Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

what makes her who she is?


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Master >> what makes her who she is? Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
what makes her who she is? - 5/21/2008 2:56:04 PM   
tsatske


Posts: 2037
Joined: 3/9/2007
From: Louisville, KY
Status: offline 		There is a reason i am asking this here, instead of on my private slave list. It is a kind of an IE question, and i'd usually post that on my list - but those are all slaves, like me, and the only answer i would get is - 'Whatever Master choses.' which isn't as enlightening as you might think. So -
If you own a slave, and you feel you have the right to make changes - request changes, whatever. assume for this question that she is a slave - that she is open to change for you, wants to change, and would be hesitant to object.
How do you decide what is intrinsic to her - what makes her her, and you don't want to change?
I'm not saying she would never object. because i am really not talking about the big changes or hidden landmines, that she might tell you about when you hit them.
I am talking more about things that do make up part of who she is, part of her self identity, but in such a small way, that she does not mind changing them. but, how many, how much, is too much?
It's kind of like we are built on a point system. if there are 1,000 points in me - well, i love the way i get my nails done (reverse french). maybe that makes up six points. Master wants them done solid. no problem. I dress in bright colors, flats, African patterns, pants suits, practical, workable mom clothes, lots of bling. Now i dress in skirts, lots of pink, twin sets, low heels working on getting higher. I carry a big purse made of bright suede patches, you can count on me having everything in the world in it, a small red purse (my favorite color) slips out of it with my money, cards and ID. all my wallets (several of them) are red leather. Now i carry a tiny pink leather clutch, so small i must carry my cell phone separate.
none of these things are complaints, mind you. i am just asking, how do you decide what to ask for, and what not to?
i had a former master ask me to quit attending church, practicing witchcraft or going to AA meetings. another preferred my hair, which i usually wear long, cut short. one absolutely forbid me to have my hair braided. One Dom i talked with liked hair in pigtails. i wear a pony tail or bun all the time, but pigtails?
i usually practically quit watching TV when there is someone in my life. but what if someone asked me to read less? (i read 50 - 60 novels a year, not counting non fiction stuff). i don't wear much makeup - or didn't, anyway. the way i cook changed with every man i've ever had in my life.
well, you get the point. which things are available for 'training' - and what makes her, her? (or him, or hym - whatever)

_____________________________

“If you never did you should. These things are fun and fun is good”
~Dr. Seuss quote
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/21/2008 7:22:02 PM   
Huntertn


Posts: 715
Joined: 10/7/2006
Status: offline 		     That takes time..to learn what makes her tick inside her mind..As a Master you need to change some things about her..but the parts that drew you to her..those are so different to each person..its hard to define them here...but you will Know when you've hit one of them..

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/21/2008 10:27:10 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		Honestly I don't think anything is unchangeable.  However, it's much more a case of how much energy and time will it take to move this to that?  Most things just aren't worth it if it's the right match for you. 

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Huntertn)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 3:42:34 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		How about wearing a training bra. You can try to find someone that has most of the same interest as you do. Some on here go for a guy or woman because they are CUTE. Then later bitch because they have nothing in common.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 5:28:30 AM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tsatske

i love the way i get my nails done (reverse french). maybe that makes up six points. Master wants them done solid. no problem. I dress in bright colors, flats, African patterns, pants suits, practical, workable mom clothes, lots of bling. Now i dress in skirts, lots of pink, twin sets, low heels working on getting higher. I carry a big purse made of bright suede patches, you can count on me having everything in the world in it, a small red purse (my favorite color) slips out of it with my money, cards and ID. all my wallets (several of them) are red leather. Now i carry a tiny pink leather clutch, so small i must carry my cell phone separate.
none of these things are complaints, mind you. i am just asking, how do you decide what to ask for, and what not to?


All of these things have really nothing to do with your individuality or your identity, in my opinion. They are simply expressions of your identity and people grow attached to them.. I've changed and rechanged my appearance several times for the purpose of buisness, a lot of those changes being somewhat drastic. I'm still the same old me, even though some parts of my appearance were a bit hard to let go.

I'm also of the opinion that changing of someone's appearance is a helpful tool, because it helps someone identify less with being their own person and instead with being MY slave.

quote:


i had a former master ask me to quit attending church, practicing witchcraft or going to AA meetings.
 

I would draw the line here, because I consider the first two to be important parts of who that person is and the third to be an important tool. These are issues of compatibility, in my opinion.

quote:


another preferred my hair, which i usually wear long, cut short. one absolutely forbid me to have my hair braided. One Dom i talked with liked hair in pigtails. i wear a pony tail or bun all the time, but pigtails?


