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Training a new submissive - 10/13/2005 9:36:17 AM   
LoPan


Posts: 2
Joined: 10/4/2005
Status: offline 		I've been involved in the lifestyle for a long time, but, I've never had a new girl. The ones I've known have all been trained by someone else. I'm curious about taking a girl with a submissive desire and teaching her to serve from scratch. Any advice, protocols, or tips would be appreciated.

Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/13/2005 9:39:19 AM   
EmeraldSlave2


Posts: 3645
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Be practical- what do you need her to do for you? How can she be used and be made useful?

Once you figure that out, then you focus your training towards those things. How would any person learn how to do them well?

(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/13/2005 10:51:33 AM   
sub4hire


Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

I've been involved in the lifestyle for a long time, but, I've never had a new girl. The ones I've known have all been trained by someone else. I'm curious about taking a girl with a submissive desire and teaching her to serve from scratch. Any advice, protocols, or tips would be appreciated.


How can a person be trained by anyone else when everyone is unique? Have you never wanted to have a relationship with anyone before?
Don't you have certain wants and needs?
I realize we have all had relationships prior to a new one. Well, at least most of us have. My old dom used to want dinner at 5pm every night. Doug wants dinner when dinner is ready. Small example but it is only one of many.
I cannot imagine Doug not telling me he would want dinner at a different time if he wanted it at say 8 instead of 5. That's all part of training and getting to know one another.
Compromise.
If you just take whatever is there without doing any sort of work you are doing both of you a dis-service.

(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/13/2005 10:59:22 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

I'm curious about taking a girl with a submissive desire and teaching her to serve from scratch. Any advice, protocols, or tips would be appreciated.


LoPan,
This may sound strange, but my advise would be to allow her the freedom and encourage her to seek perspectives about the lifestyle from sources other than yourself. This lifestyle can be a overwhelming to the novice. There are so many tangents and sub-categories that you can't possibly bring her up to your level of experience without using other resources. This forum is one. If you are so inclined taking her to demonstrations or munches, or even play parties (just to observe) are others.

Let her know you are there to hold her hand through the experience. Make sure she trusts that you will not put her in a position she can't handle. Answer all her questions honestly, especially those like "you aren't planning on doing that to me are you?" And you need enough confidence to tell her "I don't know" or better yet, "I can't", or " I don't know how to do that", if she is anxious to try or see something she learns about during her education.

Good luck.

(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/13/2005 11:33:19 AM   
plantlady64


Posts: 755
Joined: 5/19/2005
Status: offline 		Hello There,
I am a relatively new person in this wonderful matrix we are in too.
The way I have been training is to read books (Different Loving has been my favorite so far), talking to people, participating in the face-to-face community functions & trial and error.
The funny thing I found was most of the Doms I've met didn't want to be the first to do something new with me. It's like they were concerned about my reactions to the point they were fearful to allow the experience to happen under their hand. Most didn't want to be responsible for my virgin journeys.
Even My Master is uncomfortable in some of the acts of play I've never tried before.
I was very fortunate to find a wonderfully sadistic edge player Dom friend in my local dungeon who was willing to help me find my new sensations and experiences and has done most of my Major kinky firsts to me, for me.
The thing I've found was reading about things gave me ideas as to what was there but was not really a good way for me to decide if I liked something or not. Going to Black Rose presentations and the public dungeon gave me a much better perspective as to what I wanted to try or not. For example I read about pony play and thought it was very hot, but when I saw it in a presentation I went totally cold and decided it was not for me. I also thought no way in hell would I ever find a cane sexy when I'd read about them, but the presentation made me so hot it was hard not to ask the presenter to cane me when he was done with the lesson.
I'd also like to say like others here to communicate with her as to what she's dying to try, OK with trying, what she's afraid to try, and what she thinks would be hard limits for her. Maybe a journal of her thought and feelings would help.
I have several links to sub literature. If you're interested you can send me a message and I'll get the links out of my yahoo account for you. They were very beneficial to me.

I think overall you should just feel her out & do what your gut instincts tell you to do for her. Some start out ready for everything & others 3 years later that still are only willing to try things in their mind. To gauge what she's ready for will have to be based on where she as an individual is in her life.

Good luck to you both,.

Sincerely,
sub suzanne


(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/13/2005 12:28:30 PM   
fastlane


Posts: 2159
Joined: 5/26/2005
Status: offline 		Fastlane, shakes his head and thinks, "Damn Braggart!"

