RE: Any atheists here?

RE: Any atheists here? (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid

Message

Kirata -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/15/2008 11:33:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: HagiaSophia How can something that originates within us, because of us, be a "higher power"? Well, if life and the universe is deity manifest, then... deity was born into human form in your body and grew up with your experiences... and is "you". K.

NormalOutside -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/15/2008 11:36:51 PM)
(duplicate, sorry)

lilabbotsfordgrl -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/15/2008 11:37:42 PM)
Agnostic also. Possibly could be labelled "weak atheist" as mentioned by someone else above, but agnostic works fine. There's no evidence of any spiritual being, but HUGE evidence that religion is violent, closed-minded, and harmful to us all.

Kirata -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 1:23:46 AM)
Hi Rabbit, "Weak atheism" sounds, well, weak. Since most of the nominal Atheists posting to this thread seem to have justifiable issues with religion, maybe a better term would be Areligionists. Lumping together a consideration of deity with religion just buys into the religionist claim that there's a connection. As for the matter of proof, that argument has never impressed me. You can prove the existence of something greater (not otherwise defined) to yourself. You just can't prove it to anybody else. Be well, Kirata

atypicalsub -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 1:45:50 AM)
"Religion is what happens when spirituality falls into the wrong hands." -- Joseph Campell, "The Power of Myth" --

Kirata -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 1:50:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL meatcleaver When I see a pink elephant dacing on my fence, I might start beliving it exists, until then, it doesn't and is irrelevent. Claiming that something doesn't exist because your mommy didn't bring it to you on silver platter is not an attitude to take pride in publishing. When more than one person tells you that it's really there, that you have to learn to see it, that you have to learn to focus, there is nothing pragmatic or logical about saying, "Fuck off, I don't want to do the work." K.

NorthernGent -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 2:03:00 AM)
Though I'm partial to a spot of creative thinking, it has to be underpinned by at least some form of logic and evidence; it follows thus I simply can't stretch to the belief in a god. I'm not particularly enamoured with Athiesm, nor am I spiritual; quite frankly, I do not care whether or not a god/higher purpose exists. I'm not sure where I sit - perhaps somewhere along the existentialist or humanist school of thought - I make my own purpose in life, which can be as uplifting or depressing as a person wishes to make it. One final thought on a popular misconception: you don't have to be spiritual or god fearing to marvel at the world around you.

meatcleaver -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 3:21:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL meatcleaver When I see a pink elephant dacing on my fence, I might start beliving it exists, until then, it doesn't and is irrelevent. Claiming that something doesn't exist because your mommy didn't bring it to you on silver platter is not an attitude to take pride in publishing. When more than one person tells you that it's really there, that you have to learn to see it, that you have to learn to focus, there is nothing pragmatic or logical about saying, "Fuck off, I don't want to do the work." K. One learns by discovery through experience, research and exploration, not because mommy sent you to church on Sundays and told if you aren't a good boy and don't believe in a god invented by a stone age tribe, he will have you burn in hell for eternity. Which I think is the sort of blind faith you are alluding to.

meatcleaver -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 3:31:42 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata quote: ORIGINAL meatcleaver When I see a pink elephant dacing on my fence, I might start beliving it exists, until then, it doesn't and is irrelevent. Claiming that something doesn't exist because your mommy didn't bring it to you on silver platter is not an attitude to take pride in publishing. When more than one person tells you that it's really there, that you have to learn to see it, that you have to learn to focus, there is nothing pragmatic or logical about saying, "Fuck off, I don't want to do the work." K. Oh and when 1 billion people would tell me god is a catholic, 500 million would say he is protestant, 1 billion would say god is a muslim and 12 million would say he is the god of the Jews and never mentioned anything in response to the previous and then Budhists would say god is bollocks or just part of ego and desire which is my way of thinking I suppose (maybe that was just Budha rather than Bhudist). Since most religions are about self confirmation as opposed to revelation, a modicum of rational inquiry would lead one to believe, they all talk bollocks. And don't you just luuuuv how they tolerate each other and accuse each other of being the devil incarnate for corrupting the word of god who just happens to only speak through their direct line. Where's my god mommy, I want one too?! My final word on this subject as it is too silly for words.

colouredin -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 3:45:09 AM)
FR I loved some of Rynds considerations in Fountianhead, the marvel of what human beiungs can create, the beauty of it all, not that it takes away form nature just that they are both beautiful and the implication that due to that humans are pretty amazing. Im a fairly spiritual person, I take bits from faiths i like and ignore the structure of religion, I have no idea if there is a god or not maybe there are 50 of them running around. I think having faith in people is a pretty cool thing, i believe that people are generally good, not all are all the time people make mistakes but thats my belief, I think that people can do amazing things and I have faith in that. I find atheism a bit too cynical for me. As you cant prove or disprove it, i just tend to think athism comes from negative experiance in life but its each to their own

meatcleaver -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 5:35:54 AM)
Beauty is a human construct so its not surprising that we label things as beautiful or ugly or whatever depending on how we experience them, it has nothing to do with cosmic truth. The same is true of spiritual experience, it is a human construct, it is a human explanation to a human response. The fact that spiritual feelings can be induced in humans artificially should tell us spiritual feelings are no more exceptional than the taste of sugar in the mouth when one eats candy.

