RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (Full Version)

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TreasureKY -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 6:47:38 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop



ok, I slightly mis-quoted it, but here ya go, sexy Treasure:  Life of Brian



lol... Thank you, GT.  *smooches*

Sheesh... I've led such a sheltered life. 




windchymes -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 6:59:26 AM)

Maybe it's when people will stop thinking one is better than the other and stop trying to identify with the one that makes them feel superior to the rest.




sblady -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 7:25:08 AM)

Heh heh....I didn't get the "Loretta" reference either.  That clip was hilarious.  Thanks for supplying me with my morning laugh.

Treasure:  A very wise and dear friend shared the following as I was struggling with labels and becoming irritated when people I met kept saying "you don't seem to be very submissive".

"Your level of submission will be different with each and every partner and there is no way to gage ahead of time how deep that will be. Just be certain of the trust you can place in your partner and then let you heart go and it will find the right level of submission for that relationship. That could be a TPE slave or simply a vanilla SO who doesn't talk back. Either is valid, both are submissive, and each could be the right level of submission for you in that particular relationship."
 
 
 
 




TreasureKY -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 8:20:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: windchymes

Maybe it's when people will stop thinking one is better than the other and stop trying to identify with the one that makes them feel superior to the rest.


I definitely understand what you're saying, but I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that it will pretty much never happen.

There is something in humans that drives them to want to be accepted by others.  I would imagine that it is tied into evolutionary psychology... that mans' survival was greatly improved by being accepted to a group... by belonging to collection whose strength lay in numbers.

Yet man also has this desire to stand out from the crowd... to be noticed and thought of as "special".  I suspect that stems from the natural drive to procreate; being recognized as "the best" ensured selection as a mate.

Here among "BDSM lifestylers" there is the safety of a group... yet the individual desire for uniqueness drives some members to strive to narrow the criteria for acceptance.  It allows them to simultaneously push out other members and to draw attention to and hold themselves out as "the best", yet still guarantee their acceptance into the group thus ensuring their "safety".

Of course, there are always those who will argue for loosening the acceptance criteria.  I would surmise they fall generally into two camps...

Those who wish to solidify their membership in the group by encouraging a consensus on criteria to which they unquestioningly meet;

Or those who don't particularly care whether they are accepted to the group.  Perhaps they have found their mate and are confident of their own survival outside of the group... perhaps they recognize that equal safety exists in the larger group that is less defined... or perhaps they simply have evolved beyond the need to belong.

Of course, it could be that by arguing for greater acceptance into the membership, the advocates are both ensuring their position within the group by "watering down" the membership while at the same time making themselves stand out by virtue of their campaigning.

lol... Who knows?

Ain't the diversity of humanity grand?  [:D]




windchymes -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 10:13:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TreasureKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: windchymes

Maybe it's when people will stop thinking one is better than the other and stop trying to identify with the one that makes them feel superior to the rest.


I definitely understand what you're saying, but I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that it will pretty much never happen.

There is something in humans that drives them to want to be accepted by others.  I would imagine that it is tied into evolutionary psychology... that mans' survival was greatly improved by being accepted to a group... by belonging to collection whose strength lay in numbers.

Yet man also has this desire to stand out from the crowd... to be noticed and thought of as "special".  I suspect that stems from the natural drive to procreate; being recognized as "the best" ensured selection as a mate.

Here among "BDSM lifestylers" there is the safety of a group... yet the individual desire for uniqueness drives some members to strive to narrow the criteria for acceptance.  It allows them to simultaneously push out other members and to draw attention to and hold themselves out as "the best", yet still guarantee their acceptance into the group thus ensuring their "safety".

Of course, there are always those who will argue for loosening the acceptance criteria.  I would surmise they fall generally into two camps...

Those who wish to solidify their membership in the group by encouraging a consensus on criteria to which they unquestioningly meet;

Or those who don't particularly care whether they are accepted to the group.  Perhaps they have found their mate and are confident of their own survival outside of the group... perhaps they recognize that equal safety exists in the larger group that is less defined... or perhaps they simply have evolved beyond the need to belong.

Of course, it could be that by arguing for greater acceptance into the membership, the advocates are both ensuring their position within the group by "watering down" the membership while at the same time making themselves stand out by virtue of their campaigning.

lol... Who knows?

Ain't the diversity of humanity grand?  [:D]



Oh, I completely agree with everything you said!  It's very much human nature, from everything to which sports team you support, which religion you practice or don't practice, which civic organization you belong to, which fraternity or sorority, whether you work for Coke or Pepsi, and politics.....don't even go there, lol. 

I think diversity is grand, I enjoy it.  (Sometimes it irritates me, but on the whole....lol)




AquaticSub -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 10:26:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TreasureKY

Reading yet again another thread where the subject is arguing over the difference between a submissive and a slave, and between a D/s and an M/s relationship, I have decided that I will no longer use any of those descriptors...

