RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (Full Version)

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Venatrix -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:15:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

quote:

If I could leave, I'd do it in a heartbeat. 


Why can't you?  Last time I checked; there were planes, boats, and busses leaving the country at all hours of the day. 

quote:

First, one has to have the desire to be taught.  I believe the old expression about not being able to teach a pig to sing applies here.   


I went to college because I desired a degree.  I didn't desire indoctrination, and that is what a large number of academics are dedicated towards accomplishing.  The old expression, "Those who can't....teach." applies there. 



Your first comment is remarkably ignorant.  You clearly know nothing of other countries' immigration laws.  Before you say something so ridiculous, perhaps you ought to do your research.  Taken in context with your second remark, all you've done is prove my point that Americans, as a rule, are very proud of being ignorant.  I've read your posts before; you've never said anything that is likely to make me change my mind,



Venatrix -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:18:27 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Venatrix

FR - I've lived in the US for 32 years ... If I could leave, I'd do it in a heartbeat.


   Lack of freedom and economic opportunity, back home?  There are plainly marked exits all over the place. 



Umm, no.  But thank you for making completely false assumptions, and thereby showing *your* ignorance.  I was born in the US, but raised in the UK.  If I were still eligible for residency, I'd have moved back there decades ago. 

Edited to add: if you're not feeling a bit foolish right now, you probably should be.



Venatrix -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:21:46 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: bluepanda

You weren't speaking to me, but I've got an answer anyway. It's not a question of finding a country that has no faults - it's a question of finding someplace that has different faults, a set of faults  that you don't find as bothersome as America's faults. It's pretty much the same thing as finding a partner for a relationship, really.



Yes.  That's exactly it.



slaveboyforyou -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:27:32 AM)

quote:

Your first comment is remarkably ignorant.  You clearly know nothing of other countries' immigration laws.  Before you say something so ridiculous, perhaps you ought to do your research.  Taken in context with your second remark, all you've done is prove my point that Americans, as a rule, are very proud of being ignorant.  I've read your posts before; you've never said anything that is likely to make me change my mind,


I'm fully aware of the bureaucracy involved with immigrating to another country.  It's still not impossible, but I seriously doubt that you actually want to leave.  I know it's hip amongst the pretentious, faux intellectual set to deride the lack of sophistication in the States.  But the fact remains that leaving here is not impossible.  All you need is a little money and the motivation.  If you believe it to be impossible, than you are the one who seems to be ignorant.  People do it everyday. 

My second comment was rooted in my own experiences with higher education.  You can deny it all you want, universities are overwhelmingly staffed with Leftists.  Other points of view are not welcomed in classrooms.  If you don't know that, you are being ignorant. 




TheHeretic -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:41:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Venatrix

If I were still eligible for residency, I'd have moved back there decades ago. 

Edited to add: if you're not feeling a bit foolish right now, you probably should be.



         Got kicked out of the country, huh?  Did it involve soccer fans by any chance?  That's a great bunch of sophisticates right there.  [:D]

     (And now I'm just being silly, huh?)

  



Dnomyar -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:48:16 AM)

There is another post on here about Wales. Good reading.



Irishknight -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:49:38 AM)

There is a reason that people don't listen to many self proclaimed intellectuals.  It is something I was taught by my father many years ago.  Those who proclaim their intelligence the loudest are almost always lacking in that area.  Those who truly are intellectuals will wait until you ask them the questions to answer. 
I don't need someone to tell me that I am mediocre because I don't have the same pieces of paper as they do.  I dropped out of college with straight A's.  I chose to follow a different path.  I know college professors who cannot do basic math without a calculator and who cannot write a simple letter at a 10th grade level.  I've had to go to college to explain to demonstrate that a friend of mine had been 100% correct in his report when he was informed by a supposed scholar that his facts were wrong.   One should actually have read at least one book on a subject before telling someone else that they are allowed to grade their research.  I've seen a genius argue that a fish in an aquarium was a catfish when the labeling even said "piranha."  Yet he had a genius rated IQ.
My experience with academia has been that of lazy, bigotted, and self righteous "academics" who think that we should listen to what they have to say.  Add to that people who need directions to wipe their asses because they are too busy analyzing the exact number of sheets of toilet paper and the consistency of their own feces and you shouldn't need to wonder why American "academics" and self professed intellectuals get ignored in this country.
If the "geniuses" would come down from their silicon towers and stop looking down at the rest of us, there might be a mixing of the breeds that would create less mediocrity all over the world.  There are plenty of people who want to share knowledge and to learn from others.  They are just seen by the elite as too stupid or not worth the time.



