My thoughts on Mastery

My thoughts on Mastery (Full Version)

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SimplyMichael -> My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 12:39:25 PM)
Since people were so enjoying shredding my views on submissives I thought I would throw them some red meat they could really sink their teeth into. (note: I wrote this some time ago, the relationship I mentioned has morphed but as I think about it, how it has morphed more proves the point than undermines it) I just finished watching Braveheart for the 100th time and movies like that always make me weepy and sappy and evoke the need to write bad poetry. For some reason I got to thinking about the nature of dominance and ownership. I can own a book and never have to read it, never open its covers to discover its contents, never explore the deeper meanings or allow it to expand my mind. I truly own that book but so what? That ownership is meaningless in any way that matters. A child can own a book, a pompous ass can own a book as strongly and firmly as I. There is no reason to be proud of that sort of ownership. Owning an object is a passive act, once paid for, no further effort is required. It is merely an act of accumulation; it says nothing about me that I own this book or that. Unlike a book, owning an animal requires constant effort and how that animal behaves does reflect on their owner. Owning a dog is more complicated than owning a book. Some dogs are allowed to run wild, undisciplined and untrained. However, a few months taken to instill discipline makes a huge difference and instills behaviors that last a lifetime. However, it doesn’t take much to earn the loyalty and affection of a dog. A few treats here and there, a pat on the head, and he is your best friend. Falconry is often related to D/s, the beautiful noble bird flying free and yet returning to the hand of the master is an appealing analogy. I think it is a perfect analogy for many who chest thump about being master/slave. Those falcons are let free only physically, their minds are chained and tethered to their owners. Not by the character of the master, not because they earned that loyalty, but because the falcon has been raised to believe that nourishment comes only from their owner. So they return only to be fed, not knowing they could nourish and sustain themselves. The chains that bind them are invisible to them and if revealed, the falcon would never return. That is neither mastery nor slavery as I use the words, that is fraud and deceit that keep those falcons bound to their owner. I strive to make my partner strong and free with no invisible chains, no fraud and deceit. I want her bound to me not by chains but by joy. I want to give her the heavens to be free in so that when she returns I know she could kneel at any man’s feet but chooses mine out of all the men in the world. That to me is mastery and slavery and possession. Part of the difficulty of all this is how we use language. A perfect example is the word respect. I treat my partner with a great deal of respect and I have a great deal of respect for her as a person and as a dominant. That doesn’t keep me from treating her in other darker ways but no matter how low I take her, at some point, I reach out to her and offer her my hand to lift her back up to stand proudly next to me. I push her to be a better person, not because I am a beacon of perfection but because I want her to be a better person. The respect comes in because I respect her enough to listen when she pushes me to be a better person as wel.l I do not fear her being strong or having an opinion, in fact I encourage her to be strong and to have opinions. She is bound to me not because I put a lock on her yesterday but because I inspired her today. She sees me allow someone else the last word, or share credit for an idea that was mine, or stop what I am doing to kneel down and give my full attention to her child. That is why she is bound to me. I am not alone in this, I know others who have bound their partner to them not by chains, not by manipulation, but by showing their partner how to be free and find joy and they are together because nothing makes them freer and more joyful than being together. I truly treasure those people and those friendships.

BitaTruble -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 1:01:03 PM)
[sm=yourock.gif] I'm going to respond to this later but wanted to take just a moment and thank you for this treat.

RCdc -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 1:04:34 PM)
I am not going to respond the the thread you have posted because I got throught the first paragraph and realised you were essentially issuing a challange and I do not play games. I give honest opinion and if that is seen as shreading - sobeit. All I have to add Michael, really - is seriously stop acting like a child when a handful of people disagree with you - it is growing utterly tiresome. If we all agreed it would be pretty boring. If you were truely bothered about people mistaking your words on the other thread, then the responsibility lays with you to put people right, not issuing challenges and starting a thread all about you. the.dark.

