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Bethnai -> RE: Don't underestimate this woman - she's a pit bull. (9/28/2008 8:33:49 PM)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: meatcleaver
quote:
ORIGINAL: Bethnai
My views changed when Hamas was elected. I, like many others, said ok, you want to sit at the table with the adults, then act like it. But the goals had changed and that is a problem.
Hezbollah screws with Israel and Lebanon becomes Lebanot. Everyone says, Bad Israel. Well, Hezbollah’s got more shit now and is a problem. Where does everybody get their shit from? Russia and to a lesser extent China. Guess who’s going to make sure that Iran achieves its nuclear ambitions and has been working with them all this time? Russia .Guess who is in Tartus? Guess who is in Venezuela?
Hamas asked Israel for peace negotiations the moment they were elected. The Bush administration said no which delighted Israel who also promptly said no. Hezbollah are a product of Israeli aggression in Lebanon, before Israel invaded Lebanon in the 80s they didn't exist, they are a self defence force of Lebanonese formed in that war. The US calls them terrorists because it suits the US to do so. It doesn't surprise me that Russia or even China were to help Iran get nuclear weapons, they are only doing what the US does with Israel.
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ORIGINAL: Bethnai
This technically, isn’t new. What is new is that everyone’s cards are now on the table.
So, therefore, I will tell you what is going to happen if there is a division of Jerusalem at this time. The world will sit back and applaud, finally. Hamas, which can’t seem to be controlled is going to cross it. Different goals.
If there was ever a division of Jerusalem it would be in a comprehensive peace plan. Israel and the US have done everything in their power to avoid that.
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ORIGINAL: Bethnai
Israel will have not only internal conflicts but then be forced to occupy East Jerusalem. Then the world can say, Bad Israel. It can then spiral out of control again for what everyone already knows. Because most ME countries will say they are for the Palestinian cause, frankly just because they do not want them in there own country. However, this is yet another proxy war with some larger jack offs in the big picture. Then others will step forward “in defense” of the Palestinian cause.
Israel avoids peace because the US is willing to bankroll their wars and turn a blind eye to Israeli huiman rights abuses. At some point American tax payers might think that backing an uncompromising Israel costs too much and turn the money tap off, then Israel will have to negotiate peace. Good sense would say it is better to negotiate from strength which is now rather than a possible future weakness but when has good sense ever been a part of middle east politics?
Hezbollah did not rise up out of occupation. That is a complete disrespect to what was going on in Lebanon at the time. The PLO was the destabilizing force that pushed Lebanon into civil war and they had been recently kicked out of Jordan. Jordan, you know that place that was all about the Palestinians in 1922? They called it Trans-Jordan back then. We are not even going to contemplate Syria's refusal to acknowledge Lebanon as a country and the 30 year occupation. It is a complete and total disregard for Amal. That is exactly what Hezbollah's answer is to. Complete disregard for the movements at the time that realized that they were caught between the Soviet Union and the US. Complete disregard for Musa al-Sadr. Complete disregard for immigration problems with Palestinians looking for work and working for less money than the residents. Complete disregard for the Shia's.
I'm not a fan of Ariel Sharon, but he called it right. You get to bomb the hell out of Israel and operate by different laws then dealing with a nation state. A nation state would actually give a damn about the people. The PLO did not. They were bombing the crap out of civilians and then running and hiding among the civilian population. It is not necessary if you realize it or not, there were people in Israel living in bomb shelters. A bus, a school etc. and so on. 2006, you don't get to instigate and then run and hide. Stop the shit or get spanked. Period.
Don't tell me that Israel hasn't been spanked by the US. Israel was not supposed to go in and nail Osirak. You know, nuclear reactors provided by the French? Scuds from Iraq-do nothing- a deep humiliation?
Don't tell me that Israel has not stepped forward and given up all kinds of shit for peace, Begin walked in (incidently which is the problem with the woman this thread is originally about) and gave up all kinds of shit. He did this without even consulting the Knesset and you know what? Arafat walked. Yep.
By no means am I stating that Israel or the US is always on the up and up. I have no problem stating precisely where they fuck up. That ain't it.
Israel did not create Hezbolla. Further, Israel financially back Hamas just to overthrow PLO many, many years ago. The Palestinians already have a home land.
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