A Clean Campaign? (Full Version)

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TheHeretic -> A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 8:07:11 AM)

          As I might have mentioned once or twice in these forums, it was the tone of the '04 campaign that became the last straw in my relationship with the Democrat party.  Tuesday night, Obama did something worth noticing.  I tend to watch whole speeches, and very little of the snips you get on the news later, so I don't know if this has gotten much airtime.

      During his speech in St. Paul, Barack Obama mentioned John McCain, and the crowd started to boo.  He stopped them, saying his opponent should be honored, and respected for his service to our country.  The shots he took were clean, and above the belt.  That is some Change I'm all in favor of.

     It is also a hell of a strategy.  McCain has a long record that can be attacked, Barry will have to be judged on his character.  There are some difficult questions about that. If any attempt to probe the choices he has made in life can be labeled "swiftboating" and "the politics of personal destruction," it just might win the election.  He's already said that attacks on his wife are "unacceptable."

     Will the Left take his challenge to knock off the damn hate speech?  (of course, the hypocrisy will be stunning, if they do)


       http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/barackobamademocraticnominationvictoryspeech.htm


       



kittinSol -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 8:11:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

              Will the Left take his challenge to knock off the damn hate speech?  (of course, the hypocrisy will be stunning, if they do)



Oh, the irony [:D]...



TheHeretic -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 8:17:19 AM)

        Yes, Kitten, and I've been known to go after people on the right for the same thing.  But one of the myths I used to like about the Democrats was that they were nicer...



dcnovice -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 2:09:35 PM)

<fast reply>

I was intrigued by Senator McCain's suggestion to have a series of joint town meetings--and to travel together to them. I think that could be a cool approach to the campaign.

I know I'm naive, but I honestly suspect both McCain and Obama would like a clean campaign and may be willing to wage it. Let's hope so.



dcnovice -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 2:20:38 PM)

quote:

(of course, the hypocrisy will be stunning, if they do)


Here you've lost me, Rich. What would be the hypocrisy in the left's (or the right's, for that matter) abstaining from personal attacks?



Vendaval -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 2:45:32 PM)

The attacks on a candidates spouse or unmentionables are below the belt.  I would appreciate a clean campaign but doubt very much that there will be a minimum of mud slinging.  The stakes are far too high.



cyberdude611 -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 2:48:44 PM)

It has little to do with candidates but more to do with the 527s.

Organizations on both the left and right that are not controlled by the political campaigns (ie: Moveon.org). These organizations and special interest groups are not going to honor the wishes of the candidates to keep it a clean campaign. And because of the first amendment, there isnt anything you can do to stop them.

In 2004 it was "Swiftboat Veterans for Truth" that derailed John Kerry. That was a 527 and had no connection at all to the Republican party or GWB. 527s will again be a huge factor in this election because it is going to be a very close race.



Alumbrado -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 2:48:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Vendaval

The attacks on a candidates spouse or unmentionables are below the belt.  I would appreciate a clean campaign but doubt very much that there will be a minimum of mud slinging.  The stakes are far too high.


I've long held the view that mudslinging is inevitable because it works so well.  The fact thatObama got this far, without any 'Hillary is a terrorist' tactics gives me some hope that I might finally be proven wrong.



BitaTruble -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 3:55:22 PM)

PBS

This link contains a great article with further links on how to search out truth on the web with an emphasis on the political season.



Alumbrado -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 3:56:54 PM)

You rock!  Mind if I borrow that?



Vendaval -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 3:58:53 PM)

Thank you for that link, Celeste.  I have it book marked now.



Level -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 4:02:18 PM)

Rich, I'd love to see an absence of personal attacks from both sides, and maybe, just maybe, with these two candidates, we might see that.



DomKen -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 4:09:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
I was intrigued by Senator McCain's suggestion to have a series of joint town meetings--and to travel together to them. I think that could be a cool approach to the campaign.

It sounds like a good idea on the surface which since it comes from the GOP makes it suspect. A little digging reveals that McCain is not drawing the huge crowds that Obama does so appearing together lets McCain appear in front of the big crowds. Then there is the issue of money, McCain is way way back in fund raising so he may not be able to keep to a high intensity multiple daily appearance campaign schedule that Obama will be able to do so this ploy would take that advantage away from Obama.

