A modest proposal (Full Version)

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January -> A modest proposal (8/3/2004 6:39:25 AM)

What if the collarme board wrote a "how-to" book on bdsm?

I've been thinking about an FAQ type book for awhile. It could have chapters like What is bdsm, First Meetings, Cyber, Tools, Roleplay, bdsm in Vanilla relationships, etc... The book would be along the lines of "Everything you wanted to know about sex but were afraid to ask", except instead of sex it would be bdsm. (Anybody remember that book?)

Most of the content for the book is already on the boards. collarme would just need a group of editors to pull all the brilliant advice together. collarme already has built in marketing (tons of traffic) and a built in client base (thousands of newbies/wannabes/curious) for such a book. The book could be downloaded from the site (yes, collarme could charge money for it--credit card or paypal?).

We have the resources here. There are plenty of geniuses on this board who can think, write and spell (yes, that includes DREAD; if you doubt it, just look at DREAD's latin. Not a letter out of place). All we'd need is collarme's interest and our desire.

So, what do you think, collarme? Would a book like that fit in your business plan?

What does the collarme board think?

January




Leonidas -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 6:56:29 AM)

I don't think that I'd have much that would be of use in such a book, but others here might. What you are describing will be a compilation, like Gloria Brame's book. For someone who wants a cookbook, as opposed to interaction here, there are a number of books out there already if they want to buy one.

In the old (pre-web) days, we noticed on the newsgroups that the same questions tended to get asked again and again. We started maintaining one or more FAQs on each group that answered those questions. The FAQ maintainer was responsible for watching the group and capturing good answers to questions that came up over and over and adding them to the FAQ. We were less tolerant in those pre AOL days when the average intelligence level on the 'net seemed to be a little higher, and the spectre of spam had yet to rear its head. After the FAQs started going up, questions often got answered with a terse RTFFAQ (Read The Fucking FAQ).

Take care of yourself

Leonidas




jillwfsub4blkdom -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 7:57:49 AM)

Not sure that paypal would be a source to use for receiving payment. They are continually shutting down the accounts for artists who use their service and have any type nudity in their drawings. They would probably freak over BDSM lol.

jill




FatherMichael -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 8:09:05 AM)

Leo's thinking is on the mark with the sticky-and often updated FAQ, put the link on the main board. That way folks who find their way here but are unsure of what they know or want to know can hit the 21 top questions already asked without shyness or other hangups getting in the way. Its not as sexy or a $ productive as a book but I suspect it would do more good.

and jill is right, pay-pal is one example, but the self-stylized cleanup artists who are going to rid the net of anything 'dirty' hit any main-stream business who caters (or helps promote even by helping the artists get paid) to anything not PG-13 or lighter. The moral-righteous are going to keep their internet clean...and try their damnest to make sure the rest of us bathe enough to be able to swim in their pool...which is why some of us build quiet-ladders so we can pee in it [:D]

if the point is money...do it the old fashioned way, take pictures, sell porn...if the point is education/help, then go with the FAQ model.




January -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 8:39:29 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL:
if the point is money...do it the old fashioned way, take pictures, sell porn...if the point is education/help, then go with the FAQ model.


Hmm. I've never considered education and profit to be mutually exclusive. But then again, I've never been one to think thoughtful suggestions deserve flippant replies, either.

In any case, a board FAQ would be a large undertaking. It would require not only people of integrity, and broad-mindedness, with experience and editing skills, but folks willing to do it. The "sexiness" (and prestige) of a book might be an inducement.

January




Leonidas -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 8:46:51 AM)

quote:

The "sexiness" (and prestige) of a book might be an inducement.


Absolutely. Many are motivated by the prestige factor. Being able to say that you are a published author on the subject would carry a cache that would be appealing, I'm sure. Being an FAQ maintainer is a notoriously thankless job. Good point, January.

