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RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 3:44:58 AM

fyreredsub

Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertRat

Maybe you're right. But identifying these interpersonal dynamics issues as syndromes seems overly dramatic to me. Still, I suppose some cutting of slack is in order.

As for stirring up Goreans? I don't do that. I do like to drop in from time to time, though.

Bob

so its a bad adjective---------
some of these threads and reading others opinions is helpful to new people finding their way w/ wiitwd.

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

(in reply to DesertRat)

Post #: 21

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 4:04:26 AM

Prunesquallor

Posts: 181
Joined: 10/12/2005
Status: offline

Well, I come from an online world with a large BDSM community, and also a Gorean one. In this world, *all* subs will be expected to call a dom 'Sir' (or 'Master' if they are Gorean). If any submissive failed to do this he or she would be punished by their master. This works well, in my opinion. In general terms submissives there are treated with respect, and the use of titles makes clear the relative stations of those concerned.

Offline I wouldn't expect a sub to call me 'Sir', but I would like it if they did, for the above reason. It is an elaborate form of courtesy which, in my opinion, sits well in the BDSM world. Courtesy has been described as the oil that helps the machine of society to run, and anything which achieves that in our world is a good thing, in my opinion.

But let me quickly add the disclaimer that I will treat everybody with courtesy, however they address me, so long as it's not, 'Oi you!' :)

< Message edited by Prunesquallor -- 10/25/2005 4:05:32 AM >

(in reply to fyreredsub)

Post #: 22

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 5:01:06 AM

BlueDevil

Posts: 39
Joined: 10/6/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirSix72

This I would llike to star out as saying I can imagine im going to ruffle a few feathers with this one.....I can understand that alot of you will only submit to the "one"......but the thing I dont understand is when you finally find the "one" then automatically you lose all respect for anyone else..I think we have all hashed this out in other threads to some degree.....like the one I submit to is the only one I will call Master/Sir/Mistress...leaving all those others out there wondering as to why that only the one that you submit to is the one you can show respect to or refer to as Master so and so or Sir so and so or Mistress so and so...kinda confusing to me really.........if someone is a Master before he/she met you then how can anyone else be less of a Master if they dont own someone? does Ownership define a Dom/Master......and if you are owned if you call anyone else Sir/Master/Mistress reflect some kind of ownership to you by referring to them by thier given title?

Master Six

I just finished catching up on the other syndrome thread, three more pages since I reviewed it last, and, even with all of the flaming, I found it interesting. I'd like to ask a few questions directly, and see where we go with those answered, if you don't mind.

These questions are intended for SirSix, since he's the OP.

1. Do you want to be addressed as 'Sir' or 'Master' by all submissives/slaves?

2. Are you comfortable not being addressed as 'Sir' or 'Master' by those that have been instructed by their dominants/owners not to address anyone else by those titles?

3. Do you consider it disrespectful when someone is polite to you, but, refuses to include titles when addressing you?

4. Do you consider it your right to refer to all submissives/slaves as 'girl', 'boy', 'little one', 'dear', or other terms that they might find demeaning or overly familar, because you are a Master in your home and local club? (this isn't a dig, I've read your statement, and seen it acted on, that you will refrain from using these terms if someone specifically asks you not to)?

5. Would you be comfortable if all Masters were called 'Master' by all submissives/slaves?

6. What would you consider the proper rules of respect in exchanges between dominants/Masters/Mistresses and submissives/slaves?

I'm all for good manners and treating people with respect, that's why I've been following these topics. If you don't feel like answering my questions, not a problem, I just think it will make it easier for everyone to address the issues if we know exactly where you're coming from.

