RE: "Do you follow the old ways?"

RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (Full Version)

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BrokenSaint -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 3:47:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Vendaval Well given the way you dress and you being outspoken in an ethics class, I might ask first if you are a feminist and second what spiritual path if any appeals to you. You kind of have the Earth-Mother vibe going on there from what you describe. For what it is worth, I get asked similar things by complete strangers for the same types of reasons. And that is even with my silver jewelry under clothing and not in plain sight. Go figure! Sometimes you just get a sense of it so to speak, but I'm relatively sure you get that part of it. Dress, speech, a whole bunch of things can play a factor in that. The whole old ways thing is kinda cliche honestly, I've never been a big fan of it. More the kind of thing my mother is into, with her coven and all. But then I'm a mostly solitary chaote, so that's not particularly surprising. A large portion of wiccans and other pagans tend to treat us as crazy, sometimes with good reason, though it's probably the paradigm piracy that bothers them most.

slaveboyforyou -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 3:48:18 AM)
quote: Well ya know, slaveboy, you will find every type from the super-vegan-no-leather-no-deodorant people to the rough-and-tumble-kill-a-deer-in-the-woods-and-eat-its-liver raw....while running around naked and howling at the moon. What I find Ven is people that want very much to be different; they desperately want to be individuals. The problem is that they try too hard. You can't honor ancient peoples by mashing all of their beliefs together. You can't know how ancient peoples practiced their religion when they didn't have a written language (the Celts). You can't pretend to be a persecuted minority by claiming to be a witch, and then falsely claiming a witch holocaust ("the burning times"). You can't slander your grandmother and great-grandmother by claiming they were pagans because they practiced folk medicine. You can't falsely claim to have a centuries old "book of shadows". I'm sorry, but I find neo-pagans, Wiccans, New-Agers, etc to be pretentious and ill-informed. I think it's sad when people have to try so hard to be individuals, when all they have to do is be themselves.

Irishknight -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 6:36:34 AM)
What is truly sad is when all of us get painted with this silly "fluffy bunny pagan" paintbrush. I get tired of people assuming I'm wiccan. I've studied wicca and moved on. I've studied a number of religions and moved on. I discovered my path and I follow it. I don't flaunt it nor go around banging on doors and threatening people with eternal damnation for not following my path. The word pagan actually used to have nothing to do with religion but was painted onto all other religions by the chistian church. It was a part of their campaign of villifying every nonchristian faith in existence. It ranked up there with "infidel" as it tends to be used by the Muslims. Slaveboy, do you deny the historical fact that many so called witches were burned? I am not claiming that these people have any true connection to those events but they did happen. And, maybe these people are not "slandering" anyone by attributing what they consider to be good things to their grandmothers. Maybe it is their way of honoring them. I will agree with you on the centuries old "book of shadows." Most have a 20th century original printing date inside the cover. Anything older would already have been destroyed by the most destructive force in human history .... the Catholic Church.

thishereboi -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 8:24:55 AM)
I love Loreena McKennitt, thanks for the link. To the OP....not positive, but I think the others are right about it refering to being pagan.

beargonewild -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 8:51:27 AM)
~FR~ I have to sadly chuckle seeing how the rampant misconception regarding Paganism and Wicca is sneered upon and treated with such disgust. It's too bad that many fail to grasp the concept that in all groups there will be the fringe idiots who take great pleasure in debasing a spiritual path which holds much meaning to thousands of people. The basic tenets of Wicca is work along side of Nature to co-exist peacefully, hence the Wiccan Rede. It is not a law: it is a guideline which governs how they co-exist with their fellow man and with the environment. I had hoped that the general population was able to separate the fantasy Hollywood bullshit from fact. Miigwetch Bear.

Vendaval -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 8:53:07 AM)
slaveboy, You have valid points about the trendiness and flake aspects. But there are sincere scholars and seekers within the various movements. I have to be somewhere this morning so do not have time to comment further. Have a good day, Vendaval

xxblushesxx -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 12:39:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Vendaval Well given the way you dress and you being outspoken in an ethics class, I might ask first if you are a feminist and second what spiritual path if any appeals to you. You kind of have the Earth-Mother vibe going on there from what you describe. For what it is worth, I get asked similar things by complete strangers for the same types of reasons. And that is even with my silver jewelry under clothing and not in plain sight. Go figure! I'm feminist enough to believe that all women should be able to decide what is right for them, even if what is right for them is to be submissive. I've mentioned in some other classes that "He" is the boss, and then when they look at me funny, I explain it by saying that it doesn't make my opinion less valid, it just basically means that he is the Captain, and I am the 1rst. mate. I am a follower of Christ. I also believe there are many paths to God, and that there is not one "true way". I come across as a liberal, (which I am about many things) but am basically a conservative. (I'm a conservative flower-child!) lol[sm=hippie.gif][sm=cute.gif]

