem is before i get estimates? thanks

Rule -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:23:40 PM)
If it is caused by water hypothetically planting one or more trees might do the trick. Trees suck water out of the ground and evaporate it into the air.

needsadvice -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:27:30 PM)
wanted to add house is in central kansas area not sure about soil type really

Padriag -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:40:49 PM)
Nooooooo.... don't plant a tree near a foundation! Little trees grow into bigger ones and pretty soon the roots are shoving that wall over! Never plant a tree within 15' of your home, you'll end up with foundation problems down the line. A good contractor needs to look at that corner, it has me concerned because if its a corner its very important structurally to the house. It is possible they can just replace the corner, particularly if its a block wall. But you say its an old house, if 1950 or prior its probably poured concrete rather than block. That would mean cutting the concrete, drilling into the ends and adding rebar to tie the new wall into the old. They'll need to cut far enough back to be into solid wall... probably at least a couple of feet from where the bow begins (possibly less, I'm giving a safety margin because I can't see the wall to guage it). I can't begin to ballpark the price, it can vary dramatically depending on where you are. For example here I can hire an excavator for $125 an hour which is relatively cheap, go to northern VA and the price is about double or triple that. My advice would be to call several contractors and get estimates from them... and don't be shy about letting them know you are getting multiple estimates... that always makes us drop our prices a lil bit [;)] You're contractor is going to need an excavator or backhoe, 3-4 laborers, plus tools and materials. To pour an 8 inch thick wall, say 8 ft by 8ft will require 1.5 yards of concrete, or 3 yards to do both sides of the corner. If they order more concrete than that, ask them why. They'll also need to build temporary jacks to support the corner of the house while removing the old foundation. They can either use metal house jacks, in this case most probably screw jacks... or they can build wooden braces using 2x6 lumber with cross bracing. Don't be shy about calling your local building inspector and have them check up on things. However, be careful about using a contractor recommended by a building inspector... sometimes they have a lil buddy system going, its corrupt, but it happens.

KatyLied -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:43:56 PM)
Listen to Padriag, call a professional, this is your house you are talking about. Find a friend with a backhoe because that stuff can get expensive fast.

proudsub -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:44:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule If it is caused by water hypothetically planting one or more trees might do the trick. Trees suck water out of the ground and evaporate it into the air. Be careful, trees grow and roots can severly damage foundations over the years.

TrinityMorgan -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:44:45 PM)
Don't plant a tree, if the foundation is messed up, then the tress will find the weakness and make it even worse. Good luck though with whom ever you hire to fix it.

needsadvice -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 4:51:09 PM)
dont worry i know about roots on trees id never plant next to it....but yes i have to have someone let them in i cant be there due to work, so i will def have them all come same day so he can let them in and i guess they will cross each other path perhaps i am just hoping is not so high that i cant have it done

ForBabyGirl123 -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 5:20:05 PM)
Concrete man here! its leaning out and the wall has no bow in it??? and its corner?? my bet the footing is moving or the block are old and collapsing... most of the time when you see the block moving out at the top of the house,they are moving in in the middle and the top is leaning out... the cause is not question thow... how to fix it is... And doing it your self can be dangerous.. jack the house corner up and slowlly tap the block back in ..once in place redo the joints with cement. (do not take all the pressure off the walls) the weight of the house might be the only thing holding them up... just enuff so they will bump.. and yes you will have to dig all the way down to the problem area...(use rubber hammer and bump against boards when you bump the block so you dont break them. Thats the cheepest way... But i dont advise you doing it your self...its not easy work and can be dangerous if you dont know what can collaps on you.. even whole you dig can cave in on you and pin you against the wall.... I have dont them both ways..relayed the whole wall and cosmetic repaired them as i was talking above... most contractors give (free estimates) call one!!! IF i was closer i would fix it for a blow job...ah ha ha ha

Griswold -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 5:30:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: needsadvice i know is strange thing to post here, but i come to this site only pretty much....anyways wondering if anyone knows anything about bowing basement wall and what is best permanent and cost effective way to fix? i have heard everything from braces to digging up all around it from the outside and replacing the wall. it is a corner of the basement, bowed out almost 4 inches i think. is no apperent sinking of foundation though. i am wondering how they determine what caused it whether it is just water or???... any advice or comments from anyone who has experienced this or esp someone who does this for a living(i can dream right grin) would be soo very much appreciated i want to get his fixed so i can rent it out and find a 24/7 situation and become a slave, so am very ready to get it fixed and get the ball rolling thanks everone Any correct answer would require an understanding of where you live, the rock formations, water tables, depth that your foundation was laid, etc. Since your profile says you're in DC, that means not only that most of the concrete in your area is made with limestone rock which is very porous and water absorbant and generally speaking, most foundations in your location are laid rock with mortar (depending on year built) as opposed to poured concrete, ergo, more likely to absorb moisture. Further, because you're in DC, you have stinging deep freezes and historic heat in the summer....read: expansion and contraction. If you were in Downtown DC or Arlington, you have a high water table, meaning your foundation, however it's built is more likely to absorb water because there's more of it....if you are actually in Manassas (sp?), you have a higher water table and another problem (such as poor construction, or age) could be the problem. Your question is kind of like "what does a car cost?" Define the issues and you're likely to get a better answer.

needsadvice -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 6:12:54 PM)
well it is bowed inward about waste high, no trees near it, not at bottom of hill or anything, i think is lot of clay in kansas area-maybe is from expansion from the cold winter--is in russell kansas so can i hire a person to come out with their backhoe and work with a contractor so it is less per hr or does the company doing the actual work usually require that they do the digging as well?

ForBabyGirl123 -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 6:15:40 PM)
I know i can jack the whole house up and lay the whole bacement for 15,000. then sit the house back on in Illinois...Some states cost a little more...But the state your talking about should not be any different... Make sure they are insured local contractor.. and you can get that wall fixed for less then 5000 if its just that corner.... I will fly there get the city permits if needed and fix it for less than 5000.. dont let them fool you on prices... It is a two day job.. I would guess it $2000 to $4000 but should be closer to 2000 .... there is no equipment needed that cant fit in the back of a pickup truck... hand dig it in 3 to 5 hours...lay it back in 4 ... next day put the dirt back. get a concrete contractor not a general contractor.... general contractor will give you price and then get me to do it...lol

ForBabyGirl123 -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 6:20:17 PM)
Its water.... : p and the water table can do it, but i am beting the down spout drops down right there ... but fixing it is all the same...

needsadvice -> RE: need advice about bowing basement wall (4/20/2008 6:24:07 PM)
well a few thousand would be wonderful to hear for an estimate im not sure if should use a small company or a big one---i dont see how hand dug would take only 3-5 hours i mean thats alot of dirt, you know to go down i guess like 8 ft and an area prob 8 ft on each wall of that corner

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