You have found the perfect instrument to train to your kink/fit.

It's like a golfer going to a Pro, for a lesson and the Pro saying forget everything you were taught, your swing is atrocious.
He would much rather have a willing novice to train to his mechanics...for example...

If you have any experience, you will know what to do instinctively and you will also feed from her inquiries as to what to do, how to do it and when?

Damn, I hate you Man!

_____________________________

Just because it hurts, doesn't necessarily make it a bad thing.

(in reply to plantlady64)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/13/2005 8:15:00 PM   
OscarHargraves


Posts: 693
Joined: 8/9/2005
Status: offline 		Fastlane is right. You are one very lucky fellow. Remember that and remember to respect what she is offering you. Everyone says this differently but in my humble opinion there are three things that make up a good sex life or a good relationship. They are: attitude, Attitude, and ATTITUDE!! If you both have the right attitude going into this and you COMMUNICATE like so many others here are telling you to do, you will find that it's really pretty easy. Listen when she tells you about her wants, desires and needs (and be sure you really understand what she's telling you). Don't ass-u-me that she knows what you want and need. Be sure that you communicate these things clearly and repeat them as often as necessary to get your point across. Also be sure to set aside some time for the two of you when you can just sit and talk. Turn off the TV and the 'puter and the Heavy Metal music and be with each other. I recommend the 'positive reinforcement' method of training. I would much rather reward her for doing good things than punish her repeatedly for not doing so. Limit the real punishment to those times when it's really called for.

Again I'll say you are one very lucky fella and I sincerely hope you know it and act accordingly.

< Message edited by OscarHargraves -- 10/13/2005 8:19:13 PM >

_____________________________

Never drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ! !

(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/13/2005 8:50:07 PM   
Soulhuntre


Posts: 223
Joined: 9/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LoPan
I've been involved in the lifestyle for a long time, but, I've never had a new girl. The ones I've known have all been trained by someone else. I'm curious about taking a girl with a submissive desire and teaching her to serve from scratch. Any advice, protocols, or tips would be appreciated.


Ah, the classic question - and one that is always interesting to see the answers to. Decide if you want to train her or teach her. They are not the same concepts, though many in the BDSM community tent to use the words interchangebly.

The actualy theory is easy:


  • Decide how you want them to act that is beneficial, pleasurable and useful for yourself
  • Decide which of those is best handled as education or training
  • Go about handling each of those :)


You may find this helpful...


Punishment, Correction and Conditioning in the Shaping of Human Tools

(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/14/2005 7:53:59 AM   
stormie


Posts: 27
Joined: 4/29/2004
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

I'm curious about taking a girl with a submissive desire and teaching her to serve from scratch. Any advice, protocols, or tips would be appreciated.


LoPan,
This may sound strange, but my advise would be to allow her the freedom and encourage her to seek perspectives about the lifestyle from sources other than yourself. This lifestyle can be a overwhelming to the novice. There are so many tangents and sub-categories that you can't possibly bring her up to your level of experience without using other resources. This forum is one. If you are so inclined taking her to demonstrations or munches, or even play parties (just to observe) are others.

Let her know you are there to hold her hand through the experience. Make sure she trusts that you will not put her in a position she can't handle. Answer all her questions honestly, especially those like "you aren't planning on doing that to me are you?" And you need enough confidence to tell her "I don't know" or better yet, "I can't", or " I don't know how to do that", if she is anxious to try or see something she learns about during her education.

Good luck.


Greetings All,
girl has to agree's with Mercnbeth on all aspects of novice. For girl is in a new Real Life Relationship. He is showing me new things and asking questions all the time. As is girl of Him. Learning is a Great Tool. Be Open and Honest about all the things you wil learn and seek. Master always makes sure I stay in contact with those I trust and share with them my learnings. The two things that stick out the most are...
1>Truth
2> Honest
without them two ..any relationship can become weak and fall down or fall short of a true experience.
Hopes this helped in some small way.
GW's Pet
~stormie~

_____________________________

~Fire that Burns within, is a Great Servitude of submission~

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/14/2005 8:15:04 AM   
RainGod


Posts: 230
Joined: 7/11/2005
From: Hendersonville, NC
Status: offline 		I am pretty much in agreement with what My peers here have already said: Train her to suit your unique desires/needs/ideas.

