RE: "Liberal" Thoughts

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MrRodgers -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 12:01:03 AM)
Oh and don't think democrats are always on auto-liberal and republicans are all conservative. The issues such as gay marriage, church and state, abortion are issues ment to embitter us...one against the other. These issues should be left to the states (except any church and its catechisms) while the irreversible conception of a human being...a consitutional amendment. These are issues used as a big trawl for political advantage at election time...because they are insecure with the remainder of there positions...as most should be.

popeye1250 -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 12:05:15 AM)
"Hey! There's a naked man! Let's give him the shirt off of someone else's back!" Mr Rogers, Bush? Conservative? He isn't even a Republican.

bashfulhuck -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 12:16:01 AM)
For me, I believe myself to be highly conservative. But my ideas about being conservative differ immensely from the Republican party. I believe that the American people should be governed by the Constitution of the United States, period...I believe that ALL people, no matter their religion, sexual orientation, color or financial status should have the same exact rights, including marriage. I believe that government needs to get the hell out of our business. The government is supposed to exist to serve the people, yet in today's age, it is backwards. We serve the government instead. I'm a conservative person, not a facist..Which is what I view alot of Republicans to be nowadays. There's my little political soapbox, i try my best NOT to stand on it. It's sad that the rest of the world today has no respect for America, and it's all because our country has turned into the World's bully, pushing people around, starting wars, and just being generally arrogant. Whatever happened to diplomacy, with war only happening what there is absolutely no other choice?

ShaktiSama -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 12:18:02 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 "Hey! There's a naked man! Let's give him the shirt off of someone else's back!" I think it might be wiser to start with someone else's pants, don't you?

Level -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 3:14:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MadRabbit I'm about 60% conservative and 40% liberal in my viewpoints. I can think of a few things from both sides that I am pretty adamant about and think the other side is way off the mark. How anyone can honestly be 100% of either side without finding something you disagree with is beyond me. It reeks of head-bobbing and lack of independent thought. Anyone who takes a side of an issue simply because they identify with a particular herd is a moron. MR, excellent post. Few things piss me off more than to see one of these one-hundred percenters in action (even though I like some of them) [8D]. Some do it to get a rise. Some seemingly can't help themselves.

NorthernGent -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 4:02:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bashfulhuck I believe that the American people should be governed by the Constitution of the United States, period...I believe that ALL people, no matter their religion, sexual orientation, color or financial status should have the same exact rights, including marriage. I believe that government needs to get the hell out of our business. The government is supposed to exist to serve the people, yet in today's age, it is backwards. We serve the government instead. Whatever happened to diplomacy Liberalism is a broad spectrum of political thought, which can hardly be folded up into a neat box; ditto Conservatism. So, some liberals and conservatives will share many of the same beliefs; others will have little in common. That which you post is in line with the early liberals, such as John Locke (who I believe helped to write one of your States' constitutions), and the classical liberals such as John Stuart Mill. Although I'd place myself roughly in the liberal bracket, I do disagree with the Liberal Party's attitude to foreign affairs; they bitterly opposed Iraq, which I agree with, but wish to intervene in places like Sudan and Zimbabwe, which I strongly disagree with. On the other hand, the British Conservative Party supported the invasion of Iraq and has form for supporting aggressive ventures into foreign lands, which is certainly illiberal in this country. Another area I think draws a line between Liberalism and Conservatism is the issue of trade; Free Trade is a cornerstone of Liberalism, and it's a policy to which I adhere for reasons of competition, efficiency, opportunity and, ultimately, raising your game. Today's English Liberal Party campaigns on local power, civil liberties and opportunity for all - all of which I agree with - but they can't seem to shake off the post-imperialism malaise of thinking we have a duty toward every man and his dog, from Outer Mongolia to Peru, as a result of our imperial past; they could do with getting a grip on this matter. Ultimately though, today's Liberalism in England has retained many of the ideas of the early liberals and the classical liberals - one of the main departures being the issue of taxation; classical liberals believed taxation is a form of robbery - this is not a belief held by today's liberals.

orfunboi -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 5:56:50 AM)
Those are very good thoughts, the kind of things that my conservative family taught me growing up and still believe in today. Not sure why you labeled them liberal thoughts though. You do know that conservatives care also, right?

meatcleaver -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 8:28:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: orfunboi Those are very good thoughts, the kind of things that my conservative family taught me growing up and still believe in today. Not sure why you labeled them liberal thoughts though. You do know that conservatives care also, right? I can't say I've noticed. If there are poor already, how are conservative policies going to solve the problem, by more of the same? The nightmare of more of the same is what created liberal ideas first place. Don't forget, liberal ideas are shifting sands, they change according to the problems faced where conservatism keeps coming up with the same old solutions to completely new problems. Most conservative ideas come out of pessimism, being scared of the future or putting ones head in the sand and holding onto what someone already has to the exclusion of others.