Venatrix -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:51:06 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

quote:

Your first comment is remarkably ignorant.  You clearly know nothing of other countries' immigration laws.  Before you say something so ridiculous, perhaps you ought to do your research.  Taken in context with your second remark, all you've done is prove my point that Americans, as a rule, are very proud of being ignorant.  I've read your posts before; you've never said anything that is likely to make me change my mind,


I'm fully aware of the bureaucracy involved with immigrating to another country.  It's still not impossible, but I seriously doubt that you actually want to leave.  I know it's hip amongst the pretentious, faux intellectual set to deride the lack of sophistication in the States.  But the fact remains that leaving here is not impossible.  All you need is a little money and the motivation.  If you believe it to be impossible, than you are the one who seems to be ignorant.  People do it everyday. 

My second comment was rooted in my own experiences with higher education.  You can deny it all you want, universities are overwhelmingly staffed with Leftists.  Other points of view are not welcomed in classrooms.  If you don't know that, you are being ignorant. 



Oh, I'm very serious about leaving.  I've been applying for visas for years and I clearly state in my profile that I am only interested in European men who actually live in Europe.  Although admittedly, that is mostly because I prefer European men.

I taught at a well regarded Catholic university in the Northeast.  I've never been in such a reactionary institution in my life.  I can guarantee you that any opinion that wasn't far to the right was unwelcome.  I once found a student outside my office door in tears; the other students were making her life miserable because she was in a mixed-race relationship.  Hmm.  So much for liberal ideas pervading our university campuses.  Perhaps your point of view wasn't welcomed in the classroom because the instructors found it hard to take your point of view seriously?  Only they would be able to say. 



cloudboy -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:51:08 AM)

PALIN phenomenon follows the suit of the Republican party for being anti-intellectual and ideological -- but the new twist is the added factor of fundamentalist religion.

Her nomnimation has hurt McCain more than it has helped it.

According to polls Palin has turned off virtually all educated voters.



Irishknight -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:54:04 AM)

Venatrix, you are describing a religious institution.  All I can say about the teasing and harrassing of that poor student is ... duh.  Of course a religious institution is going to be close minded to any other viewpoints.  Religion always fights against different beliefs.



Venatrix -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:56:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: Venatrix

If I were still eligible for residency, I'd have moved back there decades ago. 

Edited to add: if you're not feeling a bit foolish right now, you probably should be.


        Got kicked out of the country, huh?  Did it involve soccer fans by any chance?  That's a great bunch of sophisticates right there.  [:D]

    (And now I'm just being silly, huh?)

 


Yes, actually, you are.  But you've been silly right along, so a bit more probably won't hurt.  And on that note, I shall bid you a pleasant day.  As much as I enjoy seeing other people prove my point, I have work to do.



LaTigresse -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 8:59:13 AM)

I also, would move in a heartbeat if I could. Several years ago I was in the process of it. It was possible at that time. Now, not so much so.

I feel much more at home in a more European setting than I do here. Here, our priorities have gotten all out of wack.



angelikaJ -> RE: Joe Sixpack... (10/13/2008 9:09:57 AM)

Alcoholism: the new family value



slaveboyforyou -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 9:41:29 AM)

quote:

Oh, I'm very serious about leaving.  I've been applying for visas for years and I clearly state in my profile that I am only interested in European men who actually live in Europe.  Although admittedly, that is mostly because I prefer European men.


Good luck with that.  I like women; I really don't care what their nationality is. 

quote:

I taught at a well regarded Catholic university in the Northeast.  I've never been in such a reactionary institution in my life.  I can guarantee you that any opinion that wasn't far to the right was unwelcome.  I once found a student outside my office door in tears; the other students were making her life miserable because she was in a mixed-race relationship.  Hmm.  So much for liberal ideas pervading our university campuses.  Perhaps your point of view wasn't welcomed in the classroom because the instructors found it hard to take your point of view seriously?  Only they would be able to say.  


