RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be

Collarspace Discussion Forums

Home Login Search

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be

View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be

Page: << < prev 1 2 [3]

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be - 5/13/2008 12:13:37 PM

Rule

Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomAviator
even the subatomic particles are in and of themselves matter

How is matter defined? For me only that which can be touched is matter.

(in reply to DomAviator)

Profile

Post #: 41

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be - 5/13/2008 2:05:46 PM

DomAviator

Posts: 1253
Joined: 4/22/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomAviator
even the subatomic particles are in and of themselves matter

How is matter defined? For me only that which can be touched is matter.

The accepted definition of matter in physics is "something that has mass and occupies space" So obvioulsy atoms are matter - but so are the various sub atomic particles - protons, neutrons, electrons. etc which have mass - in the case of electrons it is tiny: 9.1 x 10 to the -28th gram but it is mass nonetheless.. However - photons are NOT matter as they have no mass.

(in reply to Rule)

Profile

Post #: 42

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be - 5/13/2008 6:47:02 PM

thornhappy

Posts: 8596
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

Mass does exist, as does time.

Matter is a consequence of mass, or a derivative. If no mass, then no matter. Take for example a photon. It has no mass, is a particle, but is not matter.

However, photons have momentum (making for confusion if you're using Newtonian physics where momentum = m*v)

thornhappy

(in reply to Rule)

Profile

Post #: 43

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be - 5/13/2008 7:25:36 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

Matter does not exist.

And yet, illusionary or delusional, the myth of matter works for us. My ass is comfortably suspended in the non-existent chair, the glass bottle (which is actually a liquid, rather than a solid) contains a refreshing adult beverage. The gas somehow remains contained inside the plastic case of the lighter, the carved bit of wood somehow contains the vegetable matter, and channels the smoke and vapors correctly.

If it ain't broke, why fix it?

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Termyn8or)

Profile

Post #: 44

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be - 5/13/2008 7:33:35 PM

LondonArt

Posts: 101
Joined: 4/14/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or

Matter does not exist.

(which is actually a liquid, rather than a solid)

Actually, it's an amorphous solid, not a liquid. Well, perhaps there's an argument for it being a supercooled liquid, but that's not the same as a regular liquid. It's all technical semantics when you get down to that level though, so amorphous solid works best for regular use, since it displays the large scale qualities of a solid rather than a liquid.

[/pedant mode]

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Profile

Post #: 45

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be - 5/13/2008 7:53:24 PM

batshalom

Posts: 1990
Joined: 9/17/2007
Status: offline

~folding her arms~

Fellas, I have to tell ya ... I really prefer to be the geekiest geek in the room ...

(in reply to LondonArt)

Profile

Post #: 46

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be - 5/14/2008 12:04:07 AM

Termyn8or

Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline

Wait now, I just jumped back in but ........

If photons can have inertia they must have mass.

Go ahead and tear me apart, you might just prove my point.

Photons can be affected by gravity which resulted in Einstein getting confused. The reason photons can be affected by gravity is because they have mass. Without mass gravity has no effect.

I can't say this proves my point though. This is because photons have not really been proven to exist. It hasn't been proven to me in 44 years, so I don't think it is likely now.

IMO Einstein got a bit too old for this game. He started saying that gravity can affect time. IMO nobody in their right mind would think that. He forgot that HE indeed was the observer.

Doppler did a better job at explaining it actually, but I do not want to go into that right now, it is too late. I got work tomorrow. I think the original expression E=mc2 said it,and later his mind got polluted by conventional thinking.

And if you keep basic mathematics inmind, there is no way to multiply mass by velocity. I mean that it can be calculated, but as a raw expression like that I think it meant something else.

T

(in reply to batshalom)

Profile

Post #: 47

RE: More esoteric than you could ever hope to be - 5/14/2008 12:52:56 AM

DomAviator

Posts: 1253
Joined: 4/22/2008
Status: offline

You're right - photons dont exist. You arent really seeing this or anything else. To prove it - Buy a $5 laser pointer and shine it into your eyes for while - just long enough to burn out the photon receptors. If you can still see you've proven they dont exist. LOL Einstein was confused, its a good thing you have stepped forward to correct his errors. Of course the E-mc2 formula has jack squat to do with photons as the m refers to MASS and is only for particles with mass. However Einstein did cook up his E=cp formula... or that pesty lil formula for calculating magnintude of momemtum using Diraks constant etc... Good thing the physical world has you to correct all this...

Oh and lets try a mass by velocity problem.... I seem to recall that is known as momentum. :D We have a pound of bullshit moving across the internet at the speed of light so lets try this IFM=mc where IFM is the Ignorance Factor Momentum , m is the mass of the bullshit being expelled, and c is the speed of light... Yep, plug in the values and it works - its kind of like the "anti intelligence quotient"