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SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 9:12:39 AM   
thornhappy


Posts: 8596
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline 		New article in the NYTimes, SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse.  Voluntary supervision didn't work. 

thornhappy
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 10:06:47 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		People in business will pursue their own economic gain at the expense of others.

Who'd have thought?!

We've known for a century that an industrial economy cannot place blind faith in Adam Smith's agricultural model. The unregulated 19th century led to exactly the monopolies T. Roosevelt started to address. C. Coolidge proclaimed "the business of America is business," and when his successor ignored the written plea of a thousand economists, the market crashed in 1929---taking "non-market" people with it. Eventually, FDR introduced regulations to pull us out and better manage the economy.

From there it's been a free ride. Economic booms were wasted. Then suddenly Reagan told us everything was simple again, and that morning in America, Adam Smith rose from the dead, unable to address the realities of an industrial economy. So the largest creditor nation became the largest debtor nation in just eight years, and the market crashed again in 1987----along with a Savings & Loan scandal resolved at the expense of the taxpayers.

Then came the largest peacetime expansion in the history of the U.S., and deficits turned to surpluses. But we were too worried about Clinton getting a blowjob to pay attention.

So more deregulation, under the fantasy that all deregulation (and any tax cut) is good. The Treasury will magically create the money. Osama bin Laden attacked the U.S. while the Bush Administration was asleep at the wheel. Then they used that tragedy to slam through the neo-com agenda of more deregulation, stripping away Constitutional rights, and starting a war by lying about its connection to 9/11. Bush made Osama a success by insuring the attacks would indeed undermine U.S. financial interests. We're spending a fortune, we've sacrificed our rights, and Osama is untouched.

So our deficits are soaring, with no end in sight. We're still pretending we don't need to address Medicare and Social Security, even though doing so now will prevent the next crisis. We spend more on health care than any other nation, but we don't have health care for 25% of our citizens---so we pay instead in the emergency rooms.

And now, after almost eight years of Bush, we face another financial crisis, again in banking, and while people lose their homes, even more money is stolen from taxpayers while we're told we must keep taxes low on the wealthy.

Yet Warren Buffet is a Democrat. Go figure.

People need to stop voting against their own interests.


(in reply to thornhappy)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 10:26:00 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Deregulation has worked soooo well for the Airlines hasn't it?
In any business that involves so much money regulation is an absolute neccessity.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 1:00:01 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		they did not specify if on the 800bn bail out- that we charge to the til- if we get ....................frequent flier mileage bonus points!!

every American will have to allow an automatic deduction from their checking account.

the problem is the human of WRONG and the GRID is right.  Do not ask questions, do not challenge the grid.

Well now the grid could collapse!!  We are all in grave danger.

Just because we have done things the grid way does not mean that is the only way we can live- that no other mode is survivable or even decent.

Here is an anology.

Orland Square mall in Chicago.  A better mall was built accross the street. So revenue dried up- stores went under the building fell behind in tax and it went into forclsure.   FOR YEARS!!!!   all the while shoppers were still served.
The grounds were full of weeds- and it looks like a dump.  No one cleans it up- no one of the towns-people have any care to personally go there and swing a paint brush.
People "could" give up a day a week to go tend to the premises.  But no.



(in reply to popeye1250)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 3:27:31 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		So the head of the SEC admits he did not do his job. I wonder how many millions his golden parachute will cost us.

T

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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 3:32:01 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		None. Despite McCain's bluster, the SEC is an independent agency, and a president can't just march in and fire its Chair.

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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 4:35:02 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		Let me get this straight, the SEC is not part of the government, neither is freddie or fanny, nor the FHA, or the IRS for that matter, and don't forget the federal reserve. Is the VA even part of the government ? Is the government part of the government ?

I would ask why all of these entities are corporations outside the government, but Charles Coughlin asked the same question some sixty odd years ago and he is absolutely a no-good knuckle dragging bigoted slob, who the Catholic church never got rid of, I wonder why. Why he wasn't tarred and feathered, put to the rack, beheaded and burned at the stake I'll never understand. Instead they let him live out his years of unmitigated hate and bigotry in Royal Oak, MI.

I guess us politically correct folk do have some mercy, either that or a sense of humor, because nothing that Man said is worth anything today. I will have to promptly throw out the books and recordings of all that rubbish.

The rubbish THAT CAME TRUE.

I say we let the whole lot of them starve, all of them. Everybody stop working, lose everything, you probably will anyway. Let them go without money. You think the chair of the SEC is going to be in an unemployment line somewhere ?

Don't get me wrong, I am not disagreeing, but it was a perfect opportunity to demonstrate what I said about "throwing the baby out with the bathwater".

That is, these things have been known for a long time.

I still want to know why a smaller bailout didn't happen a few years ago. This was a plan, plain and simple. Why didn't it become a crisis at 699B, at 698B or possibly 200B years ago, and bring the reforms in ? Did all these foreclosures happen in the last month or so or what ?

No, they wanted to get the pot bigger, so that when they win, they win bigger. Pretty much like a game of poker.