Thanks

_____________________________

A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.
Winston Churchill

(in reply to SirSix72)

Post #: 23

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 5:12:38 AM

sunshine333

Posts: 203
Joined: 8/16/2005
Status: offline

Six ... not all submissives relate to the world and other people from a place of submission. some have very powerful, authoritative lives and are looking for only one person to whom she will serve. all others are just people to them .. not dom .. not sub. does that make sense? and so there would be no reason to address any others by any special lifestyle title.

i'll say this as respectfully as i can .. because i think it needs to be said and i don't think anybody has already said it (though i've been waiting) ... you keep asking the same question in different ways. are you actually listening to the answers or simply waiting for everyone to rally around and validate your view point? we can't learn if we don't listen.

humbly,
sunshine

(in reply to SirSix72)

Post #: 24

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 5:40:03 AM

smilezz

Posts: 2156
Joined: 6/18/2004
Status: offline

Thorns is Master...He earned that title a long time ago, which had nothing to do with me. He 'gave' me the right to call Him Master.

I have been in the scene for quite a few years now...everyone is different, everyone has their own way(s) of doing things. Alot of Dominants that i do know have that title also. Just because a person is a Dominant does not mean they are a Master...that's not a bad thing, it's just how that person perceives it/themselves.

I also think that people should be courtious to the next person. I say Sir or Ma'am because that is the way i was raised. It really has nothing to do with how i have lived in the scene over the last 20+ years.

I understand what you are saying SirSix....i guess it's just that people are so individual...they have their own notion as to what is and what is not...there's not always a balance.

Happy Tuesday!

~smilezz~

_____________________________

=It's not my fault that when I was a baby I was dropped in a box of Glitter & I have been shinin' ever since=

�*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,.-:* � �*:-.,_,-:* �

(in reply to SirSix72)

Post #: 25

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 6:25:29 AM

xanderzzz

Posts: 24
Joined: 9/21/2005
Status: offline

I am not Gor so maybe the protocal of calling anyone who deems themself Master is called Master by every slave. That is fine.

As a non Gor, I would have a big problem with my sub calling someone a master to anyone but me. This is something that is made to be special between me and my sub. I do not want her automatically defering to anybody, just me.

Respect is not about titles. It is earned. Anybody can call someone "Sir", but can be rolling their eyes when they are doing it. Actions! Not Words!

(in reply to fyreredsub)

Post #: 26

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 6:58:08 AM

darkinshadows

Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

Lam, Bob, I'm a little suprised at your attitudes here. Are you in reality saying that Six or anyone else shouldn't come in here and ask querstions for their general education? We all know that Six, like me is Gorean, may be I best confine any questions I have to the Gorean Forum and all posts too. Is this the way things will be? I truely have no problems if CM wants to adopt a "Us & Them" policy separating all the BDSM folk from Goreans, but is you guys who will suffer for you wont be able to come over and stir us up..

IronBear
You know how I much I respect You Iron Bear, and to not see You participate in this side of the forum would be the greatest loss to all, no matter how much they may deny it. I do not think that either Bob nor LaM mean that (although I can't and do not presume to speak for anyone) - but its boring, tiresome and confusing to see four posts that all are about the same subject posted by the same person - Its difficult enough as it is for some people to have to weave through the miriad of information, let alone have to read the same subject over and over. Its neither constructive nor positive and its a waste of bandwidth IMO.

About the OP...

I have seen BDSMers talk occasionally about 'the one'
I have seen Gorean slaves talk about 'the one'
I have seen people outside of wiitwd talk about 'the one'

In every instance, it is personal. I don't care if people talk about the one... I dont care if people call a dominant Mistress or Sir, Master or God, Goddess or Lord. I don't mind if someone disrespects me or my spiritual beliefs, because I am secure enough in myself and my Master not to demand respect and I know that Demon demands nothing because He is comfortable in Himself and knows exactly what and who He is, and no amount of 'capping' or 'Sirring' or 'Yes Master' is going to make Him moreso!

Keep to Your own code, honour it - and everything is just fine and dandy.
Push onto others, ridicule, claim insecurities, jealousy, lack of respects - in the end...

a fool looks at His own reflection and his colours are easily read.