Nothing wrong with this either, in my opinion, but another point worth mentioning is that if a change I made to someone's appearance made them feel "ugly" or "tacky", I probably would not do it, particularly with the hair.

quote:


i usually practically quit watching TV when there is someone in my life. but what if someone asked me to read less? (i read 50 - 60 novels a year, not counting non fiction stuff).


If I thought your reading or TV watching was resulting in the neglect of other things, I would tell you to read less or watch TV less, but if you prefer to read all the time and I prefer to go out to the club all the time, I would consider it to be an issue of compatibility.

< Message edited by MadRabbit -- 5/22/2008 5:31:01 AM >

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 6:04:34 AM   
tsatske


Posts: 2037
Joined: 3/9/2007
From: Louisville, KY
Status: offline
quote:

How about wearing a training bra.


Dnomyar, have you looked at my picture? I'm reminded of Delta Burke, who said, 'You mean Y'all little tiny girls have to train yours?'

I am not sure that finding someone with the same interests has ever been a goal of mine. Some things are true compatability issues - the former Master who wanted me to drop all things spirtual. hence, the 'former' part of his title.
but i remeber, after i lost my first husbad, about a year or so later, the idea of dating just scared me. so i paid to join an introduction service. (that is to say, i signed a contract in which a private company agreed, that, in exchange for an obscene amount of money, they would send me on no less than 30 dates from hell. the membership is transferable. over a decade and a half later, but i only used about a half dozen of the dates from hell, if anyone is interested in buying it)
the interviewer got annoyed with me, because the answer to all of her questions - 'do you want a smoker?' 'what religion?' 'what race?' 'married before? children?' 'what wieght range?' 'How tall?' was - i could care less. those are not the things that make me deeply compatable with someone.
and niether is Him liking the same things i like, when it comes to how i dress, how we decorate the house, what we read, ect, ect.
i want someone who is laid back enough that they would not, in a vanilla relationship, be looking for someone who dressed a certain way or wore their hair a certain way, that's true. But i am a slave, so He is free to change those things. Master and i just have such different tastes on so many of the small things, that sometimes i wonder about such things.
in all honesty, he seems to have a good grasp of it. not just what are the big things - spirituality, ect. but what seemingly little things contribute the most to my expression of self.
the truth is, i have come to adore the way he dresses me, though it is not how i would ever dress myself. pink is, to me, the color of my submission. i feel submissive in my skirts and twin sets and heels, in a way that is different from how i feel in pants suits and jogging shoes - my 'just a mom in tennis shoes' look. but he has not complained about my collection of hats - around 75 of them, and i keep buying more. i wear them, too - took two hats along on our recent BDSM convention, complaining the whole time that i couldn't find the one i wanted.
i just think it is a currious thing, how you decide, which is which. that my reverse french nails can be redirected, but the hats stay (thank god!)

_____________________________

“If you never did you should. These things are fun and fun is good”
~Dr. Seuss quote

(in reply to Dnomyar)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 6:19:29 AM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline 		FR:  Wait a minute.  Am I the only person (other than MadRabbit, who I think gets some of it) to read this and wonder if the OP is insane, or just prevaricating?   How is not carrying your big patchwork purse in any way akin to ceasing to go to AA meetings?  If you were diabetic, would you accept "Master's" instruction that you cease taking your insulin?    How about being a heomophiliac, and being ordered to stop taking your clotting factor?  So your eventual death is a sign of your 'submission'?

This reminds me of the threads where a "submissive" (i.e. deeply troubled and ungrounded person) talks about accepting her "Master's" instruction not to have anything to do with her children.  Does no one have the basic sense to point out that life-damaging "instructions" are not something that is a part of a M/s relationship with integrity?  

If there is a "1000 point scale" (the OP's silly construct, not mine) then about 999 points for Me is a slave who is self-possessed, intelligent and interested in furthering our mutual life together.  None of this has to do with reshaping her, either by making her kill herself slowly, or worrying how she gets her nails done.  I guess I fail the "one twue Master" test in that I genuinely LIKE my slaves, and don't see a need to damage them.

E.

_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 6:25:36 AM   
MadRabbit


Posts: 3460
Joined: 8/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956

Am I the only person (other than MadRabbit, who I think gets some of it)


Eh...she's...different....but still a good jumping off point for a discussion about modification of submissives....

