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Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 3:12:52 PM

RCdc

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This is Darcy

I must admit I'm surprised by tonight's admission by the Chancellor, Alastair Darling, that in layman's terms he and his government have not a singular fucking clue what they are doing. Not that they are incompetent - after all, Prime Minister Gordon Brown and his white-haired Chancellor have for many months now come across as a deeply unfuuny version of Laurel and Hardy - but that they finally seem to have realised that this is in fact the case, and that yes, we the great British public, are in fact, to use Mr Darling's words, 'pissed off' with them.

I eagerly await Mr Brown's 'economic restart' that is apparently planned for the autumn, not for its brilliant economic connotations (and certainly not for its results, a word that this lamentable government is woefully unfamiliar with), but because it will be amusing to see how they explain away yet another dismal performance from a Prime Minister who is achieving the impossible in actually making the late PM Anthony Blair look like he actually had a clue.

Oh, here's a link to the BBC's report on Mr Darling's admission, should you need a laugh this evening.... http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7589291.stm

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 3:15:12 PM

meatcleaver

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Well its Brown's own fault for not stabbing Blair in the back years ago. Blair's policies are coming home to roost and as usual he is nowhere to be seen and has got away with everything yet again.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 3:19:37 PM

Politesub53

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Hi Darcy, my regards to yourself the dark one.

The problem is Labout have concentrated on inflation and not taking anything else, like a lack of growth into consideration. I forget where, but read today that someone was saying Darling and Browns policies have made the problems in the housing market worse, not better.

I`m not sure what they can do, now that the horse has bolted. They dithered over Northern Rock, while Brown took time out to think about calling an election. I think once again they will do too little too late.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 3:21:05 PM

meatcleaver

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On second thoughts, Brown was the Chancellor and was happy to fill a dead man's shoes, still his own fault and deserves the blame as much as Blair.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 3:21:50 PM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Well its Brown's own fault for not stabbing Blair in the back years ago. Blair's policies are coming home to roost and as usual he is nowhere to be seen and has got away with everything yet again.

Agreed, Brown seemed to hide in the background every time there was a crisis.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 3:28:03 PM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Hi Darcy, my regards to yourself the dark one.

The problem is Labout have concentrated on inflation and not taking anything else, like a lack of growth into consideration. I forget where, but read today that someone was saying Darling and Browns policies have made the problems in the housing market worse, not better.

I`m not sure what they can do, now that the horse has bolted. They dithered over Northern Rock, while Brown took time out to think about calling an election. I think once again they will do too little too late.

The housing problem was set in motion under Thatcher with deregulation in the city, Labour could have put the regulation back but that wouldn't have insolated Britain completely from the current credit problem, that problem was started in America. Northern Rock had nothing to do with Labour, they were just left holding the baby. However, a country that relies on the housing market for its economy is always going to land in trouble, especially with an historic short fall in housing causing inflated prices. The worse thing Labour is responsible for is the public/private partneships which will cost the country huge amounts of money into the distant future, paying for hospitals, schools and railways they could ahve paid for just once instead of several times over.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 3:42:41 PM

Politesub53

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You miss the point about Northern Rock. Darling should have acted prior to the run by investors. Eventually they bailed the bank out with a larger sum than Northern Rock had asked for in the first place. I didnt say they had caused the problem in the housing market but that they had made it worse. Go right ahead and blame Thatcher again, it wont absolve labour.

How do you suggest we become a manufacturing nation again ? Its been in decline since WW2, if not before, and things wont change now. Not while we can buy cheap goods from abroad. Sure we can still make quality goods, but the days of mass industry are long gone.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 3:49:27 PM

Raechard

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Never trust someone that dyes their eyebrows and that is all I'm saying about that.

+ he looks like he's from Vulcan.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 4:24:47 PM

meatcleaver

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

You miss the point about Northern Rock. Darling should have acted prior to the run by investors. Eventually they bailed the bank out with a larger sum than Northern Rock had asked for in the first place. I didnt say they had caused the problem in the housing market but that they had made it worse. Go right ahead and blame Thatcher again, it wont absolve labour.

