What's ultimately important to you in a sub?

What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (Full Version)

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fredrik21 -> What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 8:56:38 AM)
I'll start by saying that I've tried phrasing this post right, but it doesn't come out in a way I'm totally happy with. English is my second language. Usually when this question is asked, the responses pretty much all mention honesty, trustworthiness, respect and things like that. But other aspects of a person are important as well, and some of them seem to be bigger factors than I knew. I've been on the site for a while, and haven't had much luck. I've approached several Domme's, and tried to write good letters. In many ways, they do sound similar. (Because I don't see much point in describing myself in new words each time. I hope that's not what is meant by copy-pasted emails.) Anyway, the most common response I get is silence. Some have replied, and told me why they would not be interested in me. Many of the problems were expected, "too much distance", "age gap", "inexperience". What did surprise me, however, was how many started exchanging emails only to dissapear suddenly (That's internet for you I guess.). Appearance also seems to be a much bigger factor than I had expected too. I've been told more than once that 'men should not be pretty'. That confused me at first, because it sounded like a compliment. But I realized everyone has different taste. Everyone has a right to their own opinion, of course. This thread is not to question anyone's judgement or whatever. I'm trying to find out which factors are ultimately deciding for you? Something that may not be that high on your importance ladder, but can still end up standing in the way of pursuing contact?

AAkasha -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 9:20:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: fredrik21 I'll start by saying that I've tried phrasing this post right, but it doesn't come out in a way I'm totally happy with. English is my second language. Usually when this question is asked, the responses pretty much all mention honesty, trustworthiness, respect and things like that. But other aspects of a person are important as well, and some of them seem to be bigger factors than I knew. I've been on the site for a while, and haven't had much luck. I've approached several Domme's, and tried to write good letters. In many ways, they do sound similar. (Because I don't see much point in describing myself in new words each time. I hope that's not what is meant by copy-pasted emails.) Anyway, the most common response I get is silence. Some have replied, and told me why they would not be interested in me. Many of the problems were expected, "too much distance", "age gap", "inexperience". What did surprise me, however, was how many started exchanging emails only to dissapear suddenly (That's internet for you I guess.). Appearance also seems to be a much bigger factor than I had expected too. I've been told more than once that 'men should not be pretty'. That confused me at first, because it sounded like a compliment. But I realized everyone has different taste. Everyone has a right to their own opinion, of course. This thread is not to question anyone's judgement or whatever. I'm trying to find out which factors are ultimately deciding for you? Something that may not be that high on your importance ladder, but can still end up standing in the way of pursuing contact? A woman will want to connect with you on all levels, not just kink. So in addition to having some compatible ideas about female domination, you also have to arouse her interest on a personal level. That means sense of humor, compassion, intellect, common interests, etc. Think of it as "normal dating" with another aspect added on top. How successful are you in normal dating? Have you gotten a variety of women interested in you, have you dated and learned to get to know women? Do you know how to be romantic? Do you know the appropriate time to be coy vs. to be clear? Are you able to pursue a woman and show interest, or do you back off and hope that she does all the work? Subs often make contact, there's some initial back and forth and then the sub sits there and behaves as if he is waiting for the woman to make the move. He presents himself as "available" and thinks "come and get me" and wonders why the woman just loses interest. You can't engage interest by standing in the corner with a sign that says "available. And I don't know about the women you were talking to, but I think "pretty" is a GREAT thing in a man... Akasha

fredrik21 -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 9:56:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AAkasha A woman will want to connect with you on all levels, not just kink. So in addition to having some compatible ideas about female domination, you also have to arouse her interest on a personal level. That means sense of humor, compassion, intellect, common interests, etc. Think of it as "normal dating" with another aspect added on top. How successful are you in normal dating? Have you gotten a variety of women interested in you, have you dated and learned to get to know women? Do you know how to be romantic? Do you know the appropriate time to be coy vs. to be clear? Are you able to pursue a woman and show interest, or do you back off and hope that she does all the work? Subs often make contact, there's some initial back and forth and then the sub sits there and behaves as if he is waiting for the woman to make the move. He presents himself as "available" and thinks "come and get me" and wonders why the woman just loses interest. You can't engage interest by standing in the corner with a sign that says "available. And I don't know about the women you were talking to, but I think "pretty" is a GREAT thing in a man... Akasha This is a point I hadn't considered. I'm moderately experienced at dating. I have no problems striking up conversations with women, and I believe I am fairly good at picking up and sending signals out in real life. It's different from girl to girl how strongly I pursue her though. I do treat it differently online. Everything is in text, so there is no real bodylanguage except for smileys. I am a lot more direct, since it's all writing, I tend to leave as little room for misunderstandings as possible. Most of it is because the internet is a much more sterile way of contact. But the fact that I have no experience with bdsm probably plays in as well, I've kept it separate from normal dating in my head. Basically treating it like something completely new to me, and therefor acting in an entirely different way.

MsSonnetMarwood -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 12:13:39 PM)
quote: Some have replied, and told me why they would not be interested in me. Many of the problems were expected, "too much distance", "age gap", "inexperience". What did surprise me, however, was how many started exchanging emails only to dissapear suddenly (That's internet for you I guess.). The first thing I will look at when someone contacts me online is "Feasibility". Meaning: someone who is half (or twice) my age, lives halfway across the world, and has no experience isn't going to be under any cirumcumstances a good submissive match for me. Narrow your search down to those local enough that a day trip is doable, within a few years of your age, and whose critieria you feel you meet. I'd also suggest getting out and about in your local BDSM scene whatever that may be to get some exposure and experience. See a local prodomme if you have to. Do something other than sit at the computer and fantasize. If you are willing to travel 1000 miles to meet someone, be willing to travel 100 to go to a munch or a party or a club.