Should anyone ask me if I'm submissive or slave, I'll say I'm Firm's.  We don't have an M/s or D/s relationship, we have a F/t (Firmhand/treasure) relationship. 

Screw "official" definitions.  I defy anyone to come up with an outside authoritative source for the definition of an F/t relationship.  [;)]


*grins* I love you. This is why I'm just his girl. That encompasses everything for us since we don't fit into the neat little boxes.




barelynangel -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 10:48:43 AM)

grins, umm Irish:

B = Beautiful
I = Individual
T= That
C=Causes
H=Hardons

I have no clue why people think that's degrading either.  grins, just saying.

angel




MadRabbit -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 11:30:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TreasureKY

Reading yet again another thread where the subject is arguing over the difference between a submissive and a slave, and between a D/s and an M/s relationship, I have decided that I will no longer use any of those descriptors...

Should anyone ask me if I'm submissive or slave, I'll say I'm Firm's.  We don't have an M/s or D/s relationship, we have a F/t (Firmhand/treasure) relationship. 

Screw "official" definitions.  I defy anyone to come up with an outside authoritative source for the definition of an F/t relationship.  [;)]


So you have a Full-Time relationship?

What? You think your better than the Part-Timers?




TreasureKY -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 12:41:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

So you have a Full-Time relationship?

What? You think your better than the Part-Timers?


lol...  Only the ones who just have p/t relationships and not P/t.  [;)]




IrishMist -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 12:43:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

grins, umm Irish:

B = Beautiful
I = Individual
T= That
C=Causes
H=Hardons

I have no clue why people think that's degrading either.  grins, just saying.

angel

OMG LMFAO

I have never heard that one. I have t-shirt from like 15 years ago that has the other saying on it...but I have never heard this one...I like it better than mine [8D]




GreedyTop -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 1:25:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TreasureKY

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

So you have a Full-Time relationship?

What? You think your better than the Part-Timers?


lol...  Only the ones who just have p/t relationships and not P/t.  [;)]



snob ..one twue wayer! 


*snort*




Jeffff -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 1:33:55 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit
So you have a Full-Time relationship?

What? You think your better than the Part-Timers?


With full time.... you get benefits

HumanResourcesDom




IvyMorgan -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/9/2008 2:46:21 PM)

The guy stoppping over last night asked me this morning.

Answer:  "I'm a sub, because I don't like the label slave."

Works for me.

Turns out, subs make good english breakfasts.




MasterAramis -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/10/2008 6:26:57 AM)

quote:

arguing over the difference between a submissive and a slave, and between a D/s and an M/s relationship,


This will always be a life long debate. I think that is the problem with it. There are those, like me, who view M/s as a very high level and spiritual aspect of Dominance and submission which does not revolve around sexual pursuits (while this naturally happens and it's easy to associate M/s with sex) and then there are those who just use it as a term to refer to what they do in the bedroom. The latter will argue that while they are in the bedroom their terminology fits what they do and I would argue it's not a true representation of the M/s definition.

Even if you come up with something new, people will always try to make it fit what THEY are doing. My personal observation is do or say whatever is best for your situation, you will always have those that put their own spin on things.

Sincerely,

Aramis Duval




MasterAramis -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/10/2008 6:30:18 AM)

quote:

grins, umm Irish:


I kind of figured you were Irish. Must make things interesting! Having a slave who is part Irish, part Welsh I get the picture. LOL.

Sincerely,

Aramis Duval




LuckyAlbatross -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/10/2008 9:49:28 AM)

So what about people like me who view sexual acts AS very high and spiritual activities in and of themselves?




Jeffff -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/10/2008 9:52:49 AM)

Well.. I think . you can be who you want to be, when you want to be.

but maybe that is too simple

Jeff




MasterAramis -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/10/2008 10:00:57 AM)

quote:

So what about people like me who view sexual acts AS very high and spiritual activities in and of themselves?


Hello LuckyAlbatross,

IMHO they should be highly spiritual, I just don't view it as M/s. The Master / slave dynamic is the packaging that holds my life as well as the properties life tightly together. Sex is just a very small aspect of what we do.

Can you have highly spiritual sex without M/s? Most certainly. In true enslavement you can't have it the other way around where it is not spiritual.

Again these are just my opinions, your millage may vary.

Sincerely,

Aramis Duval




swooshieone -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/10/2008 11:10:25 AM)

I think slavery was abolished a century ago....submissive is a characteristic and I am simply vee.
Acolyte of all things Kinky. Geez that sounds pretty good. I need to put it on a business card or a bumper sticker. LOL




ncprincess -> RE: My personal solution to the sub/slave debate... (8/10/2008 4:10:45 PM)

I am just winging it here; but:

is it conceiveably as simple as a slave sucks you off, swallows, rises and gets you a beer, and a submissive sucks you off, swallows,  stops and gargles without permission before bringing you a beer?


heyyyyyyy, I don't gargle without permission before getting the beer so why can I only claim submissive?




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