SimplyMichael -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 1:12:44 PM)
If it was so tiresome, why do you feel the need to respond? As for my being childish, well, if I didn't know better I might think that was a petty insult but we all know you are far too adult for that, don't we? So, if you have any actual comments to make about the post itself, rather than my character, I look forward to the discussion. If not, please remember how tiresome and childish I am and join a thread more suited to you.

Daes -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 1:34:45 PM)
I do think the first bit allows for misunderstandings. But i thought it was a wonderfully written post. Thank you.

leadership527 -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 2:00:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael I can own a book and never have to read it, never open its covers to discover its contents, never explore the deeper meanings or allow it to expand my mind. I truly own that book but so what? That ownership is meaningless in any way that matters. A child can own a book, a pompous ass can own a book as strongly and firmly as I. There is no reason to be proud of that sort of ownership. Not true. There is, simply, pride of ownership. For instance, let's suppose the book in question is a rare copy of god-knows-what. Then someone might well have pride that they are able to own this thing when others cannot (perhaps material success?). The book in this case becomes a status symbol. quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael I strive to make my partner strong and free with no invisible chains, no fraud and deceit. I want her bound to me not by chains but by joy. I want to give her the heavens to be free in so that when she returns I know she could kneel at any man’s feet but chooses mine out of all the men in the world. Yup, I'm with you there. Others, however, have different goals. In some cases I dislike them. In other cases, I find them morally reprehensible. In some cases, I might even find them legally actionable. But still, my goals for my life happiness our mine alone. I can only project them on other people when the laws of the land happen to coincide with my own viewpoints. In this case, however, I am not "making" them do anything other than to honor their own agreements and commitments and be law-abiding citizens in the country they choose to live in. quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael Part of the difficulty of all this is how we use language. Yeah, no doubt. Part in this case equates to about 99%. The language and terminology used in the BDSM sphere is notably nonsenical in a wide variety of ways. Sloppy wording leads to impossible questions with no right answer. quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael I push her to be a better person, not because I am a beacon of perfection but because I want her to be a better person. The respect comes in because I respect her enough to listen when she pushes me to be a better person as wel.l I do not fear her being strong or having an opinion, in fact I encourage her to be strong and to have opinions. She is bound to me not because I put a lock on her yesterday but because I inspired her today. She sees me allow someone else the last word, or share credit for an idea that was mine, or stop what I am doing to kneel down and give my full attention to her child. That is why she is bound to me. I am not alone in this, I know others who have bound their partner to them not by chains, not by manipulation, but by showing their partner how to be free and find joy and they are together because nothing makes them freer and more joyful than being together. I truly treasure those people and those friendships. All of which is fine and dandy and something I agree with. But again, there are LOTS of ways to bind someone. If two people want to be bound together in fear, anger and intimidation, I will avoid them but hey, it's their lives. So while I get what you're saying and, in fact, it's my style also, I don't reasonably see how it can be said to be inherently better or worse than some other style. Better and worse can only be evaluated in the context of a specific relationship.

SailingBum -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 2:37:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael Since people were so enjoying shredding my views on submissives I thought I would throw them some red meat they could really sink their teeth into. (note: I wrote this some time ago, the relationship I mentioned has morphed but as I think about it, how it has morphed more proves the point than undermines it) I just finished watching Braveheart for the 100th time and movies like that always make me weepy and sappy and evoke the need to write bad poetry. For some reason I got to thinking about the nature of dominance and ownership. Man up dude. Big boys don't cry BadOne

Cuffkinks -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 2:49:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael That doesn’t keep me from treating her in other darker ways but no matter how low I take her, at some point, I reach out to her and offer her my hand to lift her back up to stand proudly next to me. I push her to be a better person, not because I am a beacon of perfection but because I want her to be a better person. The respect comes in because I respect her enough to listen when she pushes me to be a better person as wel.l I do not fear her being strong or having an opinion, in fact I encourage her to be strong and to have opinions. She is bound to me not because I put a lock on her yesterday but because I inspired her today. She sees me allow someone else the last word, or share credit for an idea that was mine, or stop what I am doing to kneel down and give my full attention to her child. That is why she is bound to me. I am not alone in this, I know others who have bound their partner to them not by chains, not by manipulation, but by showing their partner how to be free and find joy and they are together because nothing makes them freer and more joyful than being together. I truly treasure those people and those friendships. Very well said Michael. As usual, I agree with most things you say. I don't know how long you've been back, but it's good to see you here again.