fungasm -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 8:29:55 AM)
I consider myself socially liberal and fiscally conservative. Here's what I would love to see: The actions of consenting adults should not be infringed. This includes marriage, sex, abortion, divorce, and setting up of households. The drug war has to end. Eliminate state welfare. End Social Security as an entitlement program based on age. Instead, make personal contributions to the Social Security program a 401K investment. Make the Social Security program and the food stamp program a full safety net for all citizens who are not able to support themselves or need help. End the triple beauracracy, and finance it with the legalization of marijuana. Anyone who is hungry or needs help should be eligible. Make the payments smaller, but allow people to join households and join their forces. (In other words, 4 single moms on State aid getting $500 a month pool their resources so that they can afford a place to live and babysitting so that they can go to school. Under the current system, this isn't possible.) Even if 10% of the population were on state aid, getting $750 a month in cash and food benefits, we will still have money left over from the drug war. (It would cost about 280 billion a year for state aid in this fashion, it's less than we are spending now.) I'm not going to be elected anytime soon.

Raechard -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 9:06:32 AM)
second thoughts I don't want to debate that and I know that would follow.[:D]

Irishknight -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 9:15:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: meatcleaver Most conservative ideas come out of pessimism, being scared of the future or putting ones head in the sand and holding onto what someone already has to the exclusion of others. I would have to say that particular statement is more opinion and bias than fact. I have conservative ideas as well as liberal ideas. Most of my thoughts run somewhere down the middle because that is where the reality is. The far left dreams of creating a utopia through government institutions that will make all people love each other. AIN'T gonna happen. The far right believes that if they can get everyon to follow the exact same set of rules and conform to a cookie cutter mold of "good Christian soldiers" then the world will be perfect. AIN'T gonna happen. The reality of life falls between these two realms of idiocy.

kdsub -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 9:30:31 AM)
I am so tired of the liberal or conservative monikers…the need to label or group people by one of more political views is insulting to me. I am very passionate in my view of the world...and being for a woman’s right to an abortion does not make me a liberal…. Being for the right to own firearms does not make me a conservative… We all want low taxes so what does that make us…all conservatives?…We all want to preserve for our children some part of nature for them to enjoy… does that make us all liberals…What crap

Alumbrado -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 10:33:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Irishknight quote: ORIGINAL: meatcleaver Most conservative ideas come out of pessimism, being scared of the future or putting ones head in the sand and holding onto what someone already has to the exclusion of others. I would have to say that particular statement is more opinion and bias than fact. I have conservative ideas as well as liberal ideas. Most of my thoughts run somewhere down the middle because that is where the reality is. The far left dreams of creating a utopia through government institutions that will make all people love each other. AIN'T gonna happen. The far right believes that if they can get everyon to follow the exact same set of rules and conform to a cookie cutter mold of "good Christian soldiers" then the world will be perfect. AIN'T gonna happen. The reality of life falls between these two realms of idiocy. Putting the unknown or the uncomfortable into the 'you must be one of them' box is a knee jerk reaction, not the product of sincere reflection or critical thinking. Reality is a scary thing to many, it would seem.

philosophy -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 10:51:13 AM)
FR ...honour, compassion, a desire to see the world aspire to be the best it can be, justice, kindness, humour, wit, savage intelligence, well meaning ignorance, generosity, empathy for one's fellow human, respect........all these words and phrases can apply to any individual human being, no matter where on any given dichotomy between liberalism and conservatism one wants to place them. (edited to add a sense of humour) ...now how liberal is that? [:D]

Alumbrado -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 10:53:58 AM)
Positively catholic.

philosophy -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 10:58:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Alumbrado Positively catholic. [:D] spills coffee laughing

cluelessslave -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 11:13:11 AM)
Liberals are much more humanistic than are conservatives, in the US at least. Humanism is concerned with the well being of the whole of humanity and every individual. Conservatives are about competing for private property and protecting their own group from outsiders. Authoritarianism and capitalism are conservative ideologies. Communism and socialism are liberal ideologies. When you know the truth and have the power and own the wealth, you want things to stay the same. You promote the status quo. When you are struggling to improve conditions you want things to change. You promote progress. Liberal thoughts are about making progress while conservative thoughts are about protecting what you have.