Always look under the surface whenever the GOP suggest something that seems good.



DomKen -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 4:10:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611
In 2004 it was "Swiftboat Veterans for Truth" that derailed John Kerry. That was a 527 and had no connection at all to the Republican party or GWB.

ROTFLMAO!



slvemike4u -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 6:27:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

<fast reply>

I was intrigued by Senator McCain's suggestion to have a series of joint town meetings--and to travel together to them. I think that could be a cool approach to the campaign.

I know I'm naive, but I honestly suspect both McCain and Obama would like a clean campaign and may be willing to wage it. Let's hope so.
Not so intriguing when you take into account the McCain teams belief that he "functions" better in these smaller venues as opposed to larger crowds...seems a bit limiting for a Presidential candidate



pollux -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 9:27:19 PM)

quote:

In one telling example, he is moving to hire Aaron Pickrell, the chief political strategist of Gov. Ted Strickland of Ohio — who helped steer Mrs. Clinton to victory in that state’s primary — to run his effort against Mr. McCain there. In another, aides said, he has tapped Dan Carroll, an opposition researcher who gained fame digging up information on opponents’ records for Bill Clinton in 1992, to help gather information about Mr. McCain. That is the latest evidence that, for all the talk on both sides about a new kind of politics, the general election campaign is likely to be bloody.


http://tinyurl.com/5mpgo8



DomKen -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 9:46:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pollux

quote:

In one telling example, he is moving to hire Aaron Pickrell, the chief political strategist of Gov. Ted Strickland of Ohio — who helped steer Mrs. Clinton to victory in that state’s primary — to run his effort against Mr. McCain there. In another, aides said, he has tapped Dan Carroll, an opposition researcher who gained fame digging up information on opponents’ records for Bill Clinton in 1992, to help gather information about Mr. McCain. That is the latest evidence that, for all the talk on both sides about a new kind of politics, the general election campaign is likely to be bloody.


http://tinyurl.com/5mpgo8


Were you expecting Senator Obama to unilaterally disarm? Both sides will, really have to, do opposition research so as to be able to respond if the other side attacks. The question is who will use that stuff first.



pollux -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 10:04:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: pollux

quote:

In one telling example, he is moving to hire Aaron Pickrell, the chief political strategist of Gov. Ted Strickland of Ohio — who helped steer Mrs. Clinton to victory in that state’s primary — to run his effort against Mr. McCain there. In another, aides said, he has tapped Dan Carroll, an opposition researcher who gained fame digging up information on opponents’ records for Bill Clinton in 1992, to help gather information about Mr. McCain. That is the latest evidence that, for all the talk on both sides about a new kind of politics, the general election campaign is likely to be bloody.


http://tinyurl.com/5mpgo8


Were you expecting Senator Obama to unilaterally disarm? Both sides will, really have to, do opposition research so as to be able to respond if the other side attacks. The question is who will use that stuff first.


No, of course not.  I just think all of this talk about Obama being some kind of transcendentally elevated politican is patently ridiculous.  It'll be business as usual.  Count on it.



DomKen -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/7/2008 10:18:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pollux
No, of course not.  I just think all of this talk about Obama being some kind of transcendentally elevated politican is patently ridiculous.  It'll be business as usual.  Count on it.

At this point I've seen him run two major campaigns and sling very little mud in the process. All Alan Keyes did was attack Senator Obama in 2004 and Obama did not respond. HRC threw a fair amount of mud and had surrogates throw quiote a bit more and he still restrained himself. Considering how far behind Senator McCain is right now I see little reason to attack him unless the swifties and other assorted scum the GOP harbors come out.



TheHeretic -> RE: A Clean Campaign? (6/8/2008 8:44:17 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

(of course, the hypocrisy will be stunning, if they do)


Here you've lost me, Rich. What would be the hypocrisy in the left's (or the right's, for that matter) abstaining from personal attacks?



      I was referring to the vocal minority who can't discuss an issue without turning it into some more crusade from the high horse, DC.  Those who will go on and on about Republicans doing this or that, while the Dem conduct during the Bush administration vanishes right into a memory hole.



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