auburnvixen -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 3:32:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael Falconry is often related to D/s, the beautiful noble bird flying free and yet returning to the hand of the master is an appealing analogy. I think it is a perfect analogy for many who chest thump about being master/slave. Those falcons are let free only physically, their minds are chained and tethered to their owners. Not by the character of the master, not because they earned that loyalty, but because the falcon has been raised to believe that nourishment comes only from their owner. So they return only to be fed, not knowing they could nourish and sustain themselves. The chains that bind them are invisible to them and if revealed, the falcon would never return. That is neither mastery nor slavery as I use the words, that is fraud and deceit that keep those falcons bound to their owner. I strive to make my partner strong and free with no invisible chains, no fraud and deceit. I want her bound to me not by chains but by joy. I want to give her the heavens to be free in so that when she returns I know she could kneel at any man’s feet but chooses mine out of all the men in the world. That to me is mastery and slavery and possession. I enjoyed this post very much. I agree that the analogy of the falcon to D/s falls apart in this: "So they return only to be fed, not knowing they could nourish and sustain themselves. The chains that bind them are invisible to them and if revealed, the falcon would never return." I know that I can nourish and sustain myself, and though my chains are invisible, they are real to me because I forged them myself. I believe that the true value of my submission lies in those facts. The stronger and more self-sustaining I am capable of being, the more precious is my willingness to surrender all of that considerable power of self-esteem and self-sustenance to a Master. Fortunately I have been lucky enough in the past to find Masters who agree with this, so I know that they exist.

whiteslavebitch -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 7:02:50 PM)
Michael, That was simply one of the most beautiful posts I've ever read on these boards.[sm=champ.gif]

DesFIP -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 8:04:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: leadership527 All of which is fine and dandy and something I agree with. But again, there are LOTS of ways to bind someone. If two people want to be bound together in fear, anger and intimidation, I will avoid them but hey, it's their lives. So while I get what you're saying and, in fact, it's my style also, I don't reasonably see how it can be said to be inherently better or worse than some other style. Better and worse can only be evaluated in the context of a specific relationship. I'm not sure that you can't make a judgment here. Which style will produce a person who is more successful in life. Not career solely, but a more successful parent, a person who can resolve lifelong issues with family of origin, a person less bedeviled by their own demons and thus a better friend, lover, parent, adult child, sibling etc? The style that produces a person who functions better is inherently a better style.

beargonewild -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 8:13:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael I strive to make my partner strong and free with no invisible chains, no fraud and deceit. I want her bound to me not by chains but by joy. I want to give her the heavens to be free in so that when she returns I know she could kneel at any man’s feet but chooses mine out of all the men in the world. That to me is mastery and slavery and possession. In this manner which you stated I do agree you have not bound your submissive through deceit nor through fraud, yet she is bound to you and yes these chains are invisible. By this I mean you've taught her ways if living that she may not have seen before. She is bound to you through love, her own desires, from a deeper sense of wanting more and more of you. Yes you shown her how to live a more rich life by showing and pushing her to be more then what she thought possible, yet she in turn sees that is is good and wants more, knowing that this is good and desires it's continuation. Of course invisible chains will be forged between you and her. They are not chains created from non consensual abuse or negative experiences, they are forged from her seeing through you and your wants/needs and desires combined with the "gem" that you see in her. It is through your actions which these invisible chains are forged in her, and probably in many ways it inspires her to push herself to be the best she can be for you and for herself.

sistermargaret -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/3/2008 8:52:36 PM)
Lovely post. Thank You for making all of this just a bit more clear for this new subbie. sm All it takes is absolute surrender

tweedydaddy -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/4/2008 3:58:09 AM)
When the birdy flies off, your buggered.