colouredin -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 6:37:33 AM)
You know what I figure Meatcleaver. Life is hard, loads of shit happens we get hurt and sad tragedy hits us and sometimes things suck. Every person has a way to get themselves through that whether its eating a giant tub of ice cream when someone breaks up with you or saying 'god has a plan' when you loose your job. Sure we can pick holes, question it and apply logic to everything. However there is no proof either way and if it makes people happy then who cares? If our opinions are shaped by society how do we know what creates society? We dont know whats a cosmic truth and what isnt, no matter how much people apply logic to ideas of faith there will always be a theological route out of it, and why? Because we just dont know. We all have to find our own path through life, our own way to get through it all, your way is no better than mine and mine is no better than yours, problem is what does it achieve trying to rip peoples coping machanisms apart? Does it make you feel better about your own beliefs? Doesnt that say more about you than them.

meatcleaver -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 7:49:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: colouredin If our opinions are shaped by society how do we know what creates society? We humans create society. quote: ORIGINAL: colouredin We dont know whats a cosmic truth and what isnt, no matter how much people apply logic to ideas of faith there will always be a theological route out of it, and why? Because we just dont know. Surely one can't apply logic to faith and though faiths claim to know the truth through some sort of cosmic direct line to god, they obviously don't. If there is a truth, no one has the first idea what it is so it is rather irrelevent, which is my point. Though I agree with your implication that faith is a crutch and it is for people who want to remain ignorant of the universe they inhabit by inventing an imaginary one. I've said enough on this thread.

MarsBonfire -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 8:16:29 AM)
I'm more of Deist. I think there is a God or Gods out there, responsible for the universe. But, I really don't think any of mankind's religions comes close to the reality of who/what God(s) is/are, nor what their "plan" or intent is. I believe most of man's religions to be based on "making shit up" to make himself feel better... that somehow, after you die, the universe will be a better place. You'll be rewarded, while the people who've been fucking you over will be punished horribly for all eternity. Kinda immature, don't you think? "The universe is not only stranger than we imagine, it's stranger than we can imagine." -anon.

Kirata -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 10:48:51 AM)
There's a difference between saying there is something greater, and presuming to dogmatically iterate precisely what it is and what it wants for dinner on Friday. One of my favorite tales is of a Buddhist monk who begged of his Abbot the best way to teach the truths of the Sutras, and received the answer: "Burn them." K.

meatcleaver -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 11:03:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata There's a difference between saying there is something greater, and presuming to dogmatically iterate precisely what it is and what it wants for dinner on Friday. I think it is self evident that there is something greater than us, we have evolved to inhabit a minute niche in a vast universe that we are unlikely ever to understand. Jumping from there to a belief in something conscious driving the universe is a huge leap of faith and I think that is where we came in. For if some conscious entity created the universe, you are back to the same problem we have now, who created that conscious entity and so on and so forth. The very idea is irrelevent to our situation and we can better rely on our experience in dealing with problems we face rather than an imaginary being or thing or consciousness.

Kirata -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 11:05:07 AM)
Actually, many of our perceptions and preferences appear to be hard-wired, despite the conceit that our cultures "invented" them. But leaving that aside, if we and the universe are manifestations of something greater, then the fact of something being a "human construct" would fail to dismiss the claim. Much is often made of the idea that if something originates "within" ourselves, it must necessary disprove a "greater" source. But that is not the case if the greater source is within us. K.

Kirata -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 11:12:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: meatcleaver For if some conscious entity created the universe... But that's a straw man. I never said anything about some "entity" somewhere who (poof) "created" the Universe. Such tales are the stuff of religious myth, which is why I wondered (above) if some Atheists might be better called Areligionists. There is a line to walk here. K.

meatcleaver -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 11:13:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata Actually, many of our perceptions and preferences appear to be hard-wired, despite the conceit that our cultures "invented" them. But leaving that aside, if we and the universe are manifestations of something greater, then the fact of something being a "human construct" would fail to dismiss the claim. Much is often made of the idea that if something originates "within" ourselves, it must necessary disprove a "greater" source. But that is not the case if the greater source is within us. K. There are many interesting philosophical lines to pursue but faiths tend to believe there is a consciousness that supernaturally interjects on the behalf of humans or at least believers and it is that sort of being that is invoked when such discussions as these take place. I would have no problem with a creator being an integral part of the universe and does not break its rules on behalf of some people who believe they know what that creator wants and plans. Until such a consciousness is proved, I prefer to be with the scientists scratching around in the dark for any proof we can find to add to our knowledge of the universe.

Aswad -> RE: Any atheists here? (11/16/2008 11:19:08 AM)
Tal Kirata, Less adherence to- and abuse of- labels would certainly be good. In my experience, the average atheist is simply an average believer, following a different religion. An enlightened atheist is as rare as an enlightened religious person, and I'm sure the evidence will be right along soon after I post this. From what I've read in the past, I suspect I'm preaching to the choir boy, though. [:D] Health, al-Aswad.

Page: << < prev 1 2 [3] 4 5 next > >>

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

4.492188E-02