popeye1250 -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 11:36:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: fungasm I consider myself socially liberal and fiscally conservative. Here's what I would love to see: The actions of consenting adults should not be infringed. This includes marriage, sex, abortion, divorce, and setting up of households. The drug war has to end. Eliminate state welfare. End Social Security as an entitlement program based on age. Instead, make personal contributions to the Social Security program a 401K investment. Make the Social Security program and the food stamp program a full safety net for all citizens who are not able to support themselves or need help. End the triple beauracracy, and finance it with the legalization of marijuana. Anyone who is hungry or needs help should be eligible. Make the payments smaller, but allow people to join households and join their forces. (In other words, 4 single moms on State aid getting $500 a month pool their resources so that they can afford a place to live and babysitting so that they can go to school. Under the current system, this isn't possible.) Even if 10% of the population were on state aid, getting $750 a month in cash and food benefits, we will still have money left over from the drug war. (It would cost about 280 billion a year for state aid in this fashion, it's less than we are spending now.) I'm not going to be elected anytime soon. Fungasm, I'm the same way, socially liberal and fiscally conservative when it comes to my govt spending my money "for" me. As for the "Drug War" when is it going to start? We haven't had one yet! If you want to smoke M.J. go right ahead but hard drugs kill people. We know what countries those drugs are comming from! Largely Mexico and Colombia! And that low i.q. "YALE graduate" Bush is trying to tell us that "Mexico is our friend?" You can tell he has a low i.q. if he's saying that and expects us to believe him! First, you secure that Mexican border with Troops and minefields, make a "no-man's land" along the entire length of it 100 yards wide, a "kill zone". Minefields are "humane" and extremely effective on S. Korea's border aren't they? If you don't walk in a minefield you won't get blown up, will you? Then, we start deporting the millions of illegal aliens from Mexico and all other countries who are fucking roosting here. After that we shut down all communications with those countries,-internet, telephone, postal, financial, anything. Then airline service, shipping. Then, if any drugs get through we level one city in each country. Fucking FLATTEN it! And if they do it again you flatten another. That's how you stop drugs. Why hasn't this been done already? This is very simple stuff. This is what we are Paying the people who are working "for" our govt to do and they are not doing it! Anyone who's not willing or able to do this shouldn't be in government service! Do you think for one minute that McCain or Obama would do this? No, they'd rather "negotiate" like we have for the last 50 fucking years accompanied by a large check from the U.S. Taxpayers and nothing ever changes! Take some pictures with the "leaders" from those countries with the caption underneith; "Drug Deal Cemented" and the very next hour it's "business as usual." "How many rocks you need manno?" There are a lot of countries that are not our friends and I'm sick and tired of my govt and State Dept trying to tell us that they are! They are out and out Lieing to us! We shouldn't be doing any business with any country that's involved in the drug trade! That's just common sense, something severely lacking in the "202" area code! We need to start shooting a bunch of people and hanging them in public so everyone can see! And it shouldn't take 14 years to do it! That's how you deal with drugs. As for gay marriage I have no problem with that. And I'm all for a National Healthcare plan! Just use the govt. to collect the money to finance it but not administer it! It's not "Socialised Medicine" if we're Paying for it and if we keep the govt out of it, is it? Like Lou Dobbs I'm a "populist" who thinks that govt should be run for and responsable to "The People." Right now it is surely not and we, The People, have every right to DEMAND that it is! Failing that, Thomas Jefferson had some very good advice about "changing" things every twenty years or so! And it's no longer just people in the govt but in big business, lawyers and lobbyists that have to go! Again, Public Hangings! When do we start prosecuting people for Treason in this country by the thousands? How's about we start with one Bernard Schwartz and the employees of the Loral Corp for giving guided missile technology to communist China? As things stand right now, THE PEOPLE have no govt in Washington! (Wow! Not bad for my first cup of coffee!)

LotusSong -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 11:51:30 AM)
(Conservative responses in Red) That all people should be treated equally, regardless of color, gender or sexual preference. – well, so long as they aren’t TOO dark and keep our yards nice. That our elderly shouldn't be left to die in poverty. – No, they have lived their life. Time to bow out and die and decrease the surplus population. That those who cannot take care of themselves should be protected. – Everybody can do something..even it’s being a doorstop. Get them off their asses! That everyone deserves an education. – but, but then the classes will be more indistinguishable and we’d have to allow riff-raff into the Ivy League colleges! That no one should go to bed hungry. - We agree! There is plenty enough cake to go around. That no one has the right to hurt or abuse a child. – Agreed. (so long as it’s not MY child) That rape is wrong. – Yes. There is a right way and a wrong way to do things. Do it correctly or not at all we say! That our Constitution and Bill of Rights are sacred documents, and that those who love this country will act within the laws of this country. If those laws are wrong, we work to change them peacefully. – or at least print it on a better quality of toilet tissue. We are getting a rash using that old parchment! That our soldiers who fight for us deserve the best training, the best equipment, and the best Commander in Chief- who will send them to defend our country and it's values, not to finish Daddy's dirty work. – It’s all part of our family values platform! You libs got something against family???

kdsub -> RE: "Liberal" Thoughts (6/8/2008 12:00:28 PM)
Damn popeye...whats in that coffee!!!! That's the most I've ever seen you write...I want some...maybe it will make me better with my grammar. Damn had to edit already...

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