Wow, one example.  I attended two universities.  One was a large public university, and one was a small liberal arts university.  I graduated with a 3.8 GPA, and I did that without hardly trying at all.  I didn't go there to have a soapbox.  I went, achieved my goal, then promptly left.  I really didn't care if my viewpoint was welcome or not.  It's called independent thinking. 



bipolarber -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 9:45:54 AM)

The only way I would give up on living in the US is if they made me leave at gunpoint. Why not? They already thought about putting GLBT folk in concentration camps during the AIDS crisis under Reagan.  Is it so impossible to believe, with the coming great depression that the republicans might try to scapegoat minorities again? After all, it worked before...



slvemike4u -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 10:11:44 AM)

Venatrix I do not believe for a minute that "Americans as a rule,are very proud of being ignorant.As a matter of fact being ignorant is usually something one is unaware of....sort of what makes one ignorant...otherwise one wouldn't be ignorant!
Now if you had claimed that a significant portion of the population fear a politician that exhibits a higher level of understanding of the issues,and isn't afraid to demonstrate that,you might have had a leg to stand on.A large segment of Americans do seem to be more comfortable with their elected leaders being no brighter then themselves...but I believe that comes from a mistaken belief that such an individual can more readily identify with them and their problems.
Hopefully Bush has disabused a large enough segment of the population of this fallacy....and the electorate will choose more wisely this time around.......



meatcleaver -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 10:14:55 AM)

General point.

I wasn't asking where is the best place to live, Europe or America, we all have our preferences and I wasn't asking where the best men are or my interest, where the best women are. But just in case you might doubt my taste, I prefer women who have a head, two arms and two legs (preferably long), sorry to those women that have a problem in that department. As for language and accent, they don't have to be able to talk, just understand the rules and what they're told.[:D]

I just wanted to know if you thought the scholar I heard on the radio had a point or not and whether she was elitist.



slaveboyforyou -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 10:24:41 AM)

quote:

I just wanted to know if you thought the scholar I heard on the radio had a point or not and whether she was elitist.


I think she is making a prejudicial overgeneralization about American voters.  I've seen those same street interviews, and I know it's not an honest cross section of American voters.  I know the reporters that do stories like that have an agenda from the beginning.  I don't trust that they include all the people they talk to, and it's well known that they edit those interviews out of context.  She knows that too, and she's using it as ammuntion to push her viewpoints.  It is elitist, and it's dishonest. 



meatcleaver -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 10:32:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

quote:

I just wanted to know if you thought the scholar I heard on the radio had a point or not and whether she was elitist.


I think she is making a prejudicial overgeneralization about American voters.  I've seen those same street interviews, and I know it's not an honest cross section of American voters.  I know the reporters that do stories like that have an agenda from the beginning.  I don't trust that they include all the people they talk to, and it's well known that they edit those interviews out of context.  She knows that too, and she's using it as ammuntion to push her viewpoints.  It is elitist, and it's dishonest. 


I think she was just as angry with the politicians for their willingness to dumb down, maybe more so. I missed the beginning of the interview which is annoying but I recognize the same sort of voter that we have here. The difference is and I suppose this could be to do with different electoral systems, is that the politicians of the main parties tend not dumb the debate down. That being said, far right candidates have proved quite happy to dumb the debate down in order to get votes from the stupid.



Termyn8or -> RE: Palin and Joe Sixpack. (10/13/2008 11:24:54 AM)

Man on the street interview :

Reporter : If you have a minute, what do you think of the bailout plan ?

Man on the street : I think we should take our medicine now before going another trillion in debt and let the suits get in the unemployment line like everybody else.

Won't get aired.

Acadamia, oh yeah, we need to show alot of respect, people who can't change a flat tire teaching future automotive engineers. Mistakes in textbooks. Attitudes and personal agendas that professors have never been taught to discard and speak the raw truth.

Chris Rock : What's the capital of Zimbabwe ?

Man on the street "I don't know that shit, I'm keepin it real".

As much as I can't stand Howard Stern, the one thing he did I liked was his man on the street interviews. Hilarious, as well as enriching, I mean they really made one feel smart.

Grant me the serenity to accept those things I cannot change
And the ignorance to be happy about it.

Vena, don't listen to these love it or leave it people. I am going to stay and bitch about it until someone listens. I was born here and have considered leaving, but I too have trouble finding somewhere I would want to go. Austrailia used to look very good until they instituted gun control. I would only leave my country for one thing - true freedom, and at that point would hope that I would be able to handle it. Because true freedom means to actually be solely responsible for one's own survival, very few in the modern world have experienced it.

And people, stop calling each other ignorant. I know some truly ignorant people and believe me they are not here being called ignorant. They are playing video games, they don't come to a forum like this. When they get online they go to Netflix and vegetate in front of the screen.

Ignorance is a certain flavor of stupidity which propogates itself because the ignorant think or feel, or in some way believe that they know all they need to know. Whether or not they think they know everything has not been ascertained. However participation in a forum such as this and being truly ignorant are near mutually exclusive. Believe me, I know some really ignorant people.

T



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