How do you suggest we become a manufacturing nation again ? Its been in decline since WW2, if not before, and things wont change now. Not while we can buy cheap goods from abroad. Sure we can still make quality goods, but the days of mass industry are long gone.

The problem Britain had since the war was extraordinarily bad management with a reluctance to invest in new equipement and products. Labour poured money into supporting manufacturing industry but kept the old industrial regimes in place which was its biggest mistake because that allowed the malaise to continue. British designers fled the country in droves, working for such companies as BMW,Volkswagen, Yamaha etc. because no one wanted their designs. Even in the Thatcher era designers couldn't get backing in Britain and so went abroad. Before you start blaming the unions, there was more days lost through strikes in Germany than Britain in the 60s & 70s and they had far far away better conditions than British workers.

Thatcher deregulated the money markets and it was deregulation that has had a direct result on the credit crisis today. Labour should have regulated them again and that is what they are guilty of. Labour was reluctant to interfer in Northern Rock because it knows it would have been accused by all the media of being 'old' Labour if it did. Saying Darling should have acted before he did is using the benefit of hindsight. I notice the Tories didn't have an answer to the problem. They started the problem by allowing so much rented property to disappear, not build extra housing and so inflate the price of bought houses. Labour is guilty of becoming 'New Tory' following old discredited Tory policies, that is how they have come unstuck

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 8/29/2008 4:26:32 PM >

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/29/2008 4:38:52 PM

Politesub53

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Mangement practices were not the reason for the decline of the industry. The only reason for the downfall from any manufacturing industry is one of cost. All the time other countries can produce the same product for less cost, they are the ones who will hold sway. The state of the Unions in Germany had no part in the downfall of manufacturing here. Costs alone were the cause, its that simple, strikes or poor management, the end result was importing goods was cheaper. Why do you think everything now comes from China ?

And yes, re Northern Rock i blame labour, they hold the strings and didnt act.

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Post #: 10

RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 2:45:58 AM

RealityLicks

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I think it's very brave and a step in the right direction to admit to having made mistakes. Hindsdight is 20/20 vision etc., and it's all too easy for others to criticise after the fact. The truth is, all of the western governments and banks failed - they failed to deal adequately with the emerging economies' effect on the big picture.

Consumer prices have been low for ages because of cheap goods from China, India etc. But yes, headline rates of inflation stayed low and they set interest rates low in response but this, we now see, was an error because asset prices rose in the same period - stocks and property have gone through the roof (hoho). Borrowing shouldn't have been so cheap because it was ultimately founded on an under-valuation of the yuan and a disregard of risk.

But greed is a powerful motivator - greed of the public for cheap consumer goods and greed from investors for massive profits. That's the source of the liquidity problems we are seeing now and its true of every western economy - all of them are slowing down and deleveraging, not just the UK. It's just that here it's tied to party politcs quite strongly -- this lot have been in for a long time and made enemies in the media and business. If you think that little prick Osborne is any better, you're in for a shock, politesub.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 2:46:13 AM

RCdc

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard

Never trust someone that dyes their eyebrows and that is all I'm saying about that.

+ he looks like he's from Vulcan.

I know - what is up with that?

the.dark.

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RC&dc

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 2:48:28 AM

RCdc

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Mangement practices were not the reason for the decline of the industry. The only reason for the downfall from any manufacturing industry is one of cost. All the time other countries can produce the same product for less cost, they are the ones who will hold sway. The state of the Unions in Germany had no part in the downfall of manufacturing here. Costs alone were the cause, its that simple, strikes or poor management, the end result was importing goods was cheaper. Why do you think everything now comes from China ?

And yes, re Northern Rock i blame labour, they hold the strings and didnt act.

Big hugs to my favourite politeone.
I am with you on this - I do believe Labour should be held accountable for the NR fiasco.

the.dark.