A new submissive is a blank canvas awaiting your artisitc creativity... open to your training... pliable clay in your hands. Indeed...a lucky Dom you are.

With this wonderful blessing comes an almost ominous responsibility that I haven't seen anyone mention here just yet:

Whatever you do with her will shape and mold her into the type of submissive she will be...sometimes forever. The good things you teach are wonderful, but be ever cautious to not damage her while she is in this creative state, for you shape the rest of her future... Temper your discipline with mercy. Mix well your stern strictness with loving affection. Weigh carefully her wrongs, for most times she is worthy of keeping in spite of them.


_____________________________

Love is a razor & I walk the line on that silver blade... slept in the dust with His daughter her eyes red with the slaughter of innocence... The evil that men do lives on & on.
~ Iron Maiden

(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/14/2005 8:32:07 AM   
KatyLied


Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline
quote:

Weigh carefully her wrongs, for most times she is worthy of keeping in spite of them.


Nicely said.

(in reply to RainGod)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/14/2005 9:07:23 AM   
Soulhuntre


Posts: 223
Joined: 9/29/2005
Status: offline 		I launched off from this comment because it was on my mind, not to pick on sub4hire :)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sub4hire
How can a person be trained by anyone else when everyone is unique? Have you never wanted to have a relationship with anyone before?


Because training someone is not always even remotely the same thing as showing them your individual wants.

quote:

ORIGINAL: sub4hire
My old dom used to want dinner at 5pm every night. Doug wants dinner when dinner is ready. Small example but it is only one of many.


And it's a good example... but it isn't really 'training'. You may or may not have been trained in the cooking, preperation and ability to serve such a meal well, but the time it is to be served isn't a training issue.

quote:

ORIGINAL: sub4hire
Compromise.


Training might be many things, but I never really heard anyone seriously call it compromise :)

There are three differnt POV's from three different trainers on the topic available online as well if anyone is interested.

Additionally here is something I wrote for a mailing list that applies to this.

quote:

Soulhuntre: blog posting
For the vast, vast majority of people they will be far better served by "training" their own submissive. I put that in quotes because one of the reasons it is true is the misuse and rather naïve application of the term. When "training" consists to most of the BDSM community as a submissive who sometimes has to kneel for a few minutes and doesn’t wear panties, it’s just as easy to do it at home :)

The usual refrain is that "no one but the owner can teach the submissive to please the owner"… and that is usually true. Most Dominants can’t even begin to articulate their standards, rules and protocol because they don’t really have them. In such a case training to those ill defined goals would be impossible. A large portion of the time the standards that do exist are so trivial anyone could "train" them.

However some types of training, some of the skills someone may desire their submissive to have and some of the mindset they may want created or to enjoy in their property are better handled in another environment, by people with a skill for it.

The reality is that a human being can be trained to be adaptable, obedient and pick up the preferences of their owner quickly. You simply have to recognize that in a very real way the details don’t matter - the changes made on the way to the details do.

Navy Seal training is a perfect example. While the actual activities during the training rarely occur in combat the things taught - discipline, adaptability, survivability, confidence, teamwork, energy and attitude management, leadership and so on - do apply.

Is outside training for everyone? Nope.
Is outside training for most people? Nope.
Is outside training perfect for a small percentage of people? Yup :)

(in reply to sub4hire)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/14/2005 1:34:01 PM   
ThorsHammer


Posts: 49
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		LoPan, you are truly a fortunate Dominant .... but also one who has a very unique and challenging "opportunity." You have been in our lifetyle probably much longer then me but, since you asked for some suggestions, here might be some for you to consider.

When babes and I began our relationship she was extremely inexperienced. However, she had done significant reserach, talked with other submissives ladies, and had a clear understanding she was a submissive and wanted to be in a D/s relationship.

After a month or so into our relationship, I had this "feeling" that "things" were not going as well as I had hoped. I honestly believed we were communicating but something was still not right. We were talking to each other but not really communicating. I also truly begin to understand that the responsibility for taking our relationship in the right direction began with me .... not my submissive. DAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

While taking an evening drive in the country, I had an epithany. How in the hell could I lead her, guide her or teach her to be my "perfect submissive" if I did not have a very clear understanding of EXACTLY what I wanted. So I began the process to answer this question for myself.