Peace and Love

The Fool
I do not know whether I was then a man dreaming I was a butterfly, or whether I am now a butterfly dreaming I am a man. --Chang Tzu

_____________________________

.dark.

...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 27

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 7:13:11 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fyreredsub

quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

Lam, Bob, I'm a little suprised at your attitudes here. Are you in reality saying that Six or anyone else shouldn't come in here and ask querstions for their general education? We all know that Six, like me is Gorean, may be I best confine any questions I have to the Gorean Forum and all posts too. Is this the way things will be? I truely have no problems if CM wants to adopt a "Us & Them" policy separating all the BDSM folk from Goreans, but is you guys who will suffer for you wont be able to come over and stir us up..

ahhhhhh to the us & them policy..............this girl enjoys learning of the Gorean ways!

Yeah.... I know the them & us policy would never word I have to much respect for too many in this area anyway.....

Your company lass is enjoyed.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to fyreredsub)

Post #: 28

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 7:36:47 AM

WickedKev

Posts: 305
Joined: 11/26/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirSix72

This I would llike to start out as saying I can imagine im going to ruffle a few feathers with this one.....I can understand that alot of you will only submit to the "one"......but the thing I dont understand is when you finally find the "one" then automatically you lose all respect for anyone else..I think we have all hashed this out in other threads to some degree.....like the one I submit to is the only one I will call Master/Sir/Mistress...leaving all those others out there wondering as to why that only the one that you submit to is the one you can show respect to or refer to as Master so and so or Sir so and so or Mistress so and so...kinda confusing to me really.........if someone is a Master before he/she met you then how can anyone else be less of a Master if they dont own someone? does Ownership define a Dom/Master......and if you are owned if you call anyone else Sir/Master/Mistress reflect some kind of ownership to you by referring to them by thier given title?

Master Six

Good thread Six mate....Ok my point of view, being a non-Gor (sounds like a space alien). When I was first online my nick was Kev. Being a dominant this bothered some of the subs in the chat rooms they thought it should be more grand I personnaly thout of it in the Monty Python context 'There are some who call me Tim'. Tthey all said I should call myself Lord Kev or Sir Kev, I told them when the Queen (god bless her) gives me an honour for my services to pervery then I will use that title. It was my then sub who came up with the nick WickedKev, saying it suited my personnality. I loved it and have used this nick ever since. Now the reason I tell you this story, is that it is the same for me with the title Master. I am a Master, because I have a slave, and to her I am her 'one' (Now I'm the matrix). She has gone through hell to be able to call me Master, and before I start getting flamed I meant it was a lot more than just my training. So she may call me that title as she has earned that right, and I will only allow her to call me that unless I take sister slave for her but then the new slave would have to earn it as well. Now I said in an earlier thread my slave will only call me Master, because of what that term means to her. I have also said in an earlier thread, that she is respectful to all Doms and sub,s unless they prove unworthy of that respect, but I do not require her to call anyone anything. She does choose to call Doms I respect as Sir or Maam or by whatever name they ask her to call them ecept for Master or Mistress. It has nothing to do with jealousy, I am sure lusti would tell you I am not a jealous person in the slightest.
Lusti oftens asks why don't we give everything a standard label, submissive means this and slave means that. I told her it would not work for whose version should we use. So just except that all things means something differant to everyone, you choose to follow Gor, I do not, it would be a boring world if we all liked the same things.

< Message edited by WickedKev -- 10/25/2005 7:45:10 AM >

_____________________________

Those who can make you believe absurdities
can make you commit atrocities.
—Voltaire

It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong
—Voltaire

(in reply to SirSix72)

Post #: 29

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 7:51:24 AM

wolfinside

Posts: 74
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline

Let me help you answer this question by looking at it from another perspective.

Should I want my girlfriend to give the deference she pays me to other men? No.

Just because you role play master/slave games with your woman, why do you expect strangers to role play that way as well with you?

Do you expect your fellow employees to call you "master" or "sir" where you work? If not, then why do you expect people here (who you don't know) to role play with you that way?