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RC&dc

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 2:48:30 AM

RealityLicks

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Oh yeah, while I'm rambling: the UK manufacturing sector is ranked 6th in the world. Perhaps not quite good enough but hardly the shambles you seem to depict, either.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 2:54:42 AM

NumberSix

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Jesus h painted eyebrows christ, Darcy.

There's your first problem...

The Fuckin Guardian Headline:

Chancellor Darling says, follow me!!!!!!!

So, some great bleeding poofters have a parade in Sussex?

God's holy trousers, woman!!!

Even that cloth-eared bint, Bush; with a company named 'Arbusto' doesn't fall in the hole that swiftly.

Them dogs just won't hunt at all.

Ron

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 2:57:10 AM

RCdc

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RealityLicks
The truth is, all of the western governments and banks failed - they failed to deal adequately with the emerging economies' effect on the big picture.

Absolutely, but if the government had reassured people properly in the first place, NR would not have had the cash withdrawls that it did.
And right now, the government have added to the housing crisis by being vague about the whole stamp duty cut. I know if I wanted to buy, I would definately be putting off doing so until I knew the score on that front, but they haven't even hinted on which way they want to go with that since dropping the thought that they might do it. It has only added to the burden, not assisted it.

the.dark.

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RC&dc

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 2:58:45 AM

Politesub53

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RealityLicks

Oh yeah, while I'm rambling: the UK manufacturing sector is ranked 6th in the world. Perhaps not quite good enough but hardly the shambles you seem to depict, either.

Im not sure if this was to me or not. I never said it was a shambles, just that the days of mass industry are long gone. Im not sure what table you looked at, but i assume its based on £££ and not volume. IE less goods but costing more ?

I agree it was brave of Darling to say this. My guess is he is trying to ensure he has some support from the rank and file. Brown is likely to use him as a scapegoat during the much touted reshuffle.

Thanks for the tip about Ozzy, although i still play his CD`s

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 3:18:20 AM

RealityLicks

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It was directed to you, Politesub - sorry not to be more clear.

Yes, the days of mass industry being a big employer are gone - firms can make more with a smaller workforce, especially in the areas where the UK is strong, like pharma and aerospace. We'll never lead the world in metal-bashing again ... but do we want to? And the 6th ranking is for value-added goods - aero, motors, defence (oops). I agree teh investment picture historically is a poor one and many problems were exacerbated by it. Also - although last years figures were good, we will see them drop off in light of recent developments. I just resent the partnering of poor economic outlook with party politics where it isn't related.

And yes, Alistair Darling looks strange but its a typical celtic thing to go grey up top but still have black eyebrows - some of the chicks have red hair and blonde pubes, what can you do?

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 3:30:26 AM

RealityLicks

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark
Absolutely, but if the government had reassured people properly in the first place, NR would not have had the cash withdrawls that it did.

But so many people said at the time that NR should have been allowed to go to the wall, that Gov't shouldn't interfere. Taking to the next step: how many banks can our gov't shore up and if NR, why not B&B etc etc?

quote:

And right now, the government have added to the housing crisis by being vague about the whole stamp duty cut. I know if I wanted to buy, I would definately be putting off doing so until I knew the score on that front, but they haven't even hinted on which way they want to go with that since dropping the thought that they might do it. It has only added to the burden, not assisted it.

the.dark.

They said they wouldn't cut stamp duty but the media won't let it out of the public mind because they mostly favour the Tories - new blood boosts interest in their wares.

Labour are supporting councils with funds to keep people out of repossession instead and RSLs to buy unsold residential schemes etc. The thing about the property crash in the UK is, we hear a lot from middle-class people who stand to lose money but little from working-class people who stand to lose their homes and it's soon clear who really needs government help.

If you want to buy, don't - regardless of a stamp duty cut. Prices will fall much more and like it or not, they need to.

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RE: Chancellor Darling admits Labour have failed - 8/30/2008 3:35:41 AM

RealityLicks

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NumberSix

Ron

S'up, homes?

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