I took a piece of paper and made four headings ....... Needs, Wants, Desires, and "Not Sure What Category." I then began to brainstorm. I carried this paper with me everywhere. If an idea or thought occurred to me, I put it down. After a week or so, I began to analyze my list, refine, etc. The more I did this, the more comfortable I became with my vision of where I wanted our relationship to go. All that was missing was the same information from babe.

I told her what I had been doing and asked her to do the same. I carefully expained why I was making my list and my objectives for us. She began her list. After a couple of weeks, after a nice romantic dinner at home, we exchanged our lists and really began to truly communicate. Our relationship truly has now begun to grow in the direction we both want ... Not perfect but one hell of a lot better then the way it was heading.

LoPan .... just a suggestion for you to consider. Good luck and my best wishes for both of you.

Donn


(in reply to Soulhuntre)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/14/2005 1:34:25 PM   
RainGod


Posts: 230
Joined: 7/11/2005
From: Hendersonville, NC
Status: offline
quote:

Nicely said.


Thanks, KatyLied! I appreciate it.

_____________________________

Love is a razor & I walk the line on that silver blade... slept in the dust with His daughter her eyes red with the slaughter of innocence... The evil that men do lives on & on.
~ Iron Maiden

(in reply to KatyLied)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/15/2005 2:14:38 AM   
wolfinside


Posts: 74
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline 		I've been lucky enouph to have trained two submissive women who were novices. They both had been kinky their whole lives and had done some kinky stuff, but neither had been with a dominant and trained. It was wonderful.

But I have trained a few other women who have had lots of "experience" in the lifestyle but have still not had any formal training. So I was always training someone for the first time.

In fact I have never met a "sub" who had been formally trained. (but I've only trained four myself so I haven't trained all that many subs)

It seems that there are a lot of "masters/doms" out there who don't have any kind of training program. They just tie people up and smack them with things, and that's about it.

To each his own.



Wolf





< Message edited by wolfinside -- 10/15/2005 10:04:55 AM >

(in reply to RainGod)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/15/2005 6:45:17 AM   
LoPan


Posts: 2
Joined: 10/4/2005
Status: offline 		I would like to thank all of you for your thoughtful suggestions and examples of past and present methods. This was a fine example of the value of being a part, even peripheraly, of a BDSM community.

(in reply to wolfinside)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/16/2005 3:05:40 PM   
TheChastiser


Posts: 95
Joined: 10/16/2005
From: Hemel Hempstead
Status: offline 		i would say communication is paramount. you must let her ask as many questions as she needs. this will help to build up trust as well as knowledge.

make sure you have an end point in mind for every lesson learnt. make sure she knows she has reached this end point when she has, and then talk her through the journey to that end point, so that you can fill out any knowledge blanks experienced on the way.

go slowly, making sure you set the pace and not her. this way you can act as a check on her progress as she will want to forge ahead even when she isnt ready.

Mike


_____________________________



Let Me unchain your mind and your sexuality will follow.


(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/16/2005 5:37:42 PM   
Auralise


Posts: 36
Joined: 8/2/2005
From: Denver by way of Florida
Status: offline 		I enjoyed your reply RainGod; nicely stated.

Blessings, auralise

(in reply to RainGod)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/16/2005 11:11:51 PM   
Wolfie648


Posts: 600
Joined: 9/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

I've been involved in the lifestyle for a long time, but, I've never had a new girl. The ones I've known have all been trained by someone else. I'm curious about taking a girl with a submissive desire and teaching her to serve from scratch. Any advice, protocols, or tips would be appreciated.


Zero to sixty in 3 seconds is not recommended.

Be honest, teach them everything you can (I'm assuming they want to learn), not just about BDSM, give them the broadest understanding you can. Listening is the best way to get in their heads (they hate that ;-) Communicate. Enjoy the ride and trust yourself at the wheel.

I know that is all very generic and could even be applied to a 'vanilla' (nothing wrong with vanilla) relationship but I've written about 10 paragraphs 2 or 3 at a time and deleted them because they didn't sound right to me.

D (owner of j)

(in reply to LoPan)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Training a new submissive - 10/16/2005 11:38:59 PM   
Wolfie648


Posts: 600
Joined: 9/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

How in the hell could I lead her, guide her or teach her to be my "perfect submissive" if I did not have a very clear understanding of EXACTLY what I wanted.


Amen. I should have just said that rather than the post I already did.

D (owner of j)

(in reply to ThorsHammer)
Profile   Post #: 20
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