Americans should stop whining about gas prices (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Polls and Other Random Stupidity



Message


defiantbadgirl -> Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 9:06:09 AM)

when other countries have been paying extremely high prices  for years. How often have you heard that? They always forget to add the part about motorized transportation in other countries making 60+ mpg. Comparing our gas prices to the price of gas in other countries is like comparing a salary of $60,000 in Kansas or Missouri to a $60,000 salary in California. Has anyone ever tried one of these?
http://www.waterfuelvehicle.com/

Does it actually work?




Thadius -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 9:13:11 AM)

Living in the region I do, I gave up looking at any of the hydrogen or "water powered" solutions... they simply aren't viable during the winter.  While the emmissions sound much better for the environment, water vapor and freezing temps would lead to chaos on the roads.  In a warmer climate, perhaps they would be more of a serious consideration.

Speaking of gas prices... did anybody else notice that when Bush lifted the executive order (off shore drilling moratorium), that shortly after the price of oil dropped over $9 a barrel... go figure.




Slavehandsome -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 9:17:30 AM)

Its quite amazing really.....I'm still able to drink water in the winter. 




popeye1250 -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 9:18:11 AM)

The reason gas (petrol) prices in Europe are so high is that they are socialist countries and they use those taxes for free medical, dental, childcare, 8 week vacations, and a host of other "cradle to grave" benefits.
Just for shits and giggles look up the benefits that they have in Norway and Sweden!




rulemylife -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 10:13:39 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

when other countries have been paying extremely high prices  for years. How often have you heard that? They always forget to add the part about motorized transportation in other countries making 60+ mpg. Comparing our gas prices to the price of gas in other countries is like comparing a salary of $60,000 in Kansas or Missouri to a $60,000 salary in California. Has anyone ever tried one of these?
http://www.waterfuelvehicle.com/

Does it actually work?


Of course it works, and if you send me $49.99 (with a 56 day money-back guarantee) I'll show you how to make millions in real estate. 




Thadius -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 10:20:03 AM)

quote:

Its quite amazing really.....I'm still able to drink water in the winter. 


People in these parts have problems with their fuel tanks or lines freezing just from a bit of condensation.  Water coming out in mist form freezes very fast in the winter... oh and what is that stuff you add to a radiator along with the water?

Thanks for your input.




Kirren -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 10:26:14 AM)

That would be called Anti-Freeze. Its green, bad for dogs, and kind of gross to smell.

Anyway...

Yeah...bush is gonna lift that...but congress has to agree, and we all know how well that will go. Theyll do it if we take another tax hike up the ass with no lube, and give them the second raise of the year.

Communist bastards.

It doesnt matter if we drill off shore here. Its the refining process, so they claim, that costs so much money. We have to send the crude oil over seas to be processed, and then bring it back. Guess who processes it? The same guys whos home lands we are blowing up...

So Im  sure well be seeing a real break in gas prices very soon....just hold your breath for that...lemme know how it works out for you.




rulemylife -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 10:32:11 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

The reason gas (petrol) prices in Europe are so high is that they are socialist countries and they use those taxes for free medical, dental, childcare, 8 week vacations, and a host of other "cradle to grave" benefits.
Just for shits and giggles look up the benefits that they have in Norway and Sweden!


Explain to me why that's bad again?  Calculate what you pay for those services as opposed to their increased fuel costs and tell me who comes out ahead? 

Just for shits and giggles explain to me what is wrong with 8 week vacations?  The Europeans have it right.  You work to live not the opposite.  Only in this country have we been brainwashed into believing that we should "come in early and stay late",  work weekends, not even take the measly two-week vacations most get.  Who benefits?  Yes, the American worker's productivity is higher than most, if not all, other countries.  Where have the benefits of that productivity gone?  In your paycheck?  No, workers wages have remained stagnant while the wealth gap in this country continues to grow.  I saw something on the news recently that 1% of people in this country have more wealth than the bottom 90% combined.

Yeah, that socialism stuff sucks!!!! 




puppen -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 10:36:49 AM)

Boo, this thread is such a downer.

...I mean. I don't exactly scream, "WOOT. GAS PRICES ARE UP!"

But, hey. Everyone looks dern cute driving around on their lil' scooters. [:D]




Thadius -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 10:41:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirren

That would be called Anti-Freeze. Its green, bad for dogs, and kind of gross to smell.

Anyway...

Yeah...bush is gonna lift that...but congress has to agree, and we all know how well that will go. Theyll do it if we take another tax hike up the ass with no lube, and give them the second raise of the year.

Communist bastards.

It doesnt matter if we drill off shore here. Its the refining process, so they claim, that costs so much money. We have to send the crude oil over seas to be processed, and then bring it back. Guess who processes it? The same guys whos home lands we are blowing up...

So Im  sure well be seeing a real break in gas prices very soon....just hold your breath for that...lemme know how it works out for you.