I can see it, it took me 48 years to figure out how the world works, and if you think I am pissed off about it, come on over to my house. Bring up the subject and you will hear more cussing in one day than you have heard in the rest of your entire life. And I firmly believe Bush was in on it.

Proof ? Why does Bush make it sound so urgent ? Because he needs to take care of his buddies while he is still in the big chair. If I were in congress I would make it a point to stall the bailout until next year. Are you telling me these people are hurting and can't pay their bills ? That's what happens to me when I fail. Let them sell a boat or two, or a half dozen cars, or a few extra houses they may have forgotten they had.

There is no fucking way I could express my opinion about this completely without getting kicked off here, and probably the internet altogether.

This country is no joke anymore, we have dropped waaaaaay below that status. Private corporations run everything.

The Chinese government does not care about it's people at all. The head of their equivalent of the FDA took bribes and a few of the peons died. They convicted and EXECUTED him for what our FDA does every day. Our government cares about us, yes they do. Those nasty Chinese.

T

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 5:10:19 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Let me get this straight, the SEC is not part of the government, neither is freddie or fanny, nor the FHA, or the IRS for that matter, and don't forget the federal reserve. Is the VA even part of the government ? Is the government part of the government ?


While I sympathize with much of your ire, this statement isn't true either.

A number of governmental entities exist, established by Congress, to run independently of political pressure.

Congress could also end them if it wished.

(in reply to Termyn8or)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 5:28:42 PM   
Termyn8or


Posts: 18681
Joined: 11/12/2005
Status: offline 		"Congress could also end them if it wished."

No such luck.

T

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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 5:33:46 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		Well, they do have rationale for their existence.

They are also typically underfunded for the jobs they're asked to do. Political appointees at the helm don't help either.

(in reply to Termyn8or)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 5:43:12 PM   
bipolarber


Posts: 2792
Joined: 9/25/2004
Status: offline 		Fuckin', DUH!

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/27/2008 8:40:31 PM   
corysub


Posts: 1492
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

Let me get this straight, the SEC is not part of the government, neither is freddie or fanny, nor the FHA, or the IRS for that matter, and don't forget the federal reserve. Is the VA even part of the government ? Is the government part of the government ?


While I sympathize with much of your ire, this statement isn't true either.

A number of governmental entities exist, established by Congress, to run independently of political pressure.

Congress could also end them if it wished.


The S.E.C. is an independent agency of the U.S. Government.  Under the leadership, or lack thereof, of Mr. Cox, the S.E.C. has done tremendous damage to the financial system.They didn't do their job of oversight which is not suprising since most Washington elected or selected players usually wind up beholden to the people that they are supposed to oversee, it seems to me.  FannieMae spent over $100 million in lobby expenses in a six year period, benefitting, among others, Sen. Chris Dodd who is Chair of the Finance Commitee. Barney Frank's boyfriend or spouse, whatever, was given a job as a director in the sub-prime area...How did he get that?  Great test scores I guess. 

The S.E.C. also changed the uptick rule for short sales that  allowed hedge funds and other speculators to beat the price of a stock down just about at will.  The brokers were allowed to significantly expand the leverage on their balance sheets and Bear Stearn, Lehman and others had over 30-1 leverage...up from more normal 12-1.  Leverage works great on the upside, but will wipe you out in a blink if the trade goes against you.  Bear Stearns is gone, Lehman is gone, and more will follow....Strap yourself in and put on a hard hat.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/28/2008 4:02:50 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Deregulation has worked soooo well for the Airlines hasn't it?
In any business that involves so much money regulation is an absolute neccessity.


I think it's a function of "Does this operate to provide a benefit to The People, or solely to generate Revenue"

Things with a distributed benefit, The Mail, Telecom, Transport are infrastructure used to benefit people, for which the benefit to the operator might be marginal -- at best.

In those cases, STRICT regulation is necessary. Of course, complete and total losers like Carly Fiorina wouldn't understand that. That's why they're EX-CEOs.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to popeye1250)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/28/2008 10:34:52 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

Voluntary supervision didn't work.


That's GODDAM fucking Republican LUNACY. It makes me want to throw something!!!

The Fox cannot guard the henhouse.

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 9/28/2008 10:36:02 PM >

(in reply to thornhappy)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/28/2008 10:47:38 PM   
rexrgisformidoni


Posts: 578
Joined: 9/20/2008
Status: offline 		here's a decent solution imho

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/23/business/worldbusiness/23krona.html?em

(in reply to cloudboy)
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RE: SEC Concedes Oversight Flaws Fueled Collapse - 9/29/2008 6:12:52 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		The fangs were removed from the S.E.C. a while back which has led to this, as has the lack of strong audits. Auditing is a problem because the public accounting firms that do audits also like to get hired to do other stuff.

Just as reputable house inspectors should not also own a repair business, because of the conflict of interests, auditing firms should only do audits. That and giving the S.E.C. more power instead of less is necessary.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to rexrgisformidoni)
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