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Senator McCain on free trade with Columbia - 7/4/2008 12:56:19 AM   
Vendaval


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Would a free trade agreement with Columbia help or hurt the American economy?
 
"McCain talks trade in Columbia"
 
updated 9:45 p.m. EDT, Wed July 2, 2008 
"BOGOTA, Colombia (CNN) -- Sen. John McCain discussed free trade, illegal drugs and better relations Tuesday night with Colombian President Alvaro Uribe.

The presumptive Republican presidential nominee met with Uribe after arriving in Colombia on the first leg of a three-day trip to Latin America.

The trip highlights policy differences on trade between him and his Democratic rival, Sen. Barack Obama.

"Free trade is an important issue, not only for Colombia, but, I believe, for the economy of the world and ... for the U.S. economy," McCain said Tuesday at a news conference with Uribe."

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/07/02/mccain.colombia/index.html#cnnSTCText

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RE: Senator McCain on free trade with Columbia - 7/4/2008 1:40:23 AM   
HeavansKeeper


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First, I disect the article.  Keep in mind, overall, I'm not a huge McCain fan.  But this isn't about me, this is about US-Colombian relations.

Quote:
"You got to stand on principle. I believe in the principle of free trade."

That is a dangerous idea.  It's the pretty way of wording "Piss off, anyone who want to talk details and specifics."  I'm a man of principle, but in this world, principles like free-trade need to be protected and done quite specifically.  Ayn Rand would back McCain saying something along the lines of free trade being morally correct, and it being a self-repairing system.  Personally, free-trade to the extreme, I don't want the revolution to be me opening my own general store because I'm sick of driving my Wal-Car to my Wal-job at Wal-mart, where I earn 6.50 Wal-Dollars (we call them wallors in the future) every Walour.  (hour... See where I'm going with this?)

Free trade is good. Free trade with reality checks is better.

Quote:
Democrats in Congress have blocked the deal, citing the intimidation and killing of Colombian labor activists by right-wing paramilitary troops.

This would be one of the specifics important to free trade with Colombia.  While it could be free trade between the countries, it would be Mafia rules inside Colombia.  Meaning it would be free trade between the US and anyone the FARC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Armed_Forces_of_Colombia) allowed to do business. 

Quote:
"He's not doing it because he thinks the region is important, he's doing it because he wants ... to try to send a message to Latinos in the United States -- to say, 'Focus on these things,' rather than on things that he doesn't have an answer for in the Latino community," said Dan Restrepo, Obama's senior adviser on Latin America.

I don't like this statement.  While I do acknowledge a long history of moral issues finding their way into Washington on the backs of elephants, I don't think this is one.  I don't think its a distraction, but I do think its a crowd pleaser.

Quote:
"We must encourage more trade agreements to create more jobs on both sides of the border; that's why I'm behind the Colombian Free Trade Agreement," McCain says in the advertisement" (And a few other similar "its win-win" or "it's right" statements)

The issue of free trade is based on what we are trading, and how much we need it.

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/35754.htm
Exports (2006)--$24.3 billion: petroleum, coal, coffee, flowers, textiles and garments, ferronickel, bananas, chemicals, pharmaceuticals, gold, sugar, cardboard containers, printed material, cement, plastic resins and manufactures, emeralds. Major markets--U.S., Venezuela, Germany, Netherlands, Japan.
 
Imports (2006)--$24.5 billion: machinery/equipment, grains, chemicals, transportation equipment, mineral products, consumer products, metals/metal products, plastic/rubber, paper products, aircraft, oil and gas industry equipment, supplies. Major suppliers--U.S., Germany, Japan, Panama, Venezuela. Trade: Exports (2006)--$24.3 billion: petroleum, coal, coffee, flowers, textiles and garments, ferronickel, bananas, chemicals, pharmaceuticals, gold, sugar, cardboard containers, printed material, cement, plastic resins and manufactures, emeralds. Major markets--U.S., Venezuela, Germany, Netherlands, Japan. Imports (2006)--$24.5 billion: machinery/equipment, grains, chemicals, transportation equipment, mineral products, consumer products, metals/metal products, plastic/rubber, paper products, aircraft, oil and gas industry equipment, supplies. Major suppliers--U.S., Germany, Japan, Panama, Venezuela.