I might decide that my girlfriend should refer to me as "HOREY LORD MASTER OF THE UNDERWORLD", but I'm not so foolish to feel that anyone else should.

It's called posturing, and it is silly.

Wolf

< Message edited by wolfinside -- 10/25/2005 8:29:53 AM >

(in reply to SirSix72)

Post #: 30

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:18:21 AM

fyreredsub

Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline

i dont CALL everyone Master or Sir..........

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

(in reply to xanderzzz)

Post #: 31

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:20:06 AM

fyreredsub

Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline

ah,ya just like me cause i'm a redneck,hahaha, and i can grill

thanks Iron Bear.........
this girl thinks your allright her in her book.too

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 32

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:28:16 AM

OscarHargraves

Posts: 693
Joined: 8/9/2005
Status: offline

You did indeed ask this same question on a thread just the other day, so you get the same answer, The difference is in 'Sir' vs. 'sir' and 'Ma'm' vs. 'ma'm. Both are respectful but one is used for a special person.

_____________________________

Never drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ! !

(in reply to SirSix72)

Post #: 33

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:29:08 AM

pinkpleasures

Posts: 1114
Status: offline

quote:

This I would llike to star out as saying I can imagine im going to ruffle a few feathers with this one.....I can understand that alot of you will only submit to the "one"......but the thing I dont understand is when you finally find the "one" then automatically you lose all respect for anyone else..I think we have all hashed this out in other threads to some degree.....like the one I submit to is the only one I will call Master/Sir/Mistress...leaving all those others out there wondering as to why that only the one that you submit to is the one you can show respect to or refer to as Master so and so or Sir so and so or Mistress so and so...kinda confusing to me really.........if someone is a Master before he/she met you then how can anyone else be less of a Master if they dont own someone? does Ownership define a Dom/Master......and if you are owned if you call anyone else Sir/Master/Mistress reflect some kind of ownership to you by referring to them by thier given title?

Master Six

Really, Master Six, with all due respect, this is like the third time You have started a thread on slaves and submissives showing respect to Doms and others with whom they have no relationship. Let me try to answer, anyway.

In a relationship, a title or honorific is the Dom's or Master's choice; it's a private matter between two people. Many Men i have spoken to prefer to be called by their names, and i wonder if i could agree to call Someone "Master" and nothing else.

Outside of a relationship, some people are collared or otherwise committed and have instructions on how to address other Doms, etc., which naturally they seek to adhere to...so before criticising anyone this must be considered.

As for those of us who are uncollared, i try to be polite, and i address some Men friends as "Sir" but most correct me and ask me to call them by name.

i do not automatically address strangers as "Master" but i use "Sir" somewhat liberally...apart from men who insult me...because i believe a Dom or Master has good manners at all times. So naturally when a Man writes me an insulting email i assume he's a fake.

i hope this clarifies the "titles" issue once and for all; Your apparent desire to be called "Sir" universally will never be met...have You anything else to discuss?

pinkpleasures

< Message edited by pinkpleasures -- 10/25/2005 10:30:00 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to SirSix72)

Post #: 34

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:30:53 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

Oscar my old mate..... here's one for you. "You may call me sir as long as you dont spell it Cur".... Works for me, how about you?

BTW, do Guardian Angels need a licence to fly or has the Government given them a freeby?

< Message edited by IronBear -- 10/25/2005 8:32:15 AM >

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to OscarHargraves)

Post #: 35

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:37:24 AM

pinkpleasures

Posts: 1114
Status: offline

quote:

Why does this issue matter so much to you that you have to start thread after thread about it? It sounds as though a sub who didn't know you refused to call you "master" or "sir" one day, and you've been yelping ever since over the wound to your dignity.

And why is everything a "syndrome"? First we had the "you're not my dom syndrome"; now we have the "one syndrome." It's really strange. AIDS is a syndrome. Asperger's is a syndrome. Choosing not to say "master" to some guy on the internet is not a syndrome.