Bush already has done it... and congress really has no choice in the matter unless they plan on passing a new moratorium.  The one they passed expires at the end of this Sept.   Pssst... another little secret being hidden in this debate is that there are a bunch of platforms already setup that could be bringing oil to the refineries within a year, they are prevented from doing so because of the moratorium now in effect.

We haven't built a new refinery in how many years? Who's doing is that?  I am actually more in favor of going after all of the oil shale (spelling?) in the Rockies and other northwest states... Anyways, alot of the increase in the price of a barrel of oil (futures) is due to speculation, if speculators figure out that more supply is going to become available and that the US is serious about it the price would drop quite a bit.  I know I live in a pipe-dream, and have no understanding of the issue.




defiantbadgirl -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 10:42:05 AM)

I don't think there's anything wrong with those benefits at all. I'd gladly pay higher gas prices if it meant free health, dental, and day care. I'd love to pay  more for fuel if it meant I didn't have to pay $100/wk per child for day care or have to worry about dying because of not being able to afford a life saving medical procedure. But Americans are now paying high gas prices and have none of those benefits. Those extra dollars aren't going to save Americans money in other areas so it all evens out. Plus the milage per gallon on American cars sucks in comparison with autos in other countries. So they get all the benefits plus their vehicles use less gas. Why on earth do Americans have a reason to complain (sarcasm)?




myotherself -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 10:59:11 AM)

Sadly not true for ALL of Europe, and at the moment gas in the UK is around £1.17 a litre and going up a couple of pennies a week ....

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

The reason gas (petrol) prices in Europe are so high is that they are socialist countries and they use those taxes for free medical.....
 

True for the most part, but long waiting lists for basic care - still better than the alternative though!

quote:

 dental....
  but only if you can find a National Health Service (NHS) dentist!  Even if you CAN find one, you still have to pay for most treatment, although it's not quite as much as if you were fully private

quote:

childcare...
  Sadly not true for the majority...most working parents have to pay for childcare, and it's not cheap (try £100+ per week per child)

quote:

8 week vacations,
 The only people who routinely get this length of holiday work in education, so they are off when the schools/universities are on vacation.  Otherwise, British holidays are pretty close to American holidays

quote:

 and a host of other "cradle to grave" benefits.
  But only if you qualify through being means-tested.  Anyone with a pension, however pitiful, is pretty much stuffed.  And if you DON'T have a pension, there is a pittance of a state pension and a few extra benefits (winter heating allowance, free eye-care, etc) but you're still pretty much stuffed. We don't look after our elderly nearly as well as we should.


quote:

Just for shits and giggles look up the benefits that they have in Norway and Sweden!
    I'm movin' house when I retire....  [sm=car.gif]




jlf1961 -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 11:04:17 AM)

The only problem with petrolum based fuels is that the engines that use them are horribly inefficient, and there really is nothing that will change that.

As for this hydrogen suppliment fuel system, the Mythbusters pretty much shot that one out of the water.  The amount of hydrogen produced is so low as to be non existant.

Hydrogen fuel cells are possible, the german navy is using them on submarines.  GM, Ford and Chrysler/Benz all have hydrogen burning vehicles ready to roll out, and yes, they use water. 

But hydrogen used in an non-vacuum engine system is not the wisest move, since the hydrogen will just vanish into thin air by the process of out gassing.  A hydrogen burning engine has to be a closed loop system, with only one part of the loop open to the outside air, and that is exhaust.




defiantbadgirl -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 11:07:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

Bush already has done it... and congress really has no choice in the matter unless they plan on passing a new moratorium.  The one they passed expires at the end of this Sept.   Pssst... another little secret being hidden in this debate is that there are a bunch of platforms already setup that could be bringing oil to the refineries within a year, they are prevented from doing so because of the moratorium now in effect.


I think it's important to keep the environment as pollution free as possible, but with gas prices the way they are, something needs to be done temporarily until another fuel alternative can be utilized. Low income people can't afford to pay $5.00/gallon for another 10 years while alternate power source equipment is being built.




Thadius -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 11:36:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: defiantbadgirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

Bush already has done it... and congress really has no choice in the matter unless they plan on passing a new moratorium.  The one they passed expires at the end of this Sept.   Pssst... another little secret being hidden in this debate is that there are a bunch of platforms already setup that could be bringing oil to the refineries within a year, they are prevented from doing so because of the moratorium now in effect.


I think it's important to keep the environment as pollution free as possible, but with gas prices the way they are, something needs to be done temporarily until another fuel alternative can be utilized. Low income people can't afford to pay $5.00/gallon for another 10 years while alternate power source equipment is being built.