Vendaval -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 1:42:13 PM)
"Conservative flower-child'? I like that, christine. Peace, Vendaval

Alumbrado -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/5/2008 5:43:29 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: beargonewild ~FR~ I have to sadly chuckle seeing how the rampant misconception regarding Paganism and Wicca is sneered upon and treated with such disgust. It's too bad that many fail to grasp the concept that in all groups there will be the fringe idiots who take great pleasure in debasing a spiritual path which holds much meaning to thousands of people. The basic tenets of Wicca is work along side of Nature to co-exist peacefully, hence the Wiccan Rede. It is not a law: it is a guideline which governs how they co-exist with their fellow man and with the environment. I had hoped that the general population was able to separate the fantasy Hollywood bullshit from fact. Miigwetch Bear. Quite easy to seperate the two... in Hollywood, Wicca has been around for countless centuries, and can perform paranormal feats, with libraries of ancient texts found in almost any small town, practitioners are physically almost flawless geniuses, and so forth and so on. In fact, Wicca was completely made up by some con artists about a century ago, and there isn't a stick long enough to measure the depth of the pile of excuses developed in denial of that. There is no 'rede' there is a cool sounding slogan, which changed as people pointed out its flaws, there are no ancient texts or knowledge, the oral traditions are made up, the adepts aren't....all as a mechanism to fleece the masses, not just a few fringies. No one from any of these 'mazhiques' has been able to get on the Gong Show, much less win the JREF million, and a spiritual path made up of preying on insecurities is hardly news.... so not surprisingly, there is little to distinguish it from any other profitable superstition. Within that reality, there are no doubt a tiny handful of people, just as in other religions, who use it as a positive personal framework, instead of what it was intended...more power to them.

Bethnai -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/6/2008 3:42:33 AM)
Actually, he stole from Rabelais. He’s the guy that came out with “the rede” and he was Crowley’s Thelema. Look at the rede now and look at Rabelais. Unrecognizable due to diluted form that we see it now. Crowley never stole from the Mason’s and he didn’t birth the Golden Dawn. He joined and left and that was pretty, too. Honestly, I just do not have the respect for the founders. Having said that, I had a split with Crowley and Fortune and Blavatsky because of racism. I tried really hard. I could defend them and their time period and all that but I won’t. I can’t reconcile it. Hence, my beloved Regardie. He had a patience that I will never have. Blavatsky’s Theosophical Society came out in 1875 as well. There were lots of secret societies. Compare what is out now and has been for the last 25 years; read recent literature and then open up Magick with Out Tears. That book is basic, it is 101. I would bet, unless someone has come out with something real recent, you won’t hit it again until you hit Chaos. I like the Mason’s but I think that there is too much attributed to them. It’s not even close., its apples and oranges. I do not think that the level of ritual is or ever was as embodied in the same manner such as what Eliphas Levi was searching for and he died in 1875. Different goals then and now. If you have the time check out this. If you don’t have the stamina skip to the section of polarity. For no other reason that it rocks and you will get it. Its not about a one true way. Its not an area you “mosh” shit together in either. Whatever you do, do it well, or not at all. Its not necessary for a welcoming committee.

fluffyswitch -> RE: "Do you follow the old ways?" (8/6/2008 6:10:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: beargonewild ~FR~ I have to sadly chuckle seeing how the rampant misconception regarding Paganism and Wicca is sneered upon and treated with such disgust. It's too bad that many fail to grasp the concept that in all groups there will be the fringe idiots who take great pleasure in debasing a spiritual path which holds much meaning to thousands of people. The basic tenets of Wicca is work along side of Nature to co-exist peacefully, hence the Wiccan Rede. It is not a law: it is a guideline which governs how they co-exist with their fellow man and with the environment. I had hoped that the general population was able to separate the fantasy Hollywood bullshit from fact. Miigwetch Bear. thank you! though to be fair, i'll accept it as long as the speaker (whether on this board or in any other context) rejects any religion. it's one thing to reject all religion (which i've had quite a few suggest, and at least that's consistent) it's another thing to dismiss a belief set that you don't really know anything about. though now i'm just paranoid this week due to other unfortunate moments of putting my foot firmly into my mouth in a post but i'm going to also say that if you have actually done any real investigation into the topic (in my case talking to someone who isn't actually wiccan, i'm not wiccan, i wish people would stop assuming all pagans are wiccan) and come to that conclusion i'm not going to agree with you but i may respect you more than someone that just hit up wikki.

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