Take care of yourself

Leonidas




ScorpioMaster -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 10:26:55 AM)

January the best book that is out there now is SM 101 by jay Wiseman. I recommend it to every one who is interested in the lifestyle. It is very basic and has some good pointers. I think a good book to think about doing a one about bdsm etiquettes. The does and don’t of being a subs/slave. How sub/slave is to carry your self or how to react when you meet a Dom /domme for the first time. Some book ideas could be how to reach on line going into a channel for the first time. The best approach to this idea is to figure out what books are out there and then write one something completely different.




Sinergy -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 10:32:13 AM)

quote:

Not sure that paypal would be a source to use for receiving payment. They are continually shutting down the accounts for artists who use their service and have any type nudity in their drawings. They would probably freak over BDSM lol.


I have heard that the best part of having paypal shut down your account is they will freeze your checking account tied to it until you prove in court that they should free it
up.

Could be wrong, but there ya go.

Sinergy




FatherMichael -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 10:45:54 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leonidas

quote:

The "sexiness" (and prestige) of a book might be an inducement.


Absolutely. Many are motivated by the prestige factor. Being able to say that you are a published author on the subject would carry a cache that would be appealing, I'm sure. Being an FAQ maintainer is a notoriously thankless job.



*rolling up sleeves*
*holding up palms in peace*

I have never started a fight in my life, without a hard left jab leading the way, if how I said anything was taken as disrepectful then let me correct the mistaken impression I left with the earlier post and add what I'm about to say to the above quote is meant as what it says, it is not a smarmy comeback hoping to provoke anger, insecurity or meanness.

Any expert on any subject writing from their own hubris is doing a injustice to themselves and to the subject matter. And I absolutely agree Leonidas, a FAQ collector is one of those jobs left on the net that stink and nobody will give you a clothespin for your nose.

but the point is to give people the information they need in a way they will actually read. There are several books on the topic and lifestyle available at any 1/2 decent bookstore in the country, and there is always amazon for those folks living in the Sticks. If its online it needs to be quick answers (as much as possible) to things people want to know, in a format they will read and feel comfortable with reading.

again no fight intended in the disagreement, I suspect if a fight ever breaks out, there won't be no doubt in the world a war just started. :) I odn't know what the cyber equivalant of offering to buy eveyrbody a beer and forgetting about it is...if someone will give a hint, I'll get the bartender pouring mugs.




Sundew02 -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 1:05:35 PM)

I have read many D/s books about the lifestyle, play, etc. all are good, and I enjoyed them. BUT they are just the authors opinion. As would a book written here on collarme. Unless you know of a way to get a concensus of opinion as to definitions, the need for this or that to ensure safe play whatever, the "book" would be just the opinion of the more vocal or the moderators. You would also run the risk of skewing the view of some who would otherwise find a Dom/me or sub that would learn together and have a companionable relationship learning their definition of D/s. Sundew




darkinshadows -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 1:51:36 PM)

Greetings to everyone... I hope the day is finding You all well and happy!

If something(if anything) is needed... it would simply be a list of the best books or how to videos available. There are many books...SM101... StR,GMtT... et al... out here and yes, from time to time a new book will be published. I know that for people who have been around on this site a while probably see the same threads rising up all the time... but isnt that the most interesting thing? When a thread pops up... then people are able to re-express their personal thoughts and feelings, even to the extent of being able to say... 'hey... my feelings have changed!'...or... 'well last time... I couldnt add to that thread... but I have moved on since then and now I can!'

Sometimes it can be a little disheartening to ask a question on a messageboard only to be told... 'go look at the faq'... or... 'check out this thread here... we've done it before... no good going over it again'. Everyone starts somewhere and sometimes... people even need refreshing... If someones been brave enough to take the first steps in asking... the least people can do(IMO) is to be open and receptive - show them the link to the old posts and offer some new ones.




topcat -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 6:07:28 PM)

Midear January-

I would propose, having read everyone elses reponses, an 'archive' section on the board, where posts that are felt to be worth keeping on top would be transfered, and perhaps edited for fluff and non topic responces.

I'd bet that Proud could come up with the top ten cross links to start off the top of her head.

Stay warm,
Lawrence




proudsub -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 7:39:57 PM)

quote:

I'd bet that Proud could come up with the top ten cross links to start off the top of her head.


