quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama
But there is never any automatic connection between these "information sessions" and what will happen in play, unless I think the fantasy is hot or the idea is a good one.

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ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

This kind of thing really grinds my gears.    I am very VERY up front about who I am and what I am like, and when someone tries to drop  those heavy hints, I get turned off. 

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ORIGINAL: MsBriarRose
My boy asks permission before using the bathroom. It is one of the ways his submission manifests. I did not request it, and it would not be something I would normally ask. I allow him to offer this to me as a tribute. I do not police it, I would say nothing if he failed. But now that he has offered it to me it also gives me a way to measure his continued devotion.

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ORIGINAL: AAkasha


When you are in the early stages of flirtation or moving from vanilla to kink with a man, if he "helpfully" offers up rules in the form of innocent protocol questions, do you indulge him in those rules because you can tell he *wants* or *needs* those rules for his own satisfaction and nurturing, or do you dismiss any offers for protocol if they were merely 'helpful suggestions' or 'innocent clarification'?

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ShaktiSama:
I enjoy hearing about a man's fantasies and ideas.  But there is never any automatic connection between these "information sessions" and what will happen in play, unless I think the fantasy is hot or the idea is a good one.

I get pleasure and I can deepen the relationship with the intimacy of sharing, and the vulnerability that accompanies the act of offering up these very private thoughts to me.  And then perhaps later I might get a little extra pleasure by putting a nasty twist on some element of an old familiar fantasy.  Nothing makes it more obvious that I am in control than making these threadbare fantasies new, unfamiliar and scary-sexy in some way that he would never have imagined.


undergroundsea:
I favor this approach.  The response is not based on where the idea came from, but instead on whether an idea is a good one that contributes to the D/s dynamic.

As for how appropriate or not it is for a sub to make such suggestions, I recognize that there is a grey area and there can be scenarios that could be inappropriate or annoying.  Assuming genuine intentions, such behavior could be indicative of need for more communication about relationship expectations and intensity, and D/s rituals to sustain the feeling of the roles.

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ORIGINAL: ElanSubdued

ShaktiSama and undergroundsea,

It surprises me not that you expressed views I would have myself.  For posterity, I quote you both.

quote:

ShaktiSama:
I enjoy hearing about a man's fantasies and ideas.  But there is never any automatic connection between these "information sessions" and what will happen in play, unless I think the fantasy is hot or the idea is a good one.

I get pleasure and I can deepen the relationship with the intimacy of sharing, and the vulnerability that accompanies the act of offering up these very private thoughts to me.  And then perhaps later I might get a little extra pleasure by putting a nasty twist on some element of an old familiar fantasy.  Nothing makes it more obvious that I am in control than making these threadbare fantasies new, unfamiliar and scary-sexy in some way that he would never have imagined.


undergroundsea:
I favor this approach.  The response is not based on where the idea came from, but instead on whether an idea is a good one that contributes to the D/s dynamic.

As for how appropriate or not it is for a sub to make such suggestions, I recognize that there is a grey area and there can be scenarios that could be inappropriate or annoying.  Assuming genuine intentions, such behavior could be indicative of need for more communication about relationship expectations and intensity, and D/s rituals to sustain the feeling of the roles.

Elan.

quote:

The post wasn't about the discussion of desires and fantasies, which I am all in favor of. It's about a submissive specifically asking if a rule should be in place, rather than waiting for the femdom to make the rules.  In addition to the examples I gave in the first post, I'll add things like "I took the liberty of inserting a butt plug before emailing you to show my submission," or showing up to a first date/coffee in panties and letting the lady know he did it not because he was told, but because he assumed she would like it or those were the rules.

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I agree with bamabbwsub's post pretty much entirely:  I'm also not a Domina, but am intelligent, oft stubborn, and submissive. I, too, would suggest you 'lay down the law,' as it were, and in no uncertain terms, let him know these suggestions irk you.

I would also suggest that when discussing the matter, tell him you realize he wants something more from you and make him confront his desires and express them openly to you.  Personally, I'm am decidedly a fan of these sorts of rules, but at some point I recognized that instead of trying to prompt for things I want, it usually works better to first understand just what it is I desire, and then courteously inform of my desires.

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I have a simple policy with new pets.  You have to follow my rules.  I will probably not tell you what they are, you willl have to be patient and find out.  The good news is I will not fault you the FIRST time you make a mistake, because that is the time you find out about the rule.  Over questioning me is trying to determine my bnehaviour and lock me into a mode of behaviour.  This will not be tolerated.

quote:

My boy asks permission before using the bathroom.  It is one of the ways his submission manifests.  I did not request it, and it would not be something I would normally ask.  I allow him to offer this to me as a tribute.  I do not police it, I would say nothing if he failed.  But now that he has offered it to me it also gives me a way to measure his continued devotion.