_____________________________

Advice for New Dominants
The Unpolitically Correct Lifestyle Definitions

Obama is NOT the Messiah! He's just a VERY NAUGHTY BOY

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 6:59:33 AM   
tsatske


Posts: 2037
Joined: 3/9/2007
From: Louisville, KY
Status: offline 		i'm - 'different'? wait - i'd bitch about that, but - well, Master uses that same damn word, a lot.
You notice that the Master who wanted me to quit going to church, ect, is a former Master? and, yes, i know AA meetings are a life and death thing, but to give him credit, (which i don't do very often, he's an idiot), it was over a decade ago, but i had already been sober for over a dozen years, so i think he saw it as more a spiritual thing. which, is, to me, a more true component of who i am, then what i wear.
you are pretty much saying what i was trying to say - that these are very different things, and how does a Master manage the responsibility of deciding which is which? Yes, some are obvious - getting my nails done versus not taking my meds and recording my sugars (I am, in fact, diabetic). Some are harder to read, i think.
Yes, I know sometimes submissives can make very bad decisions to obey no matter what. all those years ago, when i lived in Cleveland, my master there was negotiating with a woman who was considering joining our poly household. she had asked from release from her former master when he demanded the 'right' to 'train' her 2 year old daughter to be a proper slave. she cut off negotiations with us when she went back to him.
No, i am not doing anything even remotely similar. i would not be compatible, (to say the least) with someone who thought that way.
or a lot of other ways. i talked with one dominant, a professional pschytrist, who was very turned on by the fact that i had a depressive disorder. he said he had always wanted a slave who had such a diagnoses, and wanted to play with it, to make her as depressed as possible, and dependent on him - he felt sure he could keep her, feeling suicidal, but not committing suicide, as long as he was around. okay, SO not a good match for me. (I'd say, 'or any sane person', but that is kind of obvious in the story...) I work hard at MANAGING my diagnoses. I need someone who wants me the BEST i can be, not the sickest.
well, this thread took a turn for the serious. sorry about that. You are not less of a master if you don't do things the way i do, but, beyond that, you are certainly not less of a true master for not wanting to change things, or not wanting to change important or intrinsic things. it is more a question of, if you do change things, how do you do it carefully enough so that you only change things, and not change the 'who she is'. and, possibly, being interested in slavery of a certain type makes a submissive need to look harder for a good match, not only because of the level of power exchange, but also because, well, maybe that 'TPE slavery' thing attracts more than it's share of crazy people. that's worth thinking about.

_____________________________

“If you never did you should. These things are fun and fun is good”
~Dr. Seuss quote

(in reply to MadRabbit)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 7:18:30 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		Prevaricating my new word for the day whatever that means.

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 12:50:13 PM   
pettingdragons


Posts: 421
Joined: 8/16/2005
Status: offline 		i have really no idea what the question or answer is you are asking or looking for so ill wing it....i change as my Master wants me to change. Master has allowed me to have certain limits (not something all slaves get but some do) on these limits i have put down what i am not willing to change and what i am willing to take another look at....my faith, my family...its a hard limit (though i dont attend a church..im pagan and i can "pratice" anywhere)...my hair style or nail color...its not that important to me....most of my clothes are dark and dominant or purples and greens...well guess what...Master hates most shades of green...and loves white...so my being a clutz white is not my color...LOL  He knows that if i am in white i need to be better supervised so i dont get too dirty...does that help?
just my two cents and then a babble or two...
pettingdragons
**Master Dragons considered slave**

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/22/2008 2:43:17 PM   
tsatske


Posts: 2037
Joined: 3/9/2007
From: Louisville, KY
Status: offline
quote:

and loves white...so my being a clutz white is not my color...LOL  He knows that if i am in white i need to be better supervised so i dont get too dirty...


OMG i SO relate to that! The other thing is, i have like, little professor sydrome or something. (seriously - sometimes aspburgers is called 'little professor syndrome. I don't have a diagnosis of aspburgers, but it is genetic, and my twin boys have it. when they were younger and were newly diagnoised and we were all trying to learn all we could about it, my mom said to me, 'i think you have aspburgers')
anyway, i will paint in my best clothes! i will walk out of the house with all many of stains, paint splatters, whatever on me, or wearing things that totally do not match, then look down at myself in the car 20 miles later and go 'ACK! Who let me leave the house looking like this!'
and i completely can not keep white - white. it is my LEAST favorite color. for anything excpet disposable paper products. it never stays white!

_____________________________

“If you never did you should. These things are fun and fun is good”
~Dr. Seuss quote

(in reply to pettingdragons)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/23/2008 11:24:01 AM   
pettingdragons


Posts: 421
Joined: 8/16/2005
Status: offline 		LOL  welcome to Aspburgers world!!  Master got after me the other day for having a paint stick in my hair...i will grab a pen or pencil, chop sticks...or the paint brushes...LOL  girl tries look at herself before she leaves....or Master will make her change...girl is more of a tye dye, surrong wearing hippie chick in the day time and a leather wearing goth ish type at parties...well she was....not anymore...so We are trying to incorperate girls clothes with Masters taste...it makes for a fun weekend...
White never stays white....and it makes girl feel like a giant Marshmellow some times but all the lace is beautiful.... 

hugs
pettingdragons
**Master Dragons considered slave**

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/23/2008 6:35:54 PM   
kyraofMists


Posts: 3292
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline 		What makes me, me are the character traits and virtues that I have.  My behaviors do not define who I am.  Who I am defines how I will behave.  As his slave, who he is, now defines many of my behaviors.  There are some behaviors that he allows me to choose by myself.  However, he will not have me engage in behaviors that will harm who I am.