Cloudz -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 12:49:41 PM)
In a word...communication

thetammyjo -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 2:05:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: fredrik21 Everyone has a right to their own opinion, of course. This thread is not to question anyone's judgement or whatever. I'm trying to find out which factors are ultimately deciding for you? Something that may not be that high on your importance ladder, but can still end up standing in the way of pursuing contact? The ultimate deciding factor isn't going to happen for me until we've trained for a month or so but I'm guessing you mean what decides if I'll scene (I don't scene casually expect at "public" events like a play party at a convention) with someone. Chemistry. Sounds silly, huh, but the fact is that I've talked to several men on this board, even exchanged a letter and set up a phone call -- he didn't call. Don't know why. But honestly every little step is one step closer. There is no magic thing you can do other than be yourself, try to find someone with non-kinky interests in common too, and proceed as the dominant seems to desire. If she wants to meet for lunch with no strings attached, do it. If she wants a picture, send. Unless she wants you to do something illegal, immoral, or give her money, I'd say take those little steps. I have a lot of little steps. Some may seem tiring and boring -- they are important to me. A man (or woman) who takes each one seriously and continues to be himself (herself) is one who earns that phone number and that lunch meeting. Then if there is chemistry, we'll talk about the next step. Minimum amount of time to get from saying "hi" to me personally and scening once (to try it out) = 2 weeks and that was with Fox who was an active member of my local BDSM community and who talked to me multiple times a day, every day for those two weeks plus all my little steps fulfilled. Maximum amount of time to get from saying "hi" to me personally and scening once = 1 month. If there's nothing there and if those "steps" are taking too long, then there isn't sincere interest on either side.

onceburned -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 4:24:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MsSonnetMarwood Narrow your search down to those local enough that a day trip is doable, within a few years of your age, and whose critieria you feel you meet. I'd also suggest getting out and about in your local BDSM scene whatever that may be to get some exposure and experience. I think this is good advice. Although I am not familar with Sweden, Caryl's Page lists a contact which you might find useful. Svenska Roissy Logen Unfortunately, I can not read Swedish so I can't be certain this will be of help. But maybe its at least worth a look (if you haven't seen it already).

UtopianRanger -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 7:16:28 PM)
quote: This is a point I hadn't considered. I'm moderately experienced at dating. I have no problems striking up conversations with women, and I believe I am fairly good at picking up and sending signals out in real life. It's different from girl to girl how strongly I pursue her though. I do treat it differently online. Everything is in text, so there is no real bodylanguage except for smileys. I am a lot more direct, since it's all writing, I tend to leave as little room for misunderstandings as possible. Most of it is because the internet is a much more sterile way of contact. But the fact that I have no experience with bdsm probably plays in as well, I've kept it separate from normal dating in my head. Basically treating it like something completely new to me, and therefor acting in an entirely different way. I'll tell ya something that no one else has mentioned or will mention - Be a little shrewd brother {Not in the context of rude} -- It takes us places we sometimes dare not venture. - The Ranger

LadyHibiscus -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 7:48:01 PM)
I use a few basic criteria for deciding whether to proceed with talking to someone---GEOGRAPHY---are they in SE Michigan? MARITAL STATUS---are they single, both in the legal and BDSM sense? AGE---do they fit my range? INTERESTS----if their loves are my hard limits, no go! and EXPERIENCE----no newbies, thanks! If he fits those criteria, then chemistry kicks in. Yes, I could be missing my pot of gold by not talking to someone aged 35, but I am willing to take that chance. If I am at a party (not one of my own events, where I am often Sympathy Domme) I go by how the person approaches me. If they are friendly, polite, and seem worthwhile, I will certainly negotiate a scene. Ms Francine

LadyAngelika -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/15/2005 9:41:12 PM)
quote: I'm trying to find out which factors are ultimately deciding for you? I don't want to prioritise any of these because I think it has to be a combination of all of the following: - respect for himself and for me - alignment of values and beliefs - physical attraction and matching sexual desires - unconditional love To be honest, the last one is probably the most important. But without the first three factors, the last one will just be frustrating. - LA

FTopinMichigan -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/16/2005 4:25:10 AM)
When I first begin to communicate with a man, whether online, or in person, I like to know about him, and learn who he is. I don't want to know all of his fetish interests in the first few minutes of our initial conversation, or what he wants me to do to him. I want to know who he is, and learn about his personality, and his likes and dislikes, not just his BDSM passions and limits. I want him to have at least some interest in me, as a person, and not just as a Domme/Top. I don't think it's too much to expect someone to have a life outside of their BDSM pleasures. I find it's increasingly difficult, to find a man to approach me, as a "person" these days. The singular focus is on "what they want" and there is not even a second of interest in me. They are so focused on themselves, they can't even "fake" interest. [:D] Not whining...just saying how it is, for the majority of contacts that I receive. So....I'd enjoy a man that was able to figure this all out, espcially since it's part of my profile and journal...so it's not a secret. Every person wants to feel special and desired. It would be nice to actually meet a man, that has some BDSM interests/experience, that is interested in me...for me. What a novel idea! [;)] K <NOT the Do-Me Domme

fredrik21 -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/16/2005 5:40:22 AM)
Thanks for all the answers everyone, and the tips. It's given me several things to think about. I'll look through those websites. Hopefully they should, at the least, link to someplace useful.

ruthfw -> RE: What's ultimately important to you in a sub? (11/16/2005 6:15:12 PM)
I won't "me too" the common themes here (feasibility; common interests; age; communication; etc.). One thing that has not been mentioned: intelligence. Perhaps that simply fits into the "would I date this person?" category.

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