Lordandmaster

Yup, yup, yup.

pinkpleasures

_____________________________

(in reply to Lordandmaster)

Post #: 36

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:39:10 AM

Lordandmaster

Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline

Come on, IronBear. This is at least the third time he has started a thread about exactly the same thing.

And what does this have to do with Gor? I wasn't aware that Gor had anything to do with this thread, but if it does, that makes it an even bigger problem. You know how self-righteous the Goreans get whenever a non-Gorean goes over there and states a non-Gorean viewpoint. (You were unhappy about it yourself.) It's the reason why I don't post over there anymore. But now it's OK for the Goreans to come here and gripe, in thread after thread, about how BDSM is inferior because doms are really subs and subs don't have to say "sir" to doms they don't know? It gets tiresome after, say, the fourth go-around.

quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

Lam, Bob, I'm a little suprised at your attitudes here. Are you in reality saying that Six or anyone else shouldn't come in here and ask querstions for their general education? We all know that Six, like me is Gorean, may be I best confine any questions I have to the Gorean Forum and all posts too. Is this the way things will be? I truely have no problems if CM wants to adopt a "Us & Them" policy separating all the BDSM folk from Goreans, but is you guys who will suffer for you wont be able to come over and stir us up..

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 37

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:44:05 AM

pinkpleasures

Posts: 1114
Status: offline

quote:

I personally am amazed by the reaction tha I get when I say something about this touchy subject......wow jealously has a really HUGE head ...im not ever offended when bella refers to those free/Master/Sir/Mistress and such their titles are even you my friend she calls you Sir......she can see through the game players and the misinformed.........maybe that this has come into the light because of the dishonesty that what feels good do it and dont worry about what you said or had with the "one" that didnt meet those kinky desires you had or you know you didnt meet them and are worried someone might do something for her that you cant...im not trying to be gender specific to those Dommes that are reading this.........

Master Six

i have read and re-read what You wrote and still cannot follow it. Evidentially You are saying You feel no jealousy when bella uses the terms "Sir" and "Master" when speaking to others...well...that would be a silly reason to be jealous, and i assume the two of you have discussed how You wish her to address Men and Women who are Doms or Dommes or Masters.

But honestly, why do You find other slaves and submissives reluctance to address You as "Sir" or "Master" so terribly hard to accept? i honestly feel You see disrespect where none is intended...it's been my experience here that when a member disrespects another there's NO missing it.

pinkpleasures

_____________________________

(in reply to SirSix72)

Post #: 38

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:47:59 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

G'day Lam,

Yeah I know and I was not unhappy about you posting in the Gorean Forum, I for one enjoyed you posts. I didn't always agree with you thats all.

Grab a Fosters and relax mate you should know me well enough by now to know I was grabbing yours and Bobs leg and giving them a jerk to get a responce... You know the Them and Us thing would never work, we all have friends in both areas for that to happen....

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)

Post #: 39

RE: The one syndrome - 10/25/2005 8:54:15 AM

fyreredsub

Posts: 3403
Joined: 10/7/2005
Status: offline

i'm a bit confuused pink..i respect and identify w/ alot of what you share......

i know i posted in several of the aforementioned threads........
some were about setting limits.............
or the one.... as in i prefer to wait for the one instead of a bunch of ones...(this one).........
and doms conforming to subs demands/expectations............
or the do u call everyone.............
i know i didnt have the same response in all....

and not quite sure why anyone would think they were the same topic

course i quit reading most when all the flaming started................in the other threads(its a shame really)

i guess thats where the tolerance and understanding comes into it!!!

wiitwd does not equal gor does not equal bdsm

we all have our own kinks and quirks....

_____________________________

"Accordingly, men must then either fulfill their nature, or deny it, and in denying their nature, deny us ours, for ours is the complement to theirs. " Renegades

(in reply to pinkpleasures)

Post #: 40

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