That is where the catch 22 comes in... 10 years ago and even 5 years ago folks made the same arguement about tapping other resources won't yield anything for 5 to 10 years from now... just think if they had acted instead of putting it off til now.  I am all for cleaning and keeping the environment as clean as possible.  I saw an environmentalist on one of the talking heads shows this week talking about how they hope prices go up another few dollars, so that people will be forced to conserve more, and thus making the environment cleaner.  While the theory has a bit of truth to it, namely people will be force to conserve more, it will also impact the price of many essential items to live on, it will cut down the discretionary spending that folks have which means less "luxury" items being bought, which leads to people being laid off, which just adds to the problem.

Sorry for rambling, something does need to be done now rather than later.




fluffypet61 -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 2:02:57 PM)

For now, i am a member of the group of people who think we should drive smaller vehicles, car pool and shop closer to home.  When we get a job either try to get one close to home or plan to move closer to the job so we don't have to drive.  How about telecommuting or working 4/10?

Prices going up are scary, but there are ways to make better use of the gas we put in our vehicles.

For instance, the interstate speed limit in West Virginia is 70 mph.  Many people set their cruise control for 5 MORE miles per hour.  If they would back it off to 70...the posted limit...tthose folks would immediately see an improvement of a couple of miles per gallon. 

And going UP the mountain at 70 (probably in 1st gear) is a total waste!!!  i pull over into the truck lane and take my time. 

Does anyone remember the national 55mph speed limit?  We got better gas mileage then.




LaTigresse -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 2:34:08 PM)

I will quit whining when the morons running our country spend more money on mass transit (like in Europe), and our crumbling infrastructure, than they do on worthless wars in the middle east.




defiantbadgirl -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 2:40:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: fluffypet61

Does anyone remember the national 55mph speed limit?  We got better gas mileage then.


I drive an 05 Cavalier with a 4 cylinder engine. It takes a fourth of a tank of gas just to drive to a city only an hour and a half away. I tried driving slower (60 mph) because my father thought it would take less gas. I saw no difference. It still took a half a tank to go there and back.




petdave -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/16/2008 8:37:19 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: fluffypet61
Does anyone remember the national 55mph speed limit?  We got better gas mileage then.


Did we? There's so much discussion on this right now on the web that i can't find squat for facts. However, as a "car guy" let me put out the following:

The 55 mph limit didn't take place in a vacuum. 1974 saw the early phases of emissions controls, robbing engines of both power and mileage. The vast majority of autos drew fuel through carburetors. The average American car was quite large.

By 1984, every domestic manufacturer had reduced the size of their cars dramatically. Cars like the early Honda Civic and Volkswagen Rabbit barely weighed a ton, lighter than just about any four-wheeled vehicle on the market today. Fuel injection was now more or less the standard, and the various bugs with FI, emissions controls, and electronic ignition had largely been worked out. Aside from Chrysler's aging Torqueflite, most cars were using 4-speed automatics or 5-speed manuals to make better use of the engine's peak torque, backed by taller gear ratios to reduce engine rotation at a given speed.

Fast-forward to today. Average fuel economy has dropped, i would suspect, largely due to the SUV fad. Heavy vehicle + large engine = poor fuel economy. Cars on average are heavier due to more electronics and standard features as well as safety devices. However, manufacturers are paying much more attention to aerodynamics than they did twenty years ago. We've moved up to six and seven-speed transmissions with electronic controls. Advances in computer modeling and metallurgy have given us engines that are more efficient and cleaner-burning (and even lighter, as a bonus) than their predecessors.

As a result, for many automobiles, a given reduction in speed does not automatically equate to a reduction in fuel efficiency. At highway speeds on a flat road, the largest factor in engine load is aerodynamic drag. A 2007 Corvette gets roughly the same mileage on the highway that my Mazda3 gets around town, despite having an engine nearly three times as large. With both cars doing a steady 100 MPH, i would bet money that the 'Vette would be burning less fuel.

And, if anyone has read this far, one item that people are ignoring with regards to the "60 MPG Euro car" is that a much higher percentage of cars sold in Europe are Diesel. The EPA has virtually killed Diesel sales in the U.S. with stringent emissions, and their strict requirements for fuel formulation have brought it to the point of being almost a dollar higher than regular unleaded (at least in this area), whereas ten years ago i could often find Diesel for LESS than regular unleaded in the summer (in the winter, demand for home heating oil would drive up the price, since they're very similar in formulation)

Thank you.

/cargeek




fluffypet61 -> RE: Americans should stop whining about gas prices (7/17/2008 5:40:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: petdave

As a result, for many automobiles, a given reduction in speed does not automatically equate to a reduction in fuel efficiency.



i disagree.  Some cars these days have a readout of fuel efficiency.  As you drive you can see what your gas mileage is doing.  i drive in West Virginia where the posted speed limit on the interstate is 70.  Even going 68 saves me 2 mpg.  i'm sure that a reduction from 75 to 70 would save me at least a couple of mpg.  If going 70 or more requires your vehicle to down shift on the upgrade, you are wasting gas and putting strain on your engine.

i am comparing a vehicle with itself, not to a different make or model.  




Page: [1] 2   next >   >>

Valid CSS!




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy
0.03125