LOL
If someone wants to list the topics i can list links. But i leave fri for a 7 day cruise so it would have to be when i get back. Dang i'm gonna miss these boards, will be hard to catch up when i get back.




MistressDREAD -> RE: A modest proposal (8/3/2004 11:18:18 PM)

[Looks to Janauary................Shhhushhh I like being ignorant! Its nice to know others speak Latin even hey can We turn from english to latin on here ?? Then I can bitch at every one that dont speak or write it how they mis spell and pronounce it!! and Id always be the right One ..... ~wicked giggles~]

All good things start with a idea

Id stick up My nose at anyone whom would tempt to crush Your ideas and if sincere
Im sure there are many here whom would be willing to give sum of their selfs for such
a project, after all projects are fun and there is always the self satisfation of sumthing well done one can boast about being a part of in the end!

of course there would be the issue of Collarme copywrites so that free Laywers info would help in such a case or those here whom have such experiance and willing to
donate. a book to first print if all editing is done by its Own folks runs about 3,000 for a minamal print on a independant company 10,000 for a name brand company US funds. Id say the first stage of such an indevor would not be what its contents would be as that can be hashed out but the income in which to bring it to a reality. [ This is a * free site hence no real income comming in for such projects............any good permoters out there? Maybe sum nonprofit writers whom can search and find funds?] There are a whole lot of big BDSM and Freedom of Info and Freedom of sex and such out there looking always for funds from its members. Maybe a funds drive is in order for such an indevor. Just random thoughts being thrown out here.........

If it is simply to bring the info of the top 10 for more easy access Id hate to say it but the Two Gentlement Leo and Father are correct that the Ol Fact section would be an option but as you can see many are good at suggestions but dont desire to commit of self nessisarily as I beleive it is allready known by most of Us * Oldies that it is truly a very time consuming project to keep up and the amount of folks that would commit to anything online is iffie at best. Remember 4 months ago I said that this site would run into this problem of the repetitive information thing and that is why I brought up sum issues to get the rules more defined here so that such things might not become a burden here for the Mods. { I know I have a weird way of getting things done but My way serves purpose and theres always a method to My madness. Besides I was in need of a break and a ban makes Me take it! ~wicked giggles~}

I like your way of thought January even if it is in a very young stage of thought. It shows you have a desire and care for that which We Live and beleive and are not to old that you are willing to commit to more then just Your Own needs....... I know what its like to have information out there both online and in the real world and whats involved in order to get it out to the folks that need it. Especially if it goes against the grain or is a practice not condoned by all. Sit at any county or city councils meeting and try getting your licencing for a adult BDSM store or Dungeion I can tell You it aint fun if You are not in a Major City here in the US. Especially in the bible belt all tho thats a changein with the inseption of the religious kinkie folks but even they have differing views compaired to the majority.

When a site is free it has to be kept as simple as possible. If its to be kept free all the things that are a undesired aspect of such a thing has to be tolerated because freedom comes at a price. For here that means putting up with the newbies that dont read the rules first and ask repeatitive questions and the advos and trolls. Maybe sumthing added to the rules in the opening of all the area which permotes the new members to set their settings to the 365 days and read all the present info befor posting questions that might be repetitive. Hmmmmm another option is to really burden the Mods and have them move posts that are repetitive to the area that there are allready long posts on the same issue. This is where the facts board would come in handy with the top 10.

OK enough babbling as Leo calls it........JMO[:-]




basiasubrosa -> RE: A modest proposal (8/6/2004 3:41:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressDREAD
Its nice to know others speak Latin even hey can We turn from english to latin on here ?? Then I can bitch at every one that dont speak or write it how they mis spell and pronounce it!! and Id always be the right One ..... ~wicked giggles~]


Mistress DREAD, if you want to start a Latin forum, i would be most obliged. Desperately need practice here. [:(]

Vale!




MistressDREAD -> RE: A modest proposal (8/6/2004 4:03:21 AM)

hahaha ohhh vale [8|] studies getting behind?