missturbation -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/4/2008 4:16:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael I can own a book and never have to read it, never open its covers to discover its contents, never explore the deeper meanings or allow it to expand my mind. I truly own that book but so what? That ownership is meaningless in any way that matters. A child can own a book, a pompous ass can own a book as strongly and firmly as I. There is no reason to be proud of that sort of ownership. quote: Not true. There is, simply, pride of ownership. For instance, let's suppose the book in question is a rare copy of god-knows-what. Then someone might well have pride that they are able to own this thing when others cannot (perhaps material success?). The book in this case becomes a status symbol. I'm going to agree with Michael here. Whilst you are right about there being pride in owning a rare copy of a book for example i would call it false pride. Unless like Michael says you open that book, read its pages, discover it's content, its meaning its useless. It's just pride in having something rare which is never made use of. Things / people were made / created to reach their full potential, not to be wasted. quote: Falconry is often related to D/s, the beautiful noble bird flying free and yet returning to the hand of the master is an appealing analogy. I think it is a perfect analogy for many who chest thump about being master/slave. Those falcons are let free only physically, their minds are chained and tethered to their owners. Not by the character of the master, not because they earned that loyalty, but because the falcon has been raised to believe that nourishment comes only from their owner. So they return only to be fed, not knowing they could nourish and sustain themselves. The chains that bind them are invisible to them and if revealed, the falcon would never return. That is neither mastery nor slavery as I use the words, that is fraud and deceit that keep those falcons bound to their owner. On the second reading of this i get it and personally think it is a good analogy. The falcon believes it's only source of nourishment comes from it's owner and is not shown the world where it can feed itself or choose someone else to nourish it. Just as some slaves are encouraged to believe their only source of nourishment comes from their Master, it cannot be found elsewhere. quote: I strive to make my partner strong and free with no invisible chains, no fraud and deceit. I want her bound to me not by chains but by joy. I want to give her the heavens to be free in so that when she returns I know she could kneel at any man’s feet but chooses mine out of all the men in the world. To be given choices, not to be led to believe there is only one. *would it be ok if i keep a copy of this please?

missturbation -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/4/2008 4:20:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SailingBum quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael Since people were so enjoying shredding my views on submissives I thought I would throw them some red meat they could really sink their teeth into. (note: I wrote this some time ago, the relationship I mentioned has morphed but as I think about it, how it has morphed more proves the point than undermines it) I just finished watching Braveheart for the 100th time and movies like that always make me weepy and sappy and evoke the need to write bad poetry. For some reason I got to thinking about the nature of dominance and ownership. Man up dude. Big boys don't cry BadOne Maybe not.......................REAL men do though.

NorthernGent -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/4/2008 4:40:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael but by showing their partner how to be free I'll take my hat off to you, Mike, in the event you can show your partner "how to be free". The concept of freedom and the wherewithal to attain it, has been pondered over for centuries; as yet the magic ingredient remains illusive. Perhaps the OP is that which you rail against: a conjuring trick.

ExSteelAgain -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/4/2008 5:01:22 AM)
Yep, Michael, you express a view some of us on CM have. There is a core here who believes concern for a submissive is where domination begins. I take your idea of making her free as meaning you make her happy. Being able to keep someone happy in her role or in general gives you a power over her that isn’t contrived.

favesclava -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/4/2008 6:18:04 AM)
i almost skipped the post due to the first few sentences. i'm glad i kept reading. i enjoy the type of ownership that allows me to be me. to voice my opinions, to do my own thing. to disagree . i'm push to learn because i have a brain and i do enjoy learning different things.He lifts me up and lets me know i am a jewel and will not be taken for granted even if he does own me completely forever.

kiwisub12 -> RE: My thoughts on Mastery (10/4/2008 6:21:29 AM)
My Sir keeps me bound to him with his sensitivity, intelligence, playfulness and sadism. Not to mention the way we interact. There is no fear, no guilt and no manipulation (that i am aware of) in our relationship, and that is one of the major reasons i stay. ... well - that, and the fact that i love him. But the reason i love him is written above. Its almost circular reasoning - i stay because i love him, and i love him for the reasons stated, and so on and so on. Its like the line from that movie - he makes me want to be a better person!

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