As an example, honesty is a core part of who I am.  Being dishonest is extremely harmful for me (learned from past experience).  He will not have me engage in behaviors that would violate this core character trait. 

This leaves a lot of room for him to exercise his will and determine the behaviors that he prefers and that he thinks are best for our relationship. 

Knight's Kyra



_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/25/2008 1:20:53 PM   
Interesdom


Posts: 197
Joined: 5/24/2004
From: England
Status: offline 		I have heard several ideas on what makes a person who they are:
  • They are mostly what they love, and what they fear.
    But love comes and goes, and fear can be conquered.
  • They are what they eat.
    But a person who can't eat what they like will soon change to eat something else.
  • A person is who they are.
    Yes, well, let's forget that stupidy, eh?
  • A person is who they dress as.
    But then they become someone else when they are naked?
I think the closest is:
  • They are what they believe in.
    While people can be taught or trained to believe in other things, this has to seem 'right' to other things they believe in, or they will suffer disturbance.  They can be brainwashed into beliving just about anything but that clearly does make them someone who they were not before.  If what they believe in is knowingly based on faith rather than fact, trying to change their belief can be near impossible (hence the poster who has an 'ex' over religious issues).
A person's habits, hairstyles, appearance, clothes etc. don't make them who they are, unless they really believe that it is part of them - in which case, see above.  All this can be changed, and changed again, without any harm to them.

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/25/2008 1:37:39 PM   
celticlord2112


Posts: 5732
Status: offline
quote:

i had a former master ask me to quit attending church, practicing witchcraft or going to AA meetings.

Those should be "hard limits" for everyone.  Any person who would ask you to give up these things is not someone you can have a productive relationship with.  (There is a certain practical wisdom in Paul's caveat about being "unequally yoked").
quote:

the way i cook changed with every man i've ever had in my life.

This is as it should be.  You cook what pleases him.


_____________________________



(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/25/2008 5:59:18 PM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tsatske
i had a former master ask me to quit attending going to AA meetings.
  I can imagine changing my hair to please  Master (I Have). Asking someone to give up the support system to sobriety is just flat out wrong.

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to tsatske)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/26/2008 1:02:25 PM   
mstrj69


Posts: 295
Joined: 5/27/2004
Status: offline 		Have you ever thought about a white apron to wear over your other clothes when painting, then take it off and leave it hanging somewhere.  Sooner or later the apron would no longer be white but your good clothes would still look good.  Drop clothes and painter's clothes are normally white.  Go to a paint store and ask for some. 

(in reply to OsideGirl)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/26/2008 1:21:04 PM   
RealSub58


Posts: 1073
Status: offline 		Maybe if the OP wrote the orignal post as Interesdom did his, possibly I would know what you are all discussing here.

Wasn't the question ~~ what makes her who she is?
My past
My parents
My education
My internal and external infleunces
My present
My experiences
My morals/ethics/beliefs

My owner finds that all enough and I find all enough in him.
We grow together or we grow apart and are no longer together.

Life is a journey, not a destination.
A relationship is part of that journey, not a destination.

(in reply to Interesdom)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: what makes her who she is? - 5/27/2008 7:35:34 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		It isn't up to him to decide what's too much to change, but to you.

I'm also with someone who disapproves of my big purse and which I wear across my body so I can have my hands free. If I'm going to need it, I carry it. If he's got his cell phone, and he's buying, then I leave it home or in the car hidden. The changes he asks depend on how badly they impact my life and his. My kids call him if I don't answer my phone so for us it isn't a big deal.

Now skirts and sandals are fine if we aren't hiking, going to the barn to empty a horse trailer, watch a baseball game on a muddy field. He's flexible. For me, that's the important thing. That he will tailor his requests to what is workable. If what he wants prevents me from being there for my ums, then he wouldn't be someone I would find compatible. But 6" stilettos to go miniature golfing? Sorry, doesn't work for me.

The other thing is how fast he tries to change you. Demanding you never carry a big purse is not going to go over as well as not carrying it the two evenings a week you go to dinner with him. Brownie points are given for figuring out exactly what you need in a purse, and helping you shop for one that is practical but smaller. For helping you fit his rules into your life instead of just issuing them and leaving you to deal with the fallout. If you can't stick a cell phone into a purse, and it's hot out so you don't have a coat with pockets, does he expect you to hold it all the time? For me, that's the bottom line, that he thinks out solutions to the problems he's causing.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to RealSub58)
Profile   Post #: 20
Page:   [1] 2   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Master >> what makes her who she is? Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094