Trade
In 2006, Colombia was the United States' fifth-largest export market in the Western Hemisphere behind Canada, Mexico, Brazil, and Venezuela and the largest agricultural export market in the hemisphere after the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA) countries. U.S. exports to Colombia in 2006 were U.S. $6.9 billion, up 13.2% from the previous year. U.S. imports from Colombia were U.S. $9.6 billion, up 4%. Colombia's major exports are petroleum, coffee, coal, nickel, and nontraditional exports (e.g., cut flowers, gold, bananas, semiprecious stones, sugar, and tropical fruits). The United States is Colombia's largest trading partner, representing about 40% of Colombia's exports and 26.6% of its imports.

So what's that all say?  First and foremost, Colombia and the US are already big handshakers.  We get a lot of stuff from them, but chiefly oil (mmmmmm!!) and food (mmmmm!!).  What do they get?  Robots.  =P

Free trade lowers the cost of goods coming and going.  Food and oil costs are going up (and more so, as they become more and more related).  I think, overall, free trade with Colombia is a good thing.  I think it will help America more than it hurts.

An important note to nay-sayers:  Drug use and trafficking is highly linked to pvoerty levels.  When drugs are cheap and plentiful, cost goes down, as well as crime.  When prices are down (prices of licit materials like food, oil, etc.) "poverty" shrinks, and crime goes down.  In a way, the inevitably higher amount of drugs will lower crime.

A note to nay-sayers on account of pro-protectionism:  There is a chance that free trade steals more jobs than it creates, i.e. hurting the production value of American made goods that Colombia would make cheaper: (petroleum, coal, coffee, flowers, textiles and garments, ferronickel, bananas, chemicals, pharmaceuticals, gold, sugar, cardboard containers, printed material, cement, plastic resins and manufactures, emeralds).  I don't worry about petrol and oil.  The other markets will take a hit, yes, but not very badly.  Most of "America's" textiles and garments and resin manufacturing come from Asia (not even China for a reason I'm getting too). 

In short, American's chemical, pharmaceutical, sugar, cement, and printing fields will feel the burn.

Free trade helps to equalize the value of money.  20-30 years ago Mexico was disgustingly cheap for manufacturing.  As free trade blossomed, the average wages increased, until big businesses were forced to move to China.  Same thing happened there, and "Made in Taiwan" was the name of the game.  These days India and Indonesia are big wringers for cheap labor.

Globally speaking, its best to wash that away for rumerative labor.  Individually speaking (greed), its in our best interest to tax incoming goods (since food and oil are static needs) and tax outgoing goods out the ass, since America is a leading manufactuer of Colombia's imports.

.... It's 4:40 a.m. so forgive the spelling or any completely inaccurate statements made about macro economics.

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(in reply to Vendaval)
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RE: Senator McCain on free trade with Columbia - 7/4/2008 8:09:39 AM   
Sanity


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How is it bad that Mexico's wages have caught up to ours some.

And why would it be bad if Columbia's wages did the same... one can argue that we can pay them there, or we can pay them here. Free trade could well help slow illegal immigration.

And if the Columbians had money, couldn't we sell them things, eventually making everything even?

The Chinese can't immigrate as easily for the same reason their exports are beginning to suffer - distance. High fuel costs are hurting the Chinese of late...


quote:

Free trade helps to equalize the value of money. 20-30 years ago Mexico was disgustingly cheap for manufacturing. As free trade blossomed, the average wages increased, until big businesses were forced to move to China. Same thing happened there, and "Made in Taiwan" was the name of the game. These days India and Indonesia are big wringers for cheap labor.


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(in reply to HeavansKeeper)
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RE: Senator McCain on free trade with Columbia - 7/4/2008 4:29:16 PM   
HeavansKeeper


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I never said it was a bad thing...

Although, its important to note that if people want to be ultra-rich, they need 10,000 times their numbers in ultra-poor.  That poor can be in the US or elsewhere, but it will be somewhere.

Most people have the "out of sight, out of mind" mentality.  Let the super poor live in countries far far away so we can not feel guilty about being rich.

There's a term I like: Uncomfortably wealthy.   When you're so rich you feel bad because you know world poverty is mostly your fault.

Is it bad that other countries raise their wages and standard of living? No.  Does it mean less money for the top .05%?  Yes.

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