I can see collarme really pulling their hair out
if I were to do that............ especially if I were
to start to post My erotic sadistic lifestyle stories
here in it...........hmmmmmm now thats a thought
to inspire the practice more into latin.......ahhh if
I only had more then 24 hours in a day to do all
I do [:o]




LadyAngelika -> RE: A modest proposal (8/6/2004 5:22:40 AM)

quote:

What if the collarme board wrote a "how-to" book on bdsm?


January,

First of all, let me tell you that in principle, I admire your idea. The idea of a compilation is an interesting one. However, as an educator, I see these message boards as a better educational tool then a book. Let me explain why.

One of the most prominent theories in educational cybersystemics is Pask’s conversation theory. The gist of it that learning occurs through conversations about a certain subject or topic and it is the conversation itself that makes the knowledge explicit. Pask would call the boards the entailment mesh that captures all of the information.

In the educational field, many have done exactly what you are proposing. However, the ventures tend to be less successful for the learners using the compilation rather then the learners interacting with others on the subject matter.

Here are the three principles of conversation theory and how I see them applied on these boards:

1. To learn a subject matter, students must learn the relationships among the concepts.
Well that is the beautiful thing about anything online. Information is connected in a rhizome manner and relationships become more evident. The moderators have created sections, move the content around and we cross-reference one another. Two examples that come to mind are when proudsub refers someone to another conversation on the topic and as well, something I’ve been doing lately, adding a hyperlink to a site regarding the subject matter I’m discussing. In addition, there are such diverse opinions here. It is amazing to see them juxtaposed in context.

2. Explicit explanation or manipulation of the subject matter facilitates understanding (e.g., use of teachback technique).
This happens through the discussion, through asking questions, by saying such things like “If I understand you correctly, you are saying that…”. It is also how when 3 months down the road I refer something to another that someone else has taught me. In fact I had my little proudsub moment lately when I referred someone to another thread.

3. Individual's differ in their preferred manner of learning relationships (serialists versus holists).
I think this is the beauty of this medium. It is self-paced, exploratory, interactive and dynamic. Someone can be an active or passive learner, etc.

I do agree that some people have an easier time extracting the information from these boards then others. But then, as we all know, there have always been discrepancies in people’s ability to learn. Some are very successful as self-learners and others need a whole lot of assistance.

Where our expertise lies here is how to communicate on message boards, how to search topics on message boards, for the most part, etiquette on message boards (I’ve learned quite a bit about that in the little while I’ve been here – thanks all btw), etc. It’s quite the metacognitive approach and in opinion, a very useful approach which goes beyond learning about BDSM but also about interacting.

As it stands we informally help others. I’m a very big believer in informal education and I find this is a fantastic way to deal with a subject matter such as BDSM that has so many various facets, aspects and opinions regarding it. There are many how too books out there. This is another alternative which, for me, is a lot more useful then a how-to book because it obliges me to confront my own ideas, suppositions and perceptions on the subject of BDSM, which would boil down to a more meaningful learning experience.

- LA




Sinergy -> RE: A modest proposal (8/6/2004 5:26:25 AM)

quote:

I have never started a fight in my life, without a hard left jab leading the way,


We teach "defensive counterattack" in my classes.

Basically, the student has to set a verbal boundary, and if this is crossed, the fight is on.

Since the one who wins a fight is generally the first solid hit, best not to let the other person hit first...

Last fight I was actually in was when I was 15...

Sinergy




MistressDREAD -> RE: A modest proposal (8/6/2004 5:31:20 AM)

quote:


I’m a very
big believer in
informal education
and I find this is
a fantastic way
to deal with a
subject matter
such as BDSM
that has so many
various facets,
aspects and
opinions regarding
it.

AMEN!! LA!




LadyAngelika -> RE: A modest proposal (8/6/2004 10:39:09 AM)

quote:

I can see collarme really pulling their hair out
if I were to do that............ especially if I were
to start to post My erotic sadistic lifestyle stories
here in it...........


Here is another thing. Would the stories be put into the how-to guide? They are so valid in terms of understanding BDSM dynamics. Stories were all I had before I discovered a community. And speaking of community, how do we communicate that through a book